240g planted build

[Debow]

So hater a few years with the planted 55 I have started me new obsession with the building of the 240g. Here are some pictures as the tank developes. Not sure why the pictures are all upside down sorry for that.

[Northwoods Discus]

It's going to be difficult to keep water in that tank. Nice build on the stand. Whatever you put in that tank will look great. The acrylic has such nice clean lines.

[niqhil]

Great neck exercise ! :)

This is great setup. .please keep us posted on the substrate and plant selection !

[jmf3460]

if you have a droid, you need to turn your phone the opposite way that you are holding it. or when you save them on to your computer, rotate them 90 degrees first and then save them. silly phones, mine does this too. anyway great build im stoked! what fish?

[Debow]

It's all plumbed to a sump rank and a separate fx6 down stairs with a faucet plumbed so there is no bucket train. Everything is going to be down stairs only the lights will be plugged in upstairs. Quite the project so far

[Debow]

I have discus and angles and 10-12" plecos with a tire track eel and other interesting odd fish that like the bottom. Along with 4 pea puffers. And the many peoples surprise they all get along and no fin nipping, with the new tank and all the space they can all find a spot and call it theirs.

[RichardL]

Nice looking tank. The pics are difficult to view, however, due to some being sideway and some being upside down :(

[Debow]

Ya the pictures are frustrating they are right side up on my phone but not when they get uploaded. All I'm waiting to do is get the sump and get some water in to and start cycling the tank. The driftwood stump is on the way.

[rickztahone]

Ya the pictures are frustrating they are right side up on my phone but not when they get uploaded. All I'm waiting to do is get the sump and get some water in to and start cycling the tank. The driftwood stump is on the way.

Try changing the orientation from your phone directly. Then send them to your computer and upload them in this manner.

[Debow]

Update- plants are in and fish transferred over still need my drift wood and to arrange the plants where they need to go but so far this is where its at. What a change from my little 55g.
87121871228712387124

[Debow]

P.s this sites image loading is messed up I tried to rotate the images and save them and no mater what I do it still post upside down. I have zero problems with any other site with my IPhone. Just my .02 cents.

[RichardL]

I fixed the images for you:

87125
87126
87127
87128

[rickztahone]

That is one huge Pleco!

[alcastro]

Richard, how did you fix the images.

[Debow]

Ya I have 2 of them probably 12" I have never had a algae problem with them.

[Debow]

Yes please explain...

[Debow]

Was able to take a few pictures today everyone is settling in nicely. To bad I only have 2 discus left, had a bad buy of juveniles from a lfs, but I learned my lesson the hard way. Cant wait to order some adults from our sponsors. Still learning a lot this tank is miles away from my self-contained 55g planted tank. 8721887219872208722187222

[RichardL]

Richard, how did you fix the images.

Easy, Photoshop.

Windows also has a built-in Paint app that rotates images.

[Debow]

Well bought some new fish from a member will post pictures and unboxing this week.

[rickztahone]

Please remember, if you introduce your new discus in to a tank that you know contained unhealthy discus, you may be back at the drawing board in a few days with sick discus. The correct approach would have been to fully sterilize The tank before new introductions.

[Debow]

I plan on qt the new fish for a few months in a bare bottom tank. In the mean time what you'll you suggest to sterilize the tank without harming my other fish

[rickztahone]

I plan on qt the new fish for a few months in a bare bottom tank. In the mean time what you'll you suggest to sterilize the tank without harming my other fish

You are not going to like it. You would have to break it down completely. Remove the current fish and place them in another tank. Use a bleach solution on your main tank as well as all your equipment. There is no telling if the fish you place back in the tank will carry anything though. You run the risk still if you introduce them to a later date with the discus. It is a risk I would not personally make. I would sell/give to the LFS and start fresh. That is just me though, and I tend to be really paranoid about stuff like this, lol.

[DiscusRob]

I agree Rick, I've had to do that several times with my vics, sucks everytime....Comes with hobby.

[Debow]

What do I do with the substrate, wood, plants rocks? So if you guys lose one fish you exterminate your tank? So the uv sterilizer is pointless.

[rickztahone]

Substrate toss. Wood boil. Plants toss or bleach dip. Rocks boil.

If I lose one fish what killed it becomes a large factor of my next step and if total nuke is necessary. It needs to be your assessment though

[Debow]

So looking at the health of the other 2 discus and the angles and other fish how would i know if they are okay, I lost the other fish in the 55g they did not die in the 240. But the fish that were with the other 2 are in the 240 now. Everyone eats like pigs and rushes up to you when you go see them. They don't have any feces issues as i can tell. As for the other fish that died from the start they never were social and always hid, were not the best eaters and looked like they stopped eating and starved even when trying to target feed. Not sure if the other larger discus picked on them also as they were smaller and I have seen him harass the others before.

[bluelagoon]

I would go with toss those fish.I see tiger barbs and I think a puffer fish and a big dirty pleco and a crayfish.You'll not stress your discus as much and they might grow better.

[cellingson]

Honestly I think you are going at this too fast. Haste is responsible for the death of too many hobbiest.

[Debow]

I have little to no comment of this going froward, If I had a tank full of discus hans fish or Kenny's would you all be telling me to give them away or get rid of them? I have not seen a vary warm welcome on here and I take offense to the statements on my fish. I would love to see one of you toss your discus stock due to a fish that died. And even after I have tried to provide as much info on the conditions around the death and the current state of the fish that are doing great still the only comment is to toss them, really? I feel as if I joined some hoity toity upper west side NYC dinner club, not a place for logical and helpful aquarium advice. Id appreciate it is someone can delete this thread.

[cellingson]

I have little to no comment of this going froward, If I had a tank full of discus hans fish or Kenny's would you all be telling me to give them away or get rid of them? I have not seen a vary warm welcome on here and I take offense to the statements on my fish. I would love to see one of you toss your discus stock due to a fish that died. And even after I have tried to provide as much info on the conditions around the death and the current state of the fish that are doing great still the only comment is to toss them, really? I feel as if I joined some hoity toity upper west side NYC dinner club, not a place for logical and helpful aquarium advice. Id appreciate it is someone can delete this thread.

Sorry, personally I wan't trying to come off that way. If I was in your shoes I wouldn't toss all of my fish if one got sick. But I certainly would make sure the disease pathology was eliminated before introducing more fish. That being said I have eliminated livestock in the past to prevent spread.

I think I would clean the tank well, certainly with bleach, consider bleaching the substrate or buying new based on personal affordability. I think you will have to get new filter media or bleach that too depending on what you use. Clean filters and all hardware with bleach solution. You could house your fish in a quarantine tank until you are certain they are disease free if that is an option.

Ultimately it all comes down to risk reward analysis. How much risk are you willing to take that your new fish won't get sick. This comes down to personal preferences. Some posters believe any risk is too much risk and hence they advocate you get rid of all your stock and start new. Others are on the other side of the spectrum. Find where your at, do what your comfortable with, and certainly don't take any advice personally. There is no concrete evidence to follow when it comes to raising fish.

[rickztahone]

I have little to no comment of this going froward, If I had a tank full of discus hans fish or Kenny's would you all be telling me to give them away or get rid of them? I have not seen a vary warm welcome on here and I take offense to the statements on my fish. I would love to see one of you toss your discus stock due to a fish that died. And even after I have tried to provide as much info on the conditions around the death and the current state of the fish that are doing great still the only comment is to toss them, really? I feel as if I joined some hoity toity upper west side NYC dinner club, not a place for logical and helpful aquarium advice. Id appreciate it is someone can delete this thread.

I'm sorry it seems that way. Let us take a different approach here. Say you have a tank full of fish, and you happen to know that one is sick. You remove the sick fish and treat it somewhere else. You re-introduce the fish after it has gotten rid of the illness. You are now going to re-introduce him back to a tank that this fish first got sick in. Have you eliminated the threat? No. This is one of the reasons I said your best bet was to nuke everything. I didn't say toss your fish, although many here will give you that advice. More often than not, euthanasia is the cheapest option, but at the end of the day, these creatures are still our pets. We are here to help you, but you have to be willing to take the advice. Are you willing to nuke everything in your tank? Balls on your court.

[pastry]

debow, you've actually been given a lot of good advice without the powder sugar and other fluff. good people here but takes some getting used to because they've seen every topic more than once. hope you don't take off and not look back. lots of good info on this site. I get hassled all the time too but lots of good stuff on here and after awhile you'll learn to appreciate people's bluntness on here because it just cuts to the chase.

also, yep, sometimes you have to kill one to save the others.

[strawberryblonde]

I have little to no comment of this going froward, If I had a tank full of discus hans fish or Kenny's would you all be telling me to give them away or get rid of them? I have not seen a vary warm welcome on here and I take offense to the statements on my fish. I would love to see one of you toss your discus stock due to a fish that died. And even after I have tried to provide as much info on the conditions around the death and the current state of the fish that are doing great still the only comment is to toss them, really? I feel as if I joined some hoity toity upper west side NYC dinner club, not a place for logical and helpful aquarium advice. Id appreciate it is someone can delete this thread.

Actually, only one person recommended killing all your current fish. If you only get one such comment, it's pretty safe to ignore it if it's not something you agree with. Now if you had 4 or 5 people giving you that advice, it would definitely be time to ask questions and figure out why they were recommending such a radical step.

You'll never get everyone to agree with just one course of action around here and that's ok! =)

On the other hand, when you get several people advising you to clear out the 240 and nuke it before rebuilding it, then you can bet that they are speaking from experience and are trying to help you avoid a bad situation - one that they probably faced at least once in this hobby.

Now see that part of your statement that I bolded up there? Yep, there's a reason that I did that - grab some coffee cuz here comes my personal story of illness in my tanks.

To give you some background, I had a GORGEOUS tank full of huge discus about 4 years ago. The smallest was 7.5", the largest was 9" and they were still young and very healthy. I was SO proud of raising those guys and loved every one of them.

Then I received a shipment of discus from a different importer. They were a gift and they were very pretty. I put them in a QT tank in a separate room and started growing them out. All went great for the first few months, till I had a really stressful, busy day where I had to rush to get my water changes on 4 tanks.

Got the first 2 done just fine. Moved on to the QT/grow out tank. The clean went ok and I hung up my scrubby brush on the rack in the laundry room where I kept ALL the scrubby brushes for each tank. Each was a different color so that I wouldn't mix them up and use them in the wrong tanks. Also, I ALWAYS sanitized them before hanging them back on the rack - except for that day because of the huge rush to get it done.

I was well into scrubbing my main tank full of those gorgeous huge discus when I looked down into the tank and realized that I was using the wrong brush. Uh huh, I had just scrubbed the tank with the still wet QT tank brush!

Now none of the discus in the QT tank had shown any signs of illness in the 3 months I'd had them, so I wrote and told a friend about my stupid mistake, then crossed my fingers and prayed that they'd all be ok.

They weren't! About 4 or 5 days later the entire main tank was huddled at the top of the tank, weren't moving their fins and were gasping for air.

I made sure that the water was fine and just watched them for the rest of the day. By that night I knew they were all sick. The people here helped me to care for them and only half of them died. The other half never fully recovered though. They'd get better for a month, then get sick again. They were also slowly wasting away.

In the end, I lost 8 of my favorite discus. I had 3 left. One lived in a hospital tank for nearly 18 months. The other 2 stayed in the main tank, but 1 of them kept getting sick over and over again.

These were all Hans Stendkers and I refused to let them go until 2 good friends on here nudged and nudged and wouldn't relent till I culled those last 2 sick discus. I was left with just 1. I also still had that QT tank full of the fish who obviously were carriers of something bad.

They told me to cull those too. And I finally did it. It was horrible, but necessary if I ever wanted to have a nice tank full of healthy discus ever again.

I ended up nuking both of those tanks and starting pretty much from scratch. I made the executive decision to keep the 1 original Stendker and then did a very careful QT with just 1 of the "carrier" discus to make sure he wouldn't get anymore fish sick. He was fine thank goodness!

So yes, there are reasons why people are telling you to clean out your 240, bleach it and then start fresh and it doesn't matter whether the fish are from your local fish store or are Stendkers. When you introduce a pathogen into the tank that kills a fish, you have to assume that the pathogen is still in the tank and/or affecting the remaining fish even if you remove the sick fish.

In your case, you had fish die in the 55g, but moved the still living ones to the 240. You have no way of knowing whether or not they are carriers of whatever killed your other discus.

The other issue that people are seeing is that you are mixing together some species that shouldn't be together in a tank. By doing that, you're asking for trouble. The lobster, puffers, and possibly some others (I couldn't identify all the varieties in the pics) don't belong with discus.

So isn't it better to be safe than sorry? You don't have to cull all of your fish! Just separate them into another tank, then bleach the heck out of the 240, including the filters, and start with fresh substrate and clean driftwood. Plants are cheap to replace too and the substrate and decor can go into the tank with the lobster, etc, so they won't be thrown away or wasted.

We really do want to help you to create a healthy environment for your discus. Hopefully you'll come back, read and decide to make some changes for the good of your future discus. :D

[DiscusRob]

Well said Toni.

[Quintin]

Lovely tank but unfortunately not suited for small discus.learn from your mistakes and try again.good luck

[Tres]

I didn't happen to find in the thread whether there was a specific disease or whether the deaths were asymptomatic. I'm a little surprised by some of the advice however.

My thoughts might have been to move all the remaining fish to a bare quarantine tank to be medicated either for whatever the disease was which your tank had or by a broad-spectrum comprehensive medicine of some manner although I'm not sure what medication(s) might be recommended for that. And to break down the tank; boil or bake the hardscape and substrate, throw out the plants, and then clean and bleach the tank/filters/everything else.

Are others really suggesting that if any of the fish had a disease they dispose of them all rather than trying to cure that? I now medicate my fish while they're in quarantine, just to try to err on the side of caution - despite that I don't like medicating as I think it's a bit hard on fish...

[Debow]

I checked the tank today and I see what looks like wigglers? can any one confirm. I have one discus staying vary close to the "wigglers"
88291

[jmf3460]

holy cow congrats you're a grandparent. they do look like wigglers to me.

[Debow]

Ya now I have no idea whether I should let nature take its course or do something else.

[tonysdiscus]

Quick question, what lights are you using?

[pastry]

niiiiice Debow! you'd be surprised how often you'll get a pair strong enough to raise some fry in a community tank. I've had it several times (last time I sort of cheated and put a little adhoc mesh divider I made but all it did was slow other fish getting from one side to the other). I usually just let nature take it's place and from time to time get a little one to survive. Those little ones don't get too big in the community tank since it's not BB and I don't put the effort in but still a cool thing in my book. Next time it happens, I think I'll move some to a small BB (especially since one of my existing pairs are piwarski RT's from "Harry" who used to have beautiful fish).

[Debow]

The light are programmable and and have dimmers, They are sold for reef tanks but are full spectrum and vary vary bright I run them on 1-5% and the plants grow great. They would the same a Reef Breeders led's.

[Debow]

Ya, the parents ate the wigglers but its good to know that they will spawn and I guess they are happy enough to do so. I'm putting a breeding cone in there and will keep a closer eye on them and try to put some mesh around them so they done become snacks.

[pastry]

honestly, don't even waste time & money on breeding cone. if you have that wood in there then you don't have to worry about it. that way you keep it looking somewhat "natural"; know what I mean? If they're horny enough, they don't need a cone. Also, they may not even use the cone. Now, if you move that pair to a small BB, then definitely put a cone, clay pot, or slanted prop for them (although they'll readily spawn on the glass, heater, etc)

[Debow]

Just a question, The pair eats well, looks great but will continue to hide in the back behind a amazon sword. When the lights turn off and only the moonlight is on I see them come out and swim around. And another question how do discus sleep I will see them swim around and find a spot and settle on the bottom. Is that normal?

[pastry]

Just a question, The pair eats well, looks great but will continue to hide in the back behind a amazon sword. When the lights turn off and only the moonlight is on I see them come out and swim around. And another question how do discus sleep I will see them swim around and find a spot and settle on the bottom. Is that normal?

Nothing abnormal about that. Usually we all prefer a pair that's not shy but it is what it is. Also, yes, at night most of mine "sleep" towards the bottom third of the water column. It's good that you do a night time because sometimes I cheat and have a dim light for any pairs that spawn and are good enough to raise in a community but honestly I believe the best for all of my discus to keep a constant night time (arguably good for plants and, indirectly, H20 quality as well). Just my opinions/thoughts

[Debow]

Ya I have the lights timed to try and give them the best light conditions. At first when I saw one of them on the bottom of the tank leaning over thought he was dead so I nudged him and he woke up and was startled felt bad for the poor guy. I have noticed a huge increase In activity now that I am vacuuming 95% of the substrate and it seams that the water change schedule and condition are starting to settle out. Bought 6 4-4.5'' discus from Chicago Discus last week and still letting them Qt for the time being. I have to saw they are stunning fish and what a steep above the rest. They were all eating the same day and are responsive and coming right to the glass begging for food or attention. I will be getting more from Chicago later this year again. And as for the rest of the stock I found some good homes for the XXL plecos and the pea puffers, only fish that is left is the angles and everyone seams to be doing just fine no fighting issues.

[Debow]

Well my new group from Chicago discus pared off and I have again a new spawn of eggs, by a super golden and a mandarin passion. Wigglers to come I hope. Going to put a screen over the cone this time. Pictures to follow.

[Woodduck]

Ya I have the lights timed to try and give them the best light conditions. At first when I saw one of them on the bottom of the tank leaning over thought he was dead so I nudged him and he woke up and was startled felt bad for the poor guy. I have noticed a huge increase In activity now that I am vacuuming 95% of the substrate and it seams that the water change schedule and condition are starting to settle out. Bought 6 4-4.5'' discus from Chicago Discus last week and still letting them Qt for the time being. I have to saw they are stunning fish and what a steep above the rest. They were all eating the same day and are responsive and coming right to the glass begging for food or attention. I will be getting more from Chicago later this year again. And as for the rest of the stock I found some good homes for the XXL plecos and the pea puffers, only fish that is left is the angles and everyone seams to be doing just fine no fighting issues.

Let us know how the new 6 are doing when they're all settled in.

[Debow]

If I knew how to post videos I have a video from this morning of the bunch and they swim right up to the camera trying to be the star.

[Debow]

First batch.
88795

[Debow]

887968879788798 I really need to get a better camera.

[jmf3460]

I see qt period did not last too long. Hope that doesn't back fire on you. They do look lovey in your tank. To me the black background just sets your tank apart.

[Debow]

Its black acrylic don't have much of a choice unless I get a 3d background but I would need 10' to make it go around the overflow. I had them in qt for a wile but every time I try qt the fish just seam miserable and stressed and scared, I put them in the display and they warmed up in about 2 days and are so active and what little pigs I feed 3-4 small feeding a day, when they are done they just look at me saying is that it?

[rickztahone]

887968879788798 I really need to get a better camera.

Our owner, Al, currently is looking for planted tank pictures to take to ACA. Yours may be a good addition to the thread if you are up for it? Looking good.

http://forum.simplydiscus.com/showthread.php?120605-Need-planted-tank-pics&highlight=

[Debow]

Ya I don't have a problem with that it be a honner to say the least.

[Debow]

Here is a better tank picture from tonight I don't care what one Al wants to pick.
88822

[Debow]

Short video

http://youtu.be/KndmCBjVMTs

[pastry]

Devon, very dissappointed in you. I don't see any algae, have to put my glasses on to find a poop, and you didn't overstock your tank. What gives? :p

[Debow]

I'm sorry I'll cut back on the cleaning, turn off the UV, and I'll overstock it. I'm trying to do everything the right way

[Debow]

I get varry little Algae I wipe down the sides every water change every 3 days 30-40 %, vacuum all the substrate and have Co2 and medium to low light. I run the led's on 1-5% I think I have enough room for another 6 discus later this year.

[GrayLadyPat]

Very nice tank. I wish you the best of luck.

My only piece of advice (for what it's worth) is to keep an eye on those angelfish. Being Cichlids, they are more agressive than the discus, and could potentially be a problem, especially if they should pair.

Cheers!

[Debow]

Very nice tank. I wish you the best of luck.

My only piece of advice (for what it's worth) is to keep an eye on those angelfish. Being Cichlids, they are more aggressive than the discus, and could potentially be a problem, especially if they should pair.

Cheers!

Thanks! And yes I watch them closely. I saw some aggressive behavior from one of the angles and I took him out and put him in a isolation tank for a week and when I placed him back in he forgot where his territory was and calmed down and hasn't been a problem since. So far so good with the rest. I do daily fin inspections and watch them behave, I wont hesitate to rid any fish the is beating up on the discus. I actually had to isolate one of my older discus for a few days because he was constantly chasing the new ones all over the tank as if he owned the whole tank. I found this isolation method on here actually and seams to work well.

[jmf3460]

wow you go a skate. you really dove into is head first didn't you. kudos it looks really good.

[Debow]

Ya I was looking for one for a long time and was able to get one reasonably cheep $68 so I had to have him, He minds his own business and surfs around the tank looking for left overs. You can hand feed him just like the discus.

[Jack L]

bebow, did you build the tank and stand or just the stand?

[Debow]

Just the stand, the tank is a Tencor tank that I bought.

[Debow]

So wile filling the tank after a WC I turned off the middle light and kind of like the middle in the dark with the sides highlighted any thoughts? Comments? I am thinking of getting 3 Kessil tuna suns and seeing this might only get 3 to start? just brain storming. 91752

[rickztahone]

I see what you are seeing, but I prefer it with the lights on. If the lights were dimmer all together and the tank had a darker feel, then it may have been fine, but this setup just seems a little off (no pun intended)

The Kessils may be a great buy, but they are not the cheapest of lights, and considering that you do not have any expert plants in there, I do not see much benefit in switching out. Unless you plan on going full co2 and get more high end plants.

[SMB2]

Lights on either side, to my eye seems unnatural.
If you want varying lights, I would try bright on one end with moderate in the middle and dim at the other end. This might give a sense of depth.
The Kessils you can connect in series and program to have the light move across the tank like the sun in the course of a day.

[Jack L]

looks like you have a burned out light this way

[Debow]

Thanks, I know what you mean by unnatural. I want to get the kessils for 3 reasons, they are quite smaller than the current ones ( my wife hates these lights), They have great shimmer, and are programmable to sunrise and sunset. I am thinking about getting a apex in the spring to run everything and set up water level sensors in case something ever happens I will get a notification. I do plan on getting more plants but after I get a nice center piece of wood. But they are costly but as some as the quality can compete with the price I'm ok with that.

By the way every water change and wile vacuuming the substrate I think about sucking it all out and making that tank BB Its ever so tempting the more I think about it. Especially after seeing Hart24601's tank and all the plants glued the the rocks.

[jmf3460]

I think you have "need to change something" syndrome. Personally I think you need to stop messing and let this tank stabilize. Every time you post something is different with the layout or the plants or the substrate, and now you mention taking it all out and going BB. I think it would benefit you to just let things be, do your water changes, get the lighting on a schedule and leave it alone. Sometimes less is more. You may find that the less it changes the more you like it the way it is. Just a thought.

[Debow]

Might have a little of that... I have a light scheduled timed already, I want to just let it be but every time I look at it my mind goes everywhere, Sometimes I just like thinking out loud. I will probably just end up getting some wood and maybe lights and leaving it alone the best I can. My old planted tank I set it and forgot it was even there besides wc's and trimming.

[jmf3460]

"set it and forget it" lol

[Debow]

Something like this.. lol
91783

[Rapture]

Love your tank story, thanks for posting!

[HappyFace]

Beautiful tank!

[Las Vegas]

THANKS for fixing those images. My neck was starting to hurt! I love those huge tank setups! Keep posting results. Good and bad so we can learn from your experience.

[Debow]

Most of the updates are on my Journal section if you want to follow. Not to much to update as on now (good thing). Enjoying the time off from building and changing things around.