Water Storage Heating.

[manbearpig]

I was able to find a 275 Gallon storage container for free from a customer of mine. I cleaned it out and have nearly finished doing the pluming to be able to do water changes on my tanks. Anyhow, due to to size I can't get it into the house and have been left to settle for keeping it in my attached garage. In the coldest of days of winter it can get down to 45-50 degrees in there. I purchased the insulation linked below at Lowes and put it on the bottom of, on the sides of, and on top of the water storage tote, and then put the cage back on.

This leads me to my question. I am assuming I will have to purchase a heater with some serious wattage to heat incoming water typically 65 degrees up to my storage temp of 85-87. Will the 4-5 watt per gallon rule apply in this scenario or would the insulation not be able to offset the low ambient temp. in the garage?

Anyone who has experience with large water storage and heats please chime in. I just don't want to purchase a 1,200-1,500 watt heater only to find out that it wasn't large enough. Also, if anyone has any suggestions of alternative ways to heat the water I am open to those suggestions as well. Thanks in advance for your help.


http://www.lowes.com/pd_13358-56291-BP48025_4294858104__?productId=3011906&Ns=p_product_qty_sales_dollar|1&pl=1&currentURL=%3FgoToProdList%3Dtrue%26Ns%3Dp_product _qty_sales_dollar%7C1&facetInfo=

[nc0gnet0]

Are you just using Tap Water?

[manbearpig]

Yes just plain old tap water.

I should note that 275 gallons will only last me 2 days and would also need to be heated up in a relatively short period of time less than 24hrs.

[nc0gnet0]

And your reason for needing to store the water? Are you aging it, and is aging necessary?

[manbearpig]

Yes aging is necessary due to large ph swings. I can fill with heated water so I guess it would really just come down to maintaining that 85 deg. In a 45 degree room.

[nc0gnet0]

Maintaining the temperature would not be cost effective. Your only going to use approximately 135 gallons a day? If that is the case you might be better off only half filling the container, and then heating to temp just prior to it's use. Most likely your going to be stuck using some type of electric heater, unless you have a gas line near by (not common in a garage).

[kris2341]

Lately what I have been doing with my barrels is to just age half the water in it, then dump hot water straight from the water heater and aerate the water for 30 mins before use. So far so good, I believe the hot water is able to outgas much more easily due to it being hot.

[manbearpig]

I will have to try adding hot water and giving it 30 min to see what my PH looks like. It appears that my PH swing is not caused by CO2 outgassing as my ph from the tap comes out at 8.8+ and settles in around 7.4. I am not sure what actually causes the swing only that it happens. Thank you both for the ideas, I will try both suggestion and see what works.

[kris2341]

that is an interesting situation with the pH, mine just comes from the outgassing of CO2 so it goes from sub 7 to over 7. Since it is only CO2, it never harms my fish even if I don't wait to gas it off a bit. If my solution is applicable then great, glad to help, but if ALL the water needs to be aged for whatever reason, you will have to use some kind of heater

[jsullins]

I have the same size tote in my garage i dont try to heat it up to the same temp as my tanks i set the heater (300w) on 80 and forget about it even on the coldest days (when we have had consecutive days in the 20-30's the water stays in 70 degree range. I also have a couple of 6 in airstones in it to help with movement as well.

[RogueDiscus]

Not really a fish water experience, but I have an above ground 1500 gal water storage tank for my well. Last year, to keep it from freezing, I hung a 1500 watt stock tank heater in it (for livestock water), which turns on as temps approach freezing. It used a lot of energy, but kept my tank from freezing like it had the year before. However, I think it was aluminum with a steel spring coiled around the cord. I think it reacted with the minerals in my water and the steel coil practically dissolved. I was just about to look into other options for that tank myself. Anyone with experience, please share.
Steve

[DonMD]

I have a 200 gallon storage barrel in my basement. I usually use at least 100 gallons every day, sometimes more than 150. I refill it every day with water that often gets down to 40 degrees, and re-heat it in 24 hours. I have 3 250 watt aquarium heaters suspended in the tank, just off the bottom. When I'm going to use a lot of water, I turn off the plug they are plugged into so that they are not heating air. I also have one hydor in-line heater with a recirculating pump on that storage tank, so in all 4 heaters. I use a digital regulator for the heaters I bought from Jehmco, works great.

[kris2341]

Not really a fish water experience, but I have an above ground 1500 gal water storage tank for my well. Last year, to keep it from freezing, I hung a 1500 watt stock tank heater in it (for livestock water), which turns on as temps approach freezing. It used a lot of energy, but kept my tank from freezing like it had the year before. However, I think it was aluminum with a steel spring coiled around the cord. I think it reacted with the minerals in my water and the steel coil practically dissolved. I was just about to look into other options for that tank myself. Anyone with experience, please share.
Steve

considering the size of the tank, if gas heating is possible, look into the hydronic heating system I use for my pond. It can be a bit pricey but should be much cheaper to run and has 7000 watts of heating power in the configuration used.

http://forum.simplydiscus.com/showthread.php?116786-System-Concept-7kW-Equivalent-Hydronic-Heating-System-for-Aquaria-(Complete)

since you are only heating to avoid freezing temperatures, this should hold with a few modifications (like insulating the PEX lines and increasing their diameter to keep them from freezing over themselves.)

[manbearpig]

I have a 200 gallon storage barrel in my basement. I usually use at least 100 gallons every day, sometimes more than 150. I refill it every day with water that often gets down to 40 degrees, and re-heat it in 24 hours. I have 3 250 watt aquarium heaters suspended in the tank, just off the bottom. When I'm going to use a lot of water, I turn off the plug they are plugged into so that they are not heating air. I also have one hydor in-line heater with a recirculating pump on that storage tank, so in all 4 heaters. I use a digital regulator for the heaters I bought from Jehmco, works great.

So you are using roughly 1000W and getting your temp up to 82F from 40F in 24hrs?

[DonMD]

So you are using roughly 1000W and getting your temp up to 82F from 40F in 24hrs?

Lately the incoming water hasn't been so cold, so I haven't had to raise it 40 degrees, but yes, it's been heating it no problem. The barrel is sitting on 1.5 inches dense styrofoam I cut from shipping containers, and it's wrapped with reflective bubble-wrap insulation. It's been working well for me.

[manbearpig]

Lately the incoming water hasn't been so cold, so I haven't had to raise it 40 degrees, but yes, it's been heating it no problem. The barrel is sitting on 1.5 inches dense styrofoam I cut from shipping containers, and it's wrapped with reflective bubble-wrap insulation. It's been working well for me.

Awesome thanks for the information. Mine is coming in at 54 degrees. I have a few heaters sitting in there now, see how it goes.

[manbearpig]

Just an update. I piped a hot and cold water line into the storage container and have been adding water back to the container after doing a water change. Temp when added gets up to 85-86 F and 24 hours or so later when I come back the container has settled in around 83-84 F. I have insulation wrapped around the bottom, sides and top of the container and a single 250watt heater placed inside. Ambient temperature at a low gets down to 45. Obviously the heater is fighting a losing battle and I have ordered two additional 250 watt heater and the temperature controller linked below. I bought an inexpensive controller that has reviewed well on this site with the thought that it's in my storage container and isn't all that critical.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00F05UI8O/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1