Planted Discus Tank

[Zeph]

Ok, Well. Ive been reading through the many articles of this site and the amount of people who oppose planted tanks. This, i am amazed at. Now I have never kept discus and i want to in a planted tank. I currently have a well established 55 gal planted tank AT HOME. Im not claiming to be a pro at all. Now I technically only have my 55 gal at home but at work I have several 125 gal. planted tanks with different fish. Please remember this is from MY OWN EXPERIANCE FROM KEEPING A PLANTED TANK!
The things i have noticed what people have done wrong when keeping a planted tanks is:
1. using gravel, I have used gravel in the past for a planted tank and it only led to disaster from methane buildup, couple years ago i have switched over to sand. I have never had problems since then.

2. The fish, I know alot of people like to keep a species only tank, in this case discus. This is fine but more work, IMO. I currently have Clown loaches and Geophagus tapajos, these 2 species alone stir up the substrate and clean up un eaten food. I will be trying these species with my discus once i get them. p.s. try to stay away from cories, they dont do a fraction of the amount of cleanup these guys do even if you have a large school plus they dont stir up the substrate.

3. Lighting, I have read on here that some people have had there discus hide do to high lighting. well theres a simple remedy for that, either get some tall growing plants ex. jungle val or a floating plant like the herpes of tanks, duckweed. This easily blocks out some light and in the long runs eats nutrients.

Now for this Im not sure what to title it, so yeh. Now i have ever vacuumed my sand bend ever, My plants and canister filters do it for me. I have never gotten detritus build up anywhere. I only do water changes. All my parameters have been at zero. HAVE NEVER LOST A FISH IN THIS TANK for over 2 years.

I have written an article on keeping plants on my societies forum, but since i cannot post it because i need to have posted 10 times on this site inorder to post a url. i will make an article on this site, if there is not one already.

[Zeph]

This is what i have learned SO FAR and wish to share with others.
This is the exact article i had written up a few months back to help new society members with planted tanks.

1. Roots.When buying New plants pay attention MOSTLY to there root structure NOT THERE LEAVES!!! The better the roots are the faster your plant will acclimate and start growing in your tank.

2. Leaf Shape. Most plants in the hobby are grown emersed(Grown out of water), Which means there leaves are most of the time a different shape. Most notably the amazon sword. When you first put them into your tank the plants leaves will start changing to there Immersed state(underwater.) Most people who are uneducated in this will either wonder what has happened or be repulsed by the new look and may try a different plant.

3. Their Water is NOT your water. All plants go through this, Your plant will melt away a little or alot, it just depends how drastic your tank chemistry is compared to the sellers. This is where #1 comes in, the bigger the root system is better the chance your plant will survive and fly past this process.

4. know your lighting! most plants desire different types of lighting. From low to high.

5. Propagation. Some plant species reproduce asexually or also called Rhizomes, ex. java fern. If a leaf breaks off dont throw it away, let it float around, eventually roots will start to grow out of the leaf. You can cut the rhizome up and it will start to grow there roots. Some grow from cuttings where you cut a leaf and stick it in the substrate, Most bunch plants grow like this. Runners, Many plants grow like this. There are other ways like Adventitous plants and seeds.

6. Tank mates, this is a particularly touchy matter. For i have kept plants very successfully with African cichlids. This is dependent on what research the buyer does on both plants and his fish. But note all fish are not same just like us humans. There behavior is most of the times different from fish to fish in the same species.

7. Know your Ph, Kh and Dh. Most plants can survive most of the wide ranges in these. But some plants are very sensitive and die very quickly to dangerous fluctuations in these.

8. Substrate, yet another touchy matter. Its recommended to have a dirted tank but not necessary. If you have a well established tank the plants will survive very well and consume the waste that is buried in the substrate. which in turn removes the use of vacuuming(for the most part.) If you wish to do a dirted tank and dont want to spend too much $$$, do not buy the bags of dirt found at your local fish stores, they are overpriced and have the same thing a 50lb bag has at homedepot or menards and buy an ORGANIC bag of dirt with NO FERTILIZERS.


9. CO2 systems. These are NOT required but are quite beneficial to the plants.

10. Placement of Plants. Know the type of plant your buying is it a foreground, mid-ground or a background plant?

11. More plants the better. If you have more plants, the less damage a fish can do to your plants because the damage will be spread out evenly to your plants. Which for the most part would be un-noticeable.

12. Transplanting from pot to substrate. If the plant you bought was in a pot, you can leave it in the pot or take it out. I recommend to take it out after purchase because the longer you keep it in the pot the roots will grow and wind it self into and through the cottony padding and eventually grow out of the pot(if its the common plastic "pots") that plants are usually kept in at stores. If you decide to take it out after this you will end up destroying the roots and potentially compromising your plant to start to die away.

13. Trimming roots?!?!?! Some people decide to trim the roots when taking plants out of pots after purchase. This is the WORST thing you can do. NEVER EVER, trim roots after purchase. People think this helps promote new growth when it DOESN'T. If you trim the roots you are crippling your plant, they need roots to store energy, gain minerals and vitamins. When you do this, it almost stops the growth of your plant because it needs those energy reserves, minerals and vitamins to grow new roots and leaves. You can do this after the plant has BEEN established. So it could mean between 6 months and a year. But seriously there is NO need to ever trim roots. Trimming leaves is fine. Just think of it like this, you have a baby and you want it to grow up but you only give it water. It needs food to grow. Not just water!

14. Trimming Leaves.Only Trim leaves if your plants are growing leaves.

15. Ascetic tip, Always buy an odd amount of plants never even. Its ascetically more pleasing and looks more realistic.

16. Fertilization, I for one have never bothered with these and in my opinion there just a waste of money. If you have enough fish, they should produce a good amount of waste for the plants to feed on.Because macro nutrients are usually brought in from fish food, an all round fertilizer will not be recommended instead use trace element fertilizers which are prepared for aquatic plants. Never overdose because it will harm both plants and your fish. Never purchase a fertilizer that contains phosphate or nitrate. It will cause horrible algae problems.You can get fertilizers in liquid or pellet form. UPDATE: I have started to use Seachem excel holy cow, the growth is amazing.

17. Patience, all you need is patience. If you dont have patience, I seriously recommend a different hobby because that's the main part of this hobby.

18. Hitchhikers on plants. When buying plants, sometimes you get more than you bargained for, as in snails. I strongly recommend using clown or puffer loaches to rid them. But you can also use chemical methods. You can use Potassium Permangante for snails, Bleach for algae, and Alum for unwanted or dangerous Microbes. These three chemicals require specific procedures. Please lookup the proper steps for treatment.

19. Natural CO2 and Water Turbulence. Try to have hardly to zero surface turbulence to help retain naturally produced CO2 from your fish. The more CO2 that is in your tank the better your plants will grow. By adjusting your bubbler in your tank you can help retain more CO2 and your plants will grow faster. But be warned treading in this territory can potentionally kill your fish!!!

20. PLANTS TO AVOID. Like every hobby theres scammers. Most chain pet stores sell these plants and claim there aquatic when there not. These plants dont grow for long underwater and end up polutting the tank. I have fallen for 1 of these plants before. Here is the most common, Aglaonema, Brazilian sword, cherry hedge, Draceana(princess pine), Green hedge, modo grass and "palms."

21. Why Should I have them? There is literally NO downside to have live plants in your aquaria. They help keep your tank clean, help rid the tank of algae and just lower the amount of maintenance a person needs to do. The only downside i can see from plants is there price.

22. Dirt/gravel and other Ratio's. If your planning to to have a dirted tank, Have 1-2 inches of dirt and 1-2 inchs of gravel. This is recommend so dirt is not constantly stirred up by aquascaping or from passing by fish. If you want an epic planted tank that will have huge growth, Follow this setup. at the very beginning place cutted up pieces of clay in a grid pattern about 1-2 inches apart. Then put about 1 inch of dirt, then 1 inch of peat moss, OPTIONAL put .5 or less inchs of sand and then 1-2 inchs of gravel. This layering is the most efficient and best ways for extreme growth.

23. Pleco's. There are some species of pleco's that may or may not hurt your plants. The best, that i can recommend is Bristlenose Pleco's. I also have a sailfin pleco but have not witnessed him eating any of my plants that i know off. But still this is where tip #6 comes in.

[pastry]

Zeph, sounds like you're well-rounded and have a plan. The only thing I'm scratching my head for is why use a 55 when you have bigger tanks? I know that it's not easy to move tanks like 125's but just curious. What size discus are you starting off with? How many? Just asking because you sound like you're going to have tankmates with them (which I like having tankmates with mine) but in a 55 gallon, with substrate, plants, maybe or maybe not wood included, then you'll probably only have about 45-48 gallons of actual water. Now, many on here try to use a rule of thumb of no less than 10 gallons of water per adult fish and so before tankmates you'll already be at 4-5 adult fish. I've broken the heck out of that rule in the past and was fine with it but now-a-day I tend to stick to that. Now, more people will say that a group no smaller than 7 discus is what you should aim for... I've kept less and have been fine but I will say that I think my groups over the years did do better at that number.... so, 7 would be a lot on your bioload without even having tankmates.

My ending note: Grab one of those 125's!!! You'll love it!

Regardless whether you stick to your original plan or not, please post pics when you get it going! Good luck!

ps--thanks for some of the info you posted. good stuff!

[Zeph]

As much as i would love to use those 125's. I cant. I would then need to rehome 18 boesmani rainbows, 3 millenium rainbows, giant school of 50 serpae tetra's, 12 red laser cory cats, plus a couple other odds and ends. But the actual reason that i cant use them is because those tanks are prototype 125's and we use a lot of experimental filters, sumps and lights. Now I do know of the rule ive had over 32 adult african cichlids in that 55 years ago( that was before i new anything) but none the less no one died. I will be trying to get atleast 6 discus in there, because for the reasons you stated. but IMO a 55 is a good start for discus because there more tall than wide fish. I will be upgrading to a 75 in the summer.

[Elliots]

I am not an expert on this subject. You suggest cutting down water turbulence to preserve CO2 for the plants. I do not know if that is a good idea with Discus and a large bioload of fish. they want oxygen. My plants are doing great in sand. I use Seachem Flourish and I also use root fertilizer tabs. Do you use them/

[Zeph]

I cannot say i recommend it for discus but when i wrote this several months ago i just had a normal planted tank and it seemed to be working. And yes I have now started to use Seachem excel flourish and root tabs and love it, as i stated as an "update" on that part. Ive had my plants pearling and they supplied most of the air, but i still used an air stone. I no longer do this because im keeping more expensive fish i.e. school of clown loaches, denison barbs and Geo. Tapajos.

But yes cutting down the turbulence helps a ton, still use an airstone though. Just use one or the other never both if you have plants.