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Thread: carbon filter????

  1. #1
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    Default carbon filter????

    ok i have a penguin biowheel filter system. its a carbon filter and it has that special wheel thingy and i bet you guys know what it is so ill continue. i heard carbon filters are bad but the guy that got me into discus a few years ago had the same kind of filter and his tank was spectacular and his discus where. and he only did a weekly 40% water change. so why do people tell us all this stuff?

  2. #2
    Registered Member RyanH's Avatar
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    Default Re:carbon filter????

    The problem with carbon is that if it is left in the filter for too long then all of the impurities that it removes from the water are "dumped" right back in. The exact time that this occurs is difficult to predict and will often vary depending on the quality of the carbon used. IMO replacing your carbon is an unnecessary expense (and it IS expensive) and just one more thing to have to remember to do. You are better off filling the space in your filter with sponges for biological filtration and doing regular water changes. Keep the carbon around just in case you need to remove medications.

    hth!!
    -Ryan

  3. #3
    Registered Member Cosmo's Avatar
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    Default Re:carbon filter????

    Rhinoboy,

    Carbon removes impurities, different types of carbon do it better than others. In theory good carbon can maintain water quality and increase the time between wc/s, but, Like Ryan says , once it's saturated it starts leaching bad things back into the water, and there's no way of knowing when that starts to happen. Only way to be safe is to change the carbon often, which can get pretty expensive, Especially when you're buying specialty filters like your box requires... and.. you're not getting that much carbon to begin with.

    You're getting biological filtration from the bio wheel thingys, but you can't get too much bio filtration and the sponge Ryan suggested will increase that.. just make sure you rinse your sponges regularly with dechlorinated water, but.. can you even fit a sponge in a penguin??

    As far as your friends tank? Discus can live in a wide variety of environments, just as people do... health, growth, longevity, etc are all effected by their environment too. This is not to say his fish aren't healthy and happy.. never seen them.. but they're probably not living up to their full potential either...

    Like if you were a non smoker and had to live in a room with 3 smokers... you wouldn't die right away, but you sure wouldn't be all that healthy and happy

    Jim




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    Default Re:carbon filter????

    Hi Rhinoboy

    I also run a penguin/biowheel, I use filter floss, and cut the large aquaclear sponges to fit....I also use a prefilter on the intake, prefilter rinsed in tank water(WC) daily and once a week change the floss and rinse the sponges..works great! And a lot less $$. The only time I use carbon, is to remove meds.

    Brenda

  5. #5
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    Default Re:carbon filter????

    ok i said it before. i have the same setup he had and he had the best fish i have everseen. discus are hard to keep. but are you poeple over doing it?????

  6. #6
    Registered Member RyanH's Avatar
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    Default Re:carbon filter????

    Rhinoboy,

    Advice can be taken or left. It's your tank. You can do whatever you want with it. If you want to use carbon then do so. If it works for you then great. If not then try something else. It has been my experience that frequent water changes will give you a better chance for success than relying on carbon. But you have to do what you think is best.

    Also, your friend may be an experienced fishkeeper that knows how to be successful using different techniques and has a good grasp on water chemistry. If that's the case then pick his brain. Maybe he has a secret or two that he'll let you in on. What you've seen here are just a couple of opinions.

    BTW, Discus are not hard to keep. They just require specific water conditions.... and regular attention.

    good luck!
    -Ryan

  7. #7
    Registered Member Carol_Roberts's Avatar
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    Default Re:carbon filter????

    . . . . or maybe you need to compare his fish to the ones at my house

  8. #8
    Registered Member Ax's Avatar
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    Default Re:carbon filter????

    Why don't you do the test. (It is not noticeable on adult Discus but on young 3 to 4 month old.) two tanks - one month. In one Tank do same as in your friend's tank. The other do a daily 25-40% WC. Same food, same portions. Tank for the test BB.
    One of the Pet store owners tolled me that daily WC is to much and ones a week is all he does. I did the test. His tank and my, it has been a month now. My fish looks healthier and almost an inch bigger. If you do it let me know your results. .
    Let me know your results.

  9. #9
    Registered Member JeffreyRichard's Avatar
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    Default Re:carbon filter????

    The facts about carbon given here are absolute ... once carbon has exhausted it's capacity to absorb impurities it WILL leach these back into the tank. That's why I only recommend using carbon for specific short-term applications.

    A 40% weekly water change on a discus tank with a light bioload (mucho tank and only a few fish) is more than adaquate to raise and keep some very nice discus. You'd need to present more facts about the tank in question before folks can assess and accurately comment.

    However, the spirit of your comment about (interpreting a bit) the amount of maintenance (water changes) is a good question ... there are those who advocate max number of changes, and those like me who have had success with less maintenance. It does depend on the bioload of your tank, the quanity of food, the quality of water. So the answer is IT DEPENDS.

    Sorry I couldn't be more accurate

  10. #10
    Registered Member Cosmo's Avatar
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    Default Re:carbon filter????

    Good Points Jeffrey,

    Rhinoboy.. if you're going to go with carbon, might I suggest you try Cheim-Pure instead? It's a mix of hi quality carbon and ion exchange resins... does a much better job than straight carbon and lasts longer before it starts leaching. The mfg say's it's good for 3 t 6 months (as I remember).. change it monthly.. regular carbon.. change weekly

    Years ago I had an almost identical setup and wc regime as your friend.. my Discus grew to full size, ate well, look good etc, but.. I was constantly fighting diseases and hole in the head was not uncommon..

    The test sounds like your best bet..
    Jim

  11. #11
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    Default Re:carbon filter????

    Rhinoboy,

    You are blessed having the people on Simplydiscus to fall back on. I wish I had more of their patience. I have been following the forum for 9 months now and many have written in like your self "I have a friend, LFS, etc who does this or recommends this easier way; why do you all make it so much work? Then latter they write back "Help me, my fish are dying!!!" Simplydiscus people don't say you wouldn't follow my advise before, go back to the person you chose to listen to, no instead they instantly come to your aid.

  12. #12
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    Default Re:carbon filter????

    I use only biowheel filters. No other filter can cycle a tank as quickly as a biowheel. The Emperor 280 and 400 series are better than the 300 because they are setup with a plastic insert that you can put some floss into and not have to spend about $2 for filter replacements. They also will re-start without being primed much better than the 300's.
    Regarding carbon. Most of us are aware that when carbon becomes saturated it releases the impurities back into the water but's that's that not the most important reason NOT to use carbon. I believe passing water thru carbon is a good thing but too much of a good thing becomes a bad thing. Continually recirculating your water thru a carbon filter is suspected of causing problems and most serious Discus keepers don't use carbon in their tank filters. Many of them do use carbon filtration modules to filter their tap water before doing a water change. Carbon filtration is great for removing medications and contamination from tank water. If my fish appear listless or stressed, my first course of action is to use carbon filtration for about two days to purify the water.
    In tanks that have Penguin Biowheels, I buy the Aqua Clear replacement filters (at Walmart) which fit perfectly and are much cheaper. It' a pain in the *** to use a box cutter to open up the back of the filter pad and remove the carbon but in my opinion, it should be removed.

  13. #13
    Registered Member Ardan's Avatar
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    Default Re:carbon filter????

    I used to use chemipure yrs ago with my discus. Some of the discus were nice.

    But with wc's daily I did away with all carbon and had better discus growth and health. Chemipure was expensive, why not save the money?

  14. #14
    Registered Member Cosmo's Avatar
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    Default Re:carbon filter????

    Good point Ardan..

    It ain't cheap.. but.. it's on sale now online ;D ;D ;D

    Seriously though..

    I use Chemi Pure in place of carbon for periodic use and for removing meds, and, it does seem to put a nice polish on the water.

    It like any other carbon should never be considered an acceptable replacement for daily wc's though when it comes to maintaining healthy Discus

    Jim

  15. #15
    Registered Member slicksta's Avatar
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    Default Re:carbon filter????

    I too am a big fan of chemipure.... I live it in for 4 months...it is a great polisher and I never had a problems....
    and that comes to about .30c a week... ;D

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