My Moon Dragon Flowerhorn Project. Just got about 600 wigglers from this pair.

[Bilbo]

Just got about 600 wigglers.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=smtTPDgKsjg&feature=youtu.be

[Discus-n00b]

What happened to the days of all these hybrids being sterile....guess we aren't as lucky anymore lol. Not personally a fan but wow, the eggs are everywhere.

[cjr8420]

ok now i get u hybrid guy lol

[Ryan]

Matt, Central American cichlids can all freely hybridize with one another. This is unlike South American cichlids (except for festae, which are closely related to Central American cichlids). This is why you see so many hybrids of Central Americans.

[DLock3d]

Congrats but not my flavor.

[Bilbo]

What happened to the days of all these hybrids being sterile....guess we aren't as lucky anymore lol. Not personally a fan but wow, the eggs are everywhere.

Certain strains of flowerhorn are sterile. Most Kamfa males are either sterile or take 2-3 years to mature. An easy way to remember it is a Trimac based male will be fertile while almost all females are fertile no matter what strain. So typically a person will breed a trimac based fish aka Zhen Zhu to a Zhen Zhu based female or a kamfa female. What i did in the video is one way you create kamfa. You breed a King Kong Parrot female to a Zhen Zhu male and you will get better looking flowerhorns as far as body and fin structure goes. The females will be fertile while the males will be sterile. So you then pick out the most colored up female and breed her back to dad to help lock in the pearl trait. The pair that i crossed in the video will throw a small percentage of highly colored/pearled fish. This is what i'm after with this pair.

[Bilbo]

Congrats but not my flavor. Thanks! Yeah i know most people here are not into flowerhorns. I'm in the minority here. This is a discus forum after all, lol. My brother isn't into flowerhorns either but is big into discus and rams. Me personally, i love flowerhorns. I am not close minded about fish keeping. My 3 favorite types of fish are Rams, Flowerhorns and discus. In that order too. The reason i love these 3 fish is because of the broad aspect of entertainment and satisfaction they bring to the table. Discus are my peaceful fish when i want to just chill and watch graceful art in motion. Rams are my comical spunky little bursts of color that i love to watch when i want to be entertained and Flowerhorns are my big wet pets. Flowerhorns are the most intelligent of the 3, by far, from my experience and they are by FAR the most interacive of the 3. Mine are never afraid of my hand and they actually come to my hand if i stick it in the tank. They want and crave interaction. The only time i don't like sticking my hands in the tank is when they are spawning, lol. I love me a big beautiful flowerhorn that loves my company. They are colorful and very tenacious. They are 'THE' wet pet as far as i'm concerned and i love their agressive behavior that screams " I LOVE LIFE!"
These are the 3 loves of my aquarium hobby. I enjoy them all emensely. I feel blessed to be able to find enjoyment and satisfaction in several different types of fish. I'm like this in other aspects of my life as well. Another is music. I love lots of different types of music. It would suck if i had to listen to one type all the time, lol.

[redlionvjx]

Awesome and congrats. I've bred red Texas and have had a few fh's. nice to see something familiar here

[redlionvjx]

Any update on these guys?

[Bilbo]

Any update on these guys? Yes. I just had my first culling today matter of fact. I wish i knew how to post pictures on this forum but i do not. I will just paste a link again.

http://flowerhornrusforum.com/topic/8797796/1/#new

[sandy]

Not seen so many eggs in one time do they lays so many eggs


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[Bilbo]

Not seen so many eggs in one time do they lays so many eggs


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Yes, many of the big SA and CA cichlids can lay upwards of 2 thousand eggs in one spawning. It is no different for flowerhorns and King Kong parrots as they derive from trimacs, midas, viejas, etc.. Basically with flowerhorns, though, you need the big numbers because most of the fry in a spawn are not what the breeder is looking for so heavy culling is involved. Where as a good discus spawn may only contain 100-300 fry, the breeder is able to market a higher percentage of that spawn compared to a flowerhorn spawn which though may have 1000-2000 eggs, the breeder will likely only get about 2% of that spawn to market. It's just the nature of the beast.

The title of this thread says 600 fry but my count was off, lol. I ended up having about 900-1000.

[PP_GBR]

I love my flowerhorn too. He is the hardiest fish I've ever had. He does not need but but one meal a day and weekly WC.

[Bilbo]

I have some nice pics to share soon.

[dadecountyalan]

please post them!

[alexthegreat]

Most definitely this batch will be about 3/4 faders. i've notice most of the time i breed fhs. The females genes are more of a higher chance of what the frys will be.
Imo, instead of breeding a female from that batch with the dad, find another male with bigger kok and pearls around the head, the frys will turn out to be your masterpieces.
good luck with them. Dealt with the same amount of frys before and so much $$$ went to food. ;P

[Bilbo]

Thanks for the posts guys. I love flowerhorns very much. My goal is to create a strain with all of the desired aspects of a quality flower horn. Color intensity and contrast, thick square bodies, pearls throughout body and across the head, wrapped tail and ofcourse head. This spawn in this thread is one of many from this pair and I am no longer using the male in my breeding program. A lot of people think that a super flowerhorn is created through breeding two high quality horns together and you get the same quality fish. This is rarely true. It takes about 3 generations to get the kind of fish i'm after. This is why I have fry from 4 different sets of parents and am in the process of cross breeding them. It has taken me a long time to even get to this point but my patience seems to be paying off. Right now I have full body red fry with full body pearls and wrapped fins. And some fry already developing head. I think one of the worst mistakes people make when breeding flowerhorns is going for the head gene immediately while sacrificing color and pearl intensity. Flowerhorns have been bred for two decades now. All carry head gene. You just need the numbers to be able to get some fry with big head. That's why I have chosen breeders who come from stock with color and pearls and wrapped finnage. Wrapped fins are the hardest to get out of all the desired traits. Atm I am on my phone. When I get home I will snap some shots of a few fry to show off their progress. I have bred flowerhorns for years but it is only now that I have had the success that I have been having lately. I have found out that I have had to think outside the lines of traditional breeding methods to get where i'm at right now.

[PP_GBR]

Bibo

Love to see your fish. How do you keep up with that many FH? I have one fader bought from Petco for $12 and he is growing out nicely except for his scared face. I'm just curious if it's from fighting. What do you think?

[Bilbo]

Btw, only 2% of this spawn faded.

[Bilbo]

Here are a few of my fry. They are 2 inches. Flowerhorns are kind of like discus in regards to their color development. Whatever you see at this small size will intensify drastically until they are about a year old.

[Bilbo]

A few more.

[Trier20]

If you shipped I might pick some of these up as I just started out with flowerhorns. They are fun fish for sure.

[Bilbo]

I have shipped many times. But unfortunately these are not for sale. These fry are my breeder grow outs. The next generation is going to be much better anyway. If you would like to stay in touch, I would gladly hook you up next generation. It will be the completion of my Moon Dragon strain. You will need to prepare a tank for a BIG wet pet, though! LOL. These fish do great by themselves in a big rock display with the guests walking through the living room and saying "Wow!! What kind of fish is that!!" This is my goal. There are no main stream breeders of flowerhorns in the USA that offer consistant quality fish. I am trying to be the first.

[Trier20]

I have shipped many times. But unfortunately these are not for sale. These fry are my breeder grow outs. The next generation is going to be much better anyway. If you would like to stay in touch, I would gladly hook you up next generation. It will be the completion of my Moon Dragon strain. You will need to prepare a tank for a BIG wet pet, though! LOL. These fish do great by themselves in a big rock display with the guests walking through the living room and saying "Wow!! What kind of fish is that!!" This is my goal. There are no main stream breeders of flowerhorns in the USA that offer consistant quality fish. I am trying to be the first.

That's a great goal.
http://i1051.photobucket.com/albums/s422/trier20/null_zpsddcd6182.jpg (http://s1051.photobucket.com/user/trier20/media/null_zpsddcd6182.jpg.html)
there is mine for an idea of what I have. It's obviously about 2-3 inches larger now and more colorful. Very similar to your male. I have no idea what strain it is as the only thing I know about them is that I have one in my basement. LOL They are very personable though!

[Bilbo]

That's a great goal.
http://i1051.photobucket.com/albums/s422/trier20/null_zpsddcd6182.jpg (http://s1051.photobucket.com/user/trier20/media/null_zpsddcd6182.jpg.html)
there is mine for an idea of what I have. It's obviously about 2-3 inches larger now and more colorful. Very similar to your male. I have no idea what strain it is as the only thing I know about them is that I have one in my basement. LOL They are very personable though! Cool beans! Yours is a standard zz strain. My male in this thread is a Platinum. I have had different males in my breeding program. Red Dragon, Silk and SRT males as well.

[Bilbo]

Bibo

Love to see your fish. How do you keep up with that many FH? I have one fader bought from Petco for $12 and he is growing out nicely except for his scared face. I'm just curious if it's from fighting. What do you think? Most likely his scarred face is either from a vicious fight or a disease. Most flowerhorns heal 100% from fights though.
As far as so many fry... cull, cull and cull again. I end up keeping about 2% of a spawn.

[Trier20]

Cool beans! Yours is a standard zz strain. My male in this thread is a Platinum. I have had different males in my breeding program. Red Dragon, Silk and SRT males as well.

Once again good luck and keep us updated. It will be interesting to see how your strain progresses.

[Bilbo]

Awesome and congrats. I've bred red Texas and have had a few fh's. nice to see something familiar here Thank you very much! And do you have any pictures of your Red Texas breedings? I have Red Texas blood in my line of Moon Dragons.

[Bilbo]

I love my flowerhorn too. He is the hardiest fish I've ever had. He does not need but but one meal a day and weekly WC. Flowerhorns are definitely fun!

[Bilbo]

Once again good luck and keep us updated. It will be interesting to see how your strain progresses. Thanks! And will stay updated.

[alexthegreat]

If you shipped I might pick some of these up as I just started out with flowerhorns. They are fun fish for sure.

If you're interested in a few months, i have some Mps RTxGT growing out. let me know if you're interested.

[alexthegreat]

In those frys/juvies, i think what will make them better is thicker pearls and bigger kok. Most people aren't usually interested in FHs if the kok is little.
Also not all faders fade right away, there will be some that are called late faders, and you probably culled most of the faders. ;/ They're the best.

[Bilbo]

In those frys/juvies, i think what will make them better is thicker pearls and bigger kok. Most people aren't usually interested in FHs if the kok is little.
Also not all faders fade right away, there will be some that are called late faders, and you probably culled most of the faders. ;/ They're the best. Some fry fade late, some early. I am not interested in faders as my source that is going to be buying from me will be buying nonfaded fish. Which is "better" is totally up to the eye of the beholder. I like non faders a lot better. Although my daughter has a red Moon Dragon that's going through the fading process right now.
My buyer is a large distributor in the U.S and is not interested in head. Only color and pearls as is most Americans. The color and pearls will go to people who are just interested in color. Ones with larger head with color and pearls will go to the mainstream flowerhorn hobbiest. I already have sold several fry to our local hobbiest here and many already have big head. A big head is easy to get with flowerhorns. You just need numbers. Then you go through and pick out the few that are showing head trait. It's simple. And like I said, I have found just the contrary. Most Americans are interested more in color anyway. Not head. I'll post some pics of fry that are already developing head once they are bigger. These guys are only 2 inches. They are just babies, lol. Most fry with head gene don't get a big head till later. The ones that do get them earlier are either exceptions to the rule or they are hormone fed. The latter is usually the case. Cheers!

[Bilbo]

If you're interested in a few months, i have some Mps RTxGT growing out. let me know if you're interested. Please don't hijack my thread. The PM button is your friend, lol.

[Bilbo]

Here is one of our 2 and a half inch fry that is already showing head trait. Keep in mind that the sponge behind him is the smallest on the market. Tiny. This guys head should be really big a year from now. His color and pearls should also be intense. I'm sorry for the out of focus picture. My smart phone will only take a clear photo if I can catch them standing still for about 2 solid seconds and flowerhorns are always on the go, go, go!

[alexthegreat]

Not to say anything, but i've seen better kok with a size of 2.5. But that is a good start. I've also seen frys like yours ending up with pretty nice kok at max size.
Good luck, Would like to see how these guys turn out in months.

[Bilbo]

I have seen super quality fry with a nice head start at 1 inch. I have seen fry with no head but them at a year the head exploded. Flowerhorns are like people in that they develope at different stages individually. Heck, I didn't even hit puberty until I was in high school where as some of my friends hit it in the 7 th grade. The fh I have bred are very good quality as they have color, pearls and some of them, even head. At this small size it simply indicates that, as adults, they are going to be beastly.

[Bilbo]

Here are a few more fry pics. The yellow one is almost done with her molting process. She will maintain this intense yellow. In fact, it will intensify as she ages.

[Bilbo]

Here are a few more shots. All fry within the last 8 months but most only 3-4 months of age. The first pic is of our metallic green.

[sandy]

They look nice


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[Bilbo]

Thank you!

[camuth8]

Beautiful!;)

[dadecountyalan]

Here are a few more fry pics. The yellow one is almost done with her molting process. She will maintain this intense yellow. In fact, it will intensify as she ages.

the fish in the second pic looks awesome, i would even buy that fish from you

[dadecountyalan]

in fact can i?

[Bilbo]

in fact can i?

I am very happy you like them but alas, everything I had for sell is already gone. I have many other flowerhorns as well but I am growing all of my youngsters out to choose breeders from them. Thanks.

[hillbillyamber]

If it swims with fins I love it! Thanks for sharing!

[disckaroo]

wow that little yellow one is a trip!!

[Bilbo]

Thank you. This is the beginning stages of my American strain I have been working on for the past year. Though I have bred Flowerhorns off and on for years, this is my second year of non stop, uninterrupted breeding. I am getting very close to my goal. However, once the goal is met I will work on fine tuning the strain. I just sold 2 big headed fry and they looked pretty rad. I should have posted some pics here before I sold them. The sale was a last minute decision as I needed to make some more room since my discus are spawning now.

[Bilbo]

Here are a few of my female juvies that should start showing some pairing activity in the next few months.

[Bilbo]

few more...

[PaulD]

Any update on your breeding project?
Very enjoy reading your post.