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bayouboy85
01-20-2014, 09:27 AM
http://i1345.photobucket.com/albums/p666/Bayouboy85/Mobile%20Uploads/9C050791-7A85-4327-9D98-D5BAD39A5327_zpsyhspyyxf.jpg (http://s1345.photobucket.com/user/Bayouboy85/media/Mobile%20Uploads/9C050791-7A85-4327-9D98-D5BAD39A5327_zpsyhspyyxf.jpg.html)
http://i1345.photobucket.com/albums/p666/Bayouboy85/Mobile%20Uploads/B4AD66AA-70D5-42FF-B327-2D9C33343101_zpskxm4mbrd.jpg (http://s1345.photobucket.com/user/Bayouboy85/media/Mobile%20Uploads/B4AD66AA-70D5-42FF-B327-2D9C33343101_zpskxm4mbrd.jpg.html)
http://i1345.photobucket.com/albums/p666/Bayouboy85/Mobile%20Uploads/075F389E-3BB9-4499-BC28-26A36BA81DB9_zpsv9wbv82v.jpg (http://s1345.photobucket.com/user/Bayouboy85/media/Mobile%20Uploads/075F389E-3BB9-4499-BC28-26A36BA81DB9_zpsv9wbv82v.jpg.html)


My new blue diamond and red Marlboro and a new pigeon blood

SortSay2003
01-21-2014, 01:56 AM
Hi,

Nice set up. Your blue diamond looks really dark and seems to have a pattern? Maybe it's just the lighting or angle.

Good luck wiht your discus:)

John_Nicholson
01-21-2014, 10:13 AM
You do not have a blue diamond. Fish do not look happy but the best I can guess you probably have a blue snake skin, some sort of a turq, a marlboro( a type of pigeon blood also ) and a pigeon blood.

-john

brddthomas
01-21-2014, 04:06 PM
John

How can you tell that they are not happy ?

John_Nicholson
01-21-2014, 04:40 PM
Hard to explain but it comes from years of looking at happy/healthy discus. The ss is dark, none of them have their fins erect, the eyes are dull.

-john

Elliots
01-21-2014, 04:46 PM
John is correct but I always thought he knows by telepathy and fish mind reading. They are not all that bad, I have seen much worse on SD. With proper raising technique including proper large and frequent water changes along with frequent feedings with good food they shouild be OK.

bayouboy85
01-21-2014, 09:00 PM
That's as soon as they was put in the tank needless to say they just got done flying from Florida and them a two hour trip I'm a car I didn't get done until almost 1 am in the morning so of course they not going to look happy this site had a lot of negativity and that sad part it comes from the senior members you should in courage members not speak down on them as if your better than anyone else that keeps discus it's called trail and error

bayouboy85
01-21-2014, 09:04 PM
http://i1345.photobucket.com/albums/p666/Bayouboy85/Mobile%20Uploads/00861FD7-549A-4E36-8CB6-969C93AA302B_zpsgljn1ubk.jpg (http://s1345.photobucket.com/user/Bayouboy85/media/Mobile%20Uploads/00861FD7-549A-4E36-8CB6-969C93AA302B_zpsgljn1ubk.jpg.html) this is the blue diamond taken the night that I got them

bayouboy85
01-21-2014, 09:05 PM
They get fed three times a day and water change every other day 50%

bayouboy85
01-21-2014, 09:11 PM
John looks like u been on this site for a long time with us beginners should u be setting an example and not talk down to any ?? I would think so !!!! U should set an example and encourage people just member the white on top of chicken **** is also chicken **** so just when u think your better than anyone just member your no better than anyone so like I said Idc delete me remove me fine but set example and encourage people don't talk down to people I've heard a lot of bad things from this site and I pretty much got on here to find out and never failed everyone was right

timmy82
01-21-2014, 09:33 PM
Don't think John is trying to talk down he just says what he means with no rubbish involved.... They don't look good at all. Need to up the water changes they also look to have external issues too there are many contributing factors and a lot of different answers too. Up the water make sure the tanks is properly cycled so should have 0 ammonia and go from there water temp i would keep up around 86 - 88f. Start looking at the sticky's in the beginers section as there are a lot of answers their. If you don't have time and can't take others comments discus is going to be a very expensive hobby!

MSD
01-21-2014, 10:02 PM
John takes his time to gently let you know your fish look substandard so you kill the messenger? Take a hike, Mike.

William Palumbo
01-21-2014, 10:17 PM
Now that you're done stocking your tank...better stock your medicine cabinet for those sick things. The only people that speak badly about this site, are the ones who ask questions, that they already know the answers to, and don't want to hear the truth...Bill

Tazalanche
01-21-2014, 10:33 PM
http://i1345.photobucket.com/albums/p666/Bayouboy85/Mobile%20Uploads/00861FD7-549A-4E36-8CB6-969C93AA302B_zpsgljn1ubk.jpg (http://s1345.photobucket.com/user/Bayouboy85/media/Mobile%20Uploads/00861FD7-549A-4E36-8CB6-969C93AA302B_zpsgljn1ubk.jpg.html) this is the blue diamond taken the night that I got themBlue diamonds are solid blue discus with no stripes, bars, spots, rings or striations.
That blue discus has spots and striations.
That is not a blue diamond.

sholvey
01-21-2014, 10:40 PM
No QT?

Sent from my HTC One X using Tapatalk

Ryan
01-21-2014, 10:41 PM
John looks like u been on this site for a long time with us beginners should u be setting an example and not talk down to any ?? I would think so !!!! U should set an example and encourage people just member the white on top of chicken **** is also chicken **** so just when u think your better than anyone just member your no better than anyone so like I said Idc delete me remove me fine but set example and encourage people don't talk down to people I've heard a lot of bad things from this site and I pretty much got on here to find out and never failed everyone was right

Wait a second. No one is talking down to you. They are trying to educate you about your fish. Fish hobbyists should strive to keep healthy stock. You are responsible for the well-being of a living organism. They are at your mercy to provide them with the proper water, foods, and general care that they require to survive. Instead of lashing out, you should be asking questions: why do people say that about these fish, what do they see that I don't see, what can I learn from this experience? After all, are we not here to learn? I'm guessing that you don't have much experience with discus, considering you joined the site under a month ago and are posting in the Beginner section.

You also need to realize that for every person who posts here, dozens more lurk and read threads. A lot of those are newcomers to the discus hobby. It would be beneficial for those people to see what they are looking for in healthy discus vs. unhealthy discus, in an effort to save them the money and heartache of buying sickly fish and then losing them or spending tons of extra money trying to medicate them and save them.

I am sorry to say that your fish don't look healthy. That is not a reflection of you as a discus keeper. You obviously just got the fish and are not responsible for their condition. However, you have the power to improve their condition, and that is why we are pointing out the facts to you. Your two blue discus have dull eyes and dark colors, two signs that they are not well. Healthy discus should not have dull eyes even if they're recovering from shipping stress. Stress may wash out their colors temporarily but it won't dull their eyes to grey/black.

Also, you do not have a Blue Diamond discus in that tank. Blue Diamonds are a solid blue fish without striations, bars, or any other black markings on the body. As you see, both of your blues do. The fish with the fine lace-like striation is a blue snakeskin of some sort, and the other looks to be maybe one of the turquoise types (or maybe a cobalt, but I'm leaning more toward turquoise).

I get really sick and tired of hearing that people on this site are negative. It's incredibly frustrating when a new discus keeper logs on and tells someone who's been keeping discus for a decade or more that they're wrong. You may disagree with people on some things and that's fine, but there are also facts that cannot be disputed, like the fact that you don't have a Blue Diamond, for example.

The best thing you can do if you care about these fish and want them to survive is to read, read, read. They need to be in clean water which could go a long way in helping them regain some of their vitality, but it's also possible that they'll need worming or treatment for internal parasites (if the dull eyes don't clear up and look bright and red in the next week or so). You are also going to need to stay on top of keeping that gravel clean because gravel is very good at trapping uneaten food and feces, both of which will break down and foul your water. The number one enemy of discus is poor water quality. Unfortunately, it looks like the person you received these from didn't heed that warning because these fish have not been maintained well before they fell under your care.

Second Hand Pat
01-21-2014, 10:53 PM
Well said Ryan.

Elliots
01-21-2014, 10:59 PM
John is telling the truth, not talking down. Ryan is also correct. If you read SD enough you will have a better idea of what is considered good and bad. The fish appear to still be young, try to make them better. It is not hard to do but it does take time.

Aeon
01-22-2014, 01:07 AM
hey, I did feel quite frustrated when I started on this site. And I know it feels sometimes as though people on here can't open their minds to other ways of discus raising, but you gotta realize it's what's worked for them for years or maybe even decades. Now it doesn't mean that you have to do things exactly the way they tell you to. In the end no one on any forum can control what you do with your fish and your tank. What you should do is listen and take in account everything that is said and decide how much of it you choose to follow, and how much of a risk you're willing to take by doing it your own way anyways. What you shouldn't do is attack other members, they're all really trying to help even though you feel as though they're discouraging you.

bayouboy85
01-22-2014, 08:55 AM
need to say i understand everyones point im not a rookie in keeping fish i been all my life anyways besides the point what u fail to understand is if you would pull your head out your tail end you would realize they just got shipped to the airport then it was a two hour trip to get them and a two hour trip back home need less no fish will be happy they were stressed out to the max hints why they looked dark color and unhappy now if im speaking too fast let me kno i can speak slowly for some of u that cant comprehend !!!???!!!!

bayouboy85
01-22-2014, 08:58 AM
the person i got them from is called segrestfarms wholesaler

bayouboy85
01-22-2014, 09:08 AM
ok lets put all of this behind us if they need worming how should i go about doing such a thing ?? i apologize for my actions

John_Nicholson
01-22-2014, 09:39 AM
Well that was fun. I am not trying to be a ***. First nearly everyone in this thread has had fish shipped in and several of us have also shipped fish out. Shipping will not make healthy, quality fish look that way. Segrest is a wholesaler of cheap fish. No one is throwing rocks at you. If you bought a blue diamond then demand your money back. You did not get one. Since fish are living creatures there is not such thing as perfection but there is a thing called quality. Your fish do not have that. They are not overly healthy ( but they can probably recover ), they are football shaped ( might get a little better but will probably never be great ), and apparently are not the color strain that you expected. Like I said before I am not throwing rocks at you. You just got the fish and you are extremely green when it comes to discus. Everything offered up to you was meant to help you and to help your fish. If you are looking for a site that is going to tell you how great your fish are as they slowing get worse and die then this is not the one for you. If you want a site that is going to help you succeed with discus then this is one of them that can really help.

As far as I am concerned we can write this off to a misunderstanding and start over.

When I saw your name my first thought is where are you located? LA?

-john

bayouboy85
01-22-2014, 10:16 AM
Yes the great town of Pierre part la

John_Nicholson
01-22-2014, 10:21 AM
I use to raise catahoula dogs. I did it for 25+ years. I caught lots of wild hogs and cattle. I use to go to shows in Denham Springs twice a year. I have several cajun friends.

-john

bayouboy85
01-22-2014, 10:38 AM
Gotcha so I'm thinking maybe it's just poor quality fish I'm guessing I paid 30 bucks a piece so I wasn't complaining about the price maybe someone has some good strains I could order from

John_Nicholson
01-22-2014, 10:58 AM
The fish are fine for what they are. Everyone starts somewhere. I would suggest using them as a discus learning experience. You are probably around 5 hours from Austin. I hope you will consider coming over to the NADA show in June. It is a great place to meet people and a way to learn lots of stuff about discus. A few days spent there will accelerate you discus knowledge a tremendous amount. It is kind of like the first time someone goes to a cattle show...for the most part they all pretty much look alike, but after going to several you can start to see the what makes one better than the others.

Good luck.

-john

bayouboy85
01-22-2014, 11:09 AM
Oh I use to judge cattle in school lol hahaha they do not look all the same ok cause I was just going to whipe out my tank and thought about ordering 5 of tony Hans discus can get a 5 pack for a 100 bucks plus shipping I'm running a fluval 306 on my 50 gallon I'm going to go pick up another one Friday night maybe they will help the water quality a lot better having triple my filtration I would have enough filtration for a 140 gallons

John_Nicholson
01-22-2014, 11:38 AM
Good fish are like good cattle....sometimes you can get them cheap but most of the time you get what you pay for. The only way I know to get quality fish for cheap is if you get lucky and have a local discus hobbyist that raises a batch or two. I do not know of one in your neck of the woods though.

-john

bayouboy85
01-22-2014, 11:46 AM
What about tony Hans discus ??? Anyone have any luck with him

wolfel
01-22-2014, 11:47 AM
I understand that you hope to get encouragement but I do believe the people here are very kind and tell you the truth so that you can improve. That is very very valuable because if people didn't tell you the truth but simply praise your fish looking gorgeous, this will not be helpful for you at all.

I am also new to discus so I just share with you my experience. Yesterday morning I got fish from Kenny from California, a 18 hours trip, and then Fedex delivered it to me. They didn't look anything like this when they first got into tank

A month ago I bought two blue juvenile discus from LFS and threw them into my planted tank without much knowledge about how to keep discus. It is a 10 minutes drive from my home so not much stress in shipment I think. But I did see exactly the same as you showed. One of them had a clamped fin and the other one very dark. They remained like these for 1 week until I moved them to a BB tank with clear new water. I suspect in your tank the nitrate level should be very very high (which is not unusual for many planted tank). So I think you may want to test your water.

I do believe they will look a lot better once you get your water work correct, because that happened to me.

bayouboy85
01-22-2014, 12:06 PM
actually young grass hopper yet again u dont kno me my nitrates was tested before i left this morning all my levels r 0 what u fail to realize it most plants feed off nitrates and keep them low my nitrates stay low no more than 10 so my water is in check

wolfel
01-22-2014, 12:20 PM
On one hand plants absorb nitrate on the other hand substrates sucks a too much waste. Last time when I cleaned up my planted tank I saw grey water when I cleaned substrate.

It's good to see your water is in pristine condition. I am sure your fish will look gorgeous in a second. As a new grass I had better shut up and disappear.

Good luck!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Second Hand Pat
01-22-2014, 12:27 PM
The water is more then the nitrates, especially with discus.

PP_GBR
01-22-2014, 01:13 PM
As days go by you will know and see what a happy discus looks like. Good luck with your new arrivals.

brddthomas
01-22-2014, 01:38 PM
Wow, John-- I apologize.. I did not intend to start an arguement. I am new to discus and wanted John's opinion on what happy discus look like.

I do not think he was talking down to the OP. If/when I post pictures. I will except all crticism good or bad.

John_Nicholson
01-22-2014, 01:40 PM
Wow, John-- I apologize.. I did not intend to start an arguement. I am new to discus and wanted John's opinion on what happy discus look like.

I do not think he was talking down to the OP. If/when I post pictures. I will except all crticism good or bad.

Its all good. No harm, no foul.

-john

pastry
01-22-2014, 03:21 PM
What the hell is going on? There's not supposed to be any drama without me! Ha haa... kidding. bayou, you're in good hands with John. and i'm not saying to take everything you know about fish and throw it out the window but I will say you'll see that the more fresh water you put into them, the happier they'll be (and it's definitely more than any other fresh water fish I've experienced). good luck and stay with it bud

brewmaster15
01-22-2014, 07:36 PM
Wait a second. No one is talking down to you. They are trying to educate you about your fish. Fish hobbyists should strive to keep healthy stock. You are responsible for the well-being of a living organism. They are at your mercy to provide them with the proper water, foods, and general care that they require to survive. Instead of lashing out, you should be asking questions: why do people say that about these fish, what do they see that I don't see, what can I learn from this experience? After all, are we not here to learn? I'm guessing that you don't have much experience with discus, considering you joined the site under a month ago and are posting in the Beginner section.

You also need to realize that for every person who posts here, dozens more lurk and read threads. A lot of those are newcomers to the discus hobby. It would be beneficial for those people to see what they are looking for in healthy discus vs. unhealthy discus, in an effort to save them the money and heartache of buying sickly fish and then losing them or spending tons of extra money trying to medicate them and save them.

I am sorry to say that your fish don't look healthy. That is not a reflection of you as a discus keeper. You obviously just got the fish and are not responsible for their condition. However, you have the power to improve their condition, and that is why we are pointing out the facts to you. Your two blue discus have dull eyes and dark colors, two signs that they are not well. Healthy discus should not have dull eyes even if they're recovering from shipping stress. Stress may wash out their colors temporarily but it won't dull their eyes to grey/black.

Also, you do not have a Blue Diamond discus in that tank. Blue Diamonds are a solid blue fish without striations, bars, or any other black markings on the body. As you see, both of your blues do. The fish with the fine lace-like striation is a blue snakeskin of some sort, and the other looks to be maybe one of the turquoise types (or maybe a cobalt, but I'm leaning more toward turquoise).

I get really sick and tired of hearing that people on this site are negative. It's incredibly frustrating when a new discus keeper logs on and tells someone who's been keeping discus for a decade or more that they're wrong. You may disagree with people on some things and that's fine, but there are also facts that cannot be disputed, like the fact that you don't have a Blue Diamond, for example.

The best thing you can do if you care about these fish and want them to survive is to read, read, read. They need to be in clean water which could go a long way in helping them regain some of their vitality, but it's also possible that they'll need worming or treatment for internal parasites (if the dull eyes don't clear up and look bright and red in the next week or so). You are also going to need to stay on top of keeping that gravel clean because gravel is very good at trapping uneaten food and feces, both of which will break down and foul your water. The number one enemy of discus is poor water quality. Unfortunately, it looks like the person you received these from didn't heed that warning because these fish have not been maintained well before they fell under your care.

Agree 100% with everything Ryan Said.... I'll go one step further as well.. If you want to succeed at Discus... take this piece of info..
I've heard a lot of bad things from this site and I pretty much got on here to find out and never failed everyone was right and Throw it out the window... This site has a proven track record and firm following of people that Know Discus and Know how to keep them, bred them, and have something to be proud of. The few critics out there usually have an axe to grind with someone here, or they did not want to listen to the vast experience set this forum's member have to offer. If you honestly want to succeed at keeping discus you will not find a better resource than SimplyDiscus. Admittedly I am biased:bandana:...but I know after 12 years just what our members are capable of. I have seen many new hobbyists rise to success by listening to time tested advice, and I have seen some "fail epically" when they think they know whats best or keep their fish in sub optimal conditions for Discus because "its what they always did for fish" .

The short of it is , make your decision...Do you want to succeed at Discus keeping, or do you want to put stock in people that slander a recognized leading website on Discus, one thats been built by hobbyists specifically to cater to Discus . The choice is yours....but I won't tolerate anyone trashing SimplyDiscus..Period.

Regards,
Al
Owner of Simplydiscus.com