Dragon's Cuipeua F2 - 75 Gallon BB

[dragon1974]

I'm going to post pics of the process from start to finish. Going to get them today

[Phillydubs]

Where are they coming from??

[quattrok04]

Interesting looking toward to this cuipeua f2

[dragon1974]

Got them from Vern, here in TO. I'm so stoked to have these, can't wait to get them home and into a tank.

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u208/dragon1974_photo/Mobile%20Uploads/20150812_160547.jpg (http://s169.photobucket.com/user/dragon1974_photo/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20150812_160547.jpg.html)

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u208/dragon1974_photo/Mobile%20Uploads/20150812_160642.jpg (http://s169.photobucket.com/user/dragon1974_photo/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20150812_160642.jpg.html)

[jawfish]

Niiiiiiiiiiiice,

I was wondering about those. You need to post pics of them in the tank.
This should be very interesting. I'm curious about these.

How many did you get ?

[dragon1974]

Ended up getting 6 instead of the 8 I wanted to. I ran out of coin for the last 2 LOL. I sold off the Stendker Tefe's that I got to get the Cuipeua's from Vern.

So here is how my night went..

Got home and the kids and wife were out of the house (score 1 for Daddy)

Rushed down into the basement to fill the tank and put the babies to bed, little did I know I was in for an hour of work. (minus 1 for daddy)

While filling up the tank, I was watching the level that I had ontop of the tank because the setup is on carpet that I didn't want to cut. Slowly I noticed that one side of the tank started to dip lower and lower off level

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u208/dragon1974_photo/Mobile%20Uploads/20150812_191810.jpg (http://s169.photobucket.com/user/dragon1974_photo/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20150812_191810.jpg.html)

So I had to empty the tank a bit and try to shim the bottom of the stand to level the tank

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u208/dragon1974_photo/Mobile%20Uploads/20150812_191824.jpg (http://s169.photobucket.com/user/dragon1974_photo/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20150812_191824.jpg.html)

Perfect level from back to front, side to side and crossed.

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u208/dragon1974_photo/Mobile%20Uploads/20150812_193044.jpg (http://s169.photobucket.com/user/dragon1974_photo/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20150812_193044.jpg.html)

I decided that I wasn't going to use the full 75 gals as the group was only maxing out to 2"

I would say about 50 gals were used but I wasn't measuring once it was above the filters and K1 bottle I was ok with it.

Bags ah floating and then it's plop and drop

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u208/dragon1974_photo/Mobile%20Uploads/20150812_200700.jpg (http://s169.photobucket.com/user/dragon1974_photo/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20150812_200700.jpg.html)

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u208/dragon1974_photo/Mobile%20Uploads/20150812_200702.jpg (http://s169.photobucket.com/user/dragon1974_photo/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20150812_200702.jpg.html)

I checked my heaters and it wasn't working properly as the temp started to climb above 90 in half hour. Ditched it and put another one in and the temp came back to 84 within an hour or so.

Didn't really check in on them after the dumping as the wife and kids came in on me so I had to do daddy duties LOL. Check in on them using my handy dandy webcam, and everything seems normal after the dip and temp problem.


Check in on them this morning and gave them something to eat

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u208/dragon1974_photo/Mobile%20Uploads/20150813_082159.jpg (http://s169.photobucket.com/user/dragon1974_photo/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20150813_082159.jpg.html)

Little piggy's

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u208/dragon1974_photo/Mobile%20Uploads/20150813_082220.jpg (http://s169.photobucket.com/user/dragon1974_photo/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20150813_082220.jpg.html)


http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u208/dragon1974_photo/Mobile%20Uploads/20150813_082223.jpg (http://s169.photobucket.com/user/dragon1974_photo/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20150813_082223.jpg.html)

They seem to be ok when I checked in on them. Food mostly gone but someone will clean that up by lunch. When I get home I'll do another 50% change on them.

I have to say that I'm like a fat kid in a candy store.

[jawfish]

Looking good !!!

These should be interesting to see them grow. They are F2 from the wilds he got a while back. Those cuipeua looked amazing.

[dragon1974]

I'm hoping once I keep to the schedule everything should be right as rain in the next couple weeks.

[Second Hand Pat]

Dragon, you have pics of the parents?
Pat

[dragon1974]

They are on the owners site. I sent you a PM :angel:

[Second Hand Pat]

They are on the owners site. I sent you a PM :angel:

Thanks Dragon, nice fish :D

[jawfish]

How are these guys doing Daragon ?

I'm really tempted to drive up to Vern's to pick some up :D

[dragon1974]

They are going great to be honest. So not to stress them out too much, I've done daily WCing on that tank and the lights are off. They are eating without problem and eating BH mix and FDBW. I'll post pics when I have some time on the weekend. Make the 5 hr trip and you wouldn't be disappointed.

[jawfish]

I've never been dissapointed when visiting Vern.

He doesn't have the quantity I'm looking for.... Darned miss the boat on this one... I'll eait for the next batch... Discus id all about patience

Looking forward on those pictures

Fred

[Phillydubs]

Can you link his website. Id like to see the parents. Or post pics of them here ? Dragon it Pat?

[Second Hand Pat]

Can you link his website. Id like to see the parents. Or post pics of them here ? Dragon it Pat?

Dragon, are these the parents?

http://www.archersdiscus.com/album/19/16513616.jpg

This is Vern's site http://www.archersdiscus.com/.

[dragon1974]

Yes they are Pat, but those pics don't do this pair justice. When you see them face to face they are stunning. Anyway give me some time I'll post something today

[dragon1974]

small pic update

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u208/dragon1974_photo/Mobile%20Uploads/20150819_164344.jpg (http://s169.photobucket.com/user/dragon1974_photo/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20150819_164344.jpg.html)

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u208/dragon1974_photo/Mobile%20Uploads/20150819_164348.jpg (http://s169.photobucket.com/user/dragon1974_photo/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20150819_164348.jpg.html)

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u208/dragon1974_photo/Mobile%20Uploads/20150819_164349.jpg (http://s169.photobucket.com/user/dragon1974_photo/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20150819_164349.jpg.html)

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u208/dragon1974_photo/Mobile%20Uploads/20150819_164404.jpg (http://s169.photobucket.com/user/dragon1974_photo/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20150819_164404.jpg.html)

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u208/dragon1974_photo/Mobile%20Uploads/20150819_164406.jpg (http://s169.photobucket.com/user/dragon1974_photo/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20150819_164406.jpg.html)

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u208/dragon1974_photo/Mobile%20Uploads/20150819_164421.jpg (http://s169.photobucket.com/user/dragon1974_photo/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20150819_164421.jpg.html)

[dragon1974]

Stupid phone....Have to get a better camera LOL

[Second Hand Pat]

Stupid phone....Have to get a better camera LOL

A bit more light would help but definitely get a general idea. They look great :D
Pat

[dragon1974]

Yeah, I turn off the lights for the couple weeks just to have them settle in. BTW they are some little piggies LOL.

[jawfish]

Looking good. Looking forward to see them grow...Now I'm getting jealous that I miss out on them
keep those pics coming ;)

cheers,
Fred

[jawfish]

Hey Dragon1974 how these guys doing ?

Fred

[dragon1974]

Good, I'll post pics tonight. Eating and growing. And that's all I wanted

[dragon1974]

Sorry guys I fell to sleep and didn't take any pics :(:(

I'll take some this weekend and I'm going to be getting some anubias so I think it's time to add them to all the tanks. We'll see how it goes

[dragon1974]

I didn't add any DW or plants yet to any of the tanks but here is a couple images of the growth of the F2's as of last night. Edit: I just realized that I only had them just over a month now LOL. They are looking good and eating and growing normally.

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u208/dragon1974_photo/Mobile%20Uploads/20150915_112800.jpg (http://s169.photobucket.com/user/dragon1974_photo/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20150915_112800.jpg.html)

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u208/dragon1974_photo/Mobile%20Uploads/20150915_112813.jpg (http://s169.photobucket.com/user/dragon1974_photo/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20150915_112813.jpg.html)


http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u208/dragon1974_photo/Mobile%20Uploads/20150915_112807.jpg (http://s169.photobucket.com/user/dragon1974_photo/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20150915_112807.jpg.html)

[jawfish]

looking good... eating and growing... perfect combination for discus ;)

I really like the middle one in the last picture.

[dragon1974]

Small picture update. Size ranging from 3 1/2 to 4 1/2. Clearly out of the 6 I have one runt and slow to grow in this group.

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u208/dragon1974_photo/Mobile%20Uploads/20151102_193100_zps9z4d2crh.jpg

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u208/dragon1974_photo/Mobile%20Uploads/20151102_192305_zps4cllxzht.jpg

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u208/dragon1974_photo/Mobile%20Uploads/20151102_192306_zps7jpulccw.jpg

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u208/dragon1974_photo/Mobile%20Uploads/20151102_193106_zpsoejrx2ws.jpg

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u208/dragon1974_photo/Mobile%20Uploads/20151102_193114_zpset7bevcm.jpg

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u208/dragon1974_photo/Mobile%20Uploads/20151102_193115_zpssbmonguw.jpg

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u208/dragon1974_photo/Mobile%20Uploads/20151102_193027_zpsnzvgk3a2.jpg

[Altum Nut]

They are looking good Dragon.
I remember getting some Wattley 1 1/2" from Vern years ago that did not grow for me but Vern did mentioned he was going to introduce wild blood.
Keep doing what your doing and sure the results will eventually be rewarding.

...Ralph

[jawfish]

Looking good, Yhea don't worry too much about that runt. There's always one in the pack.
The shape on them is nice.

Cheers,

Fred

[dragon1974]

Ok I have to give an update here. So I've been giving the good so far, so now for the bad. I've lost 2 of the wilds due to unknown factors.

The first one I lost a couple weeks ago to what I though was bloat as it has a swollen stomach. It was dark and would stay in the back of the tank. This happened really quickly (within 24/48 hrs) which I found odd as with bloat it would take a bit longer to see some problem. I treated with epsom salt and everything looked good that night and everything then by the morning boom fish was gone. Anyway I wrote it off an kept on cleaning and feeding.

Well Saturday night I noticed that another one started to show some stress and turning dark and trying to swim with the group. Mind you the group would pick on this one from time to time so I didn't think anything until Sunday when boom, another one bites the dust....WTH

The tank is cleaner that all my other tanks with close to daily/2 day WC. Feeding 2 times daily with BH and FDBW. All the others are showing no sign of anything swimming normal, eating and pooping.

All other tanks show no signs of anything. This usually is the last tank I clean in the chain and I try to keep all tank equipment separate. 2 of the tanks came from Vern and never seen any other tank mates. One came straight from Germany and again never seen any other tank mates. All tanks were bleached and air dried/cycled before seeing any discus.


Anyway I don't want to have to treat the tank but if I have to I want to nuke it with the correct meds so I'm not make it worst for the fish. I have metro/prazi and sodium benzoate which I got from a friend whose into Birds that use it as a bacterial treatment. Info can be found here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sodium_benzoate


I've filled out a Disease form below if anyone wants to take a stab at helping. For now I've only been doing 100% WC everyday to help the situation.


Problem

1. Please explain the problems with your fish. When did you notice the problems and did anything unusual happen that you think started them?

Discus turning dark/swimming to the back of the tank or staying by the filter. Problem started 2 weeks ago and now has claimed the life of a second one.

2. Symptoms (i.e. turning dark, excess slime, not eating, clamped fins, flashing, darting, clamped gills, white/yellow/green poop, hiding, headstanding or tailstanding, white on tips of fins, rotting or fungus, blisters/white zits on fish, bloated, cloudy eyes, wounds).

Turning dark, swimming slowly, staying to the back of the tank or by the filters

3. What medications/ treatments have you already tried and what were the results. Include dosage and duration of treatment.

None


Tank/Water

4. Tank size and ages, numbers and sizes of fish.
75 gal, 5 mths, was 6 now 4 and around 3 – 3 ½ inch

5. Water change regime (What percentage and how often).
90% every 1 to 2 days

6. How long has tank been running? Is it bare bottom? If you have substrate, what type and how deep is it?
For 4 mths

7. Do you age your water? If you do for how long and what is the ph swing.
Yes age for 24 hours, ph doesn’t move

8. Parameters and water source;
Have not tested for a while

Note: Water Parameters are important in diagnosing problems within a tank. If you don't own test kits for the following information, you can purchase them, test your parameters and post this info as soon as possible.



- temp _83____

- ph __7.8___

- ammonia reading __0__

- nitrite reading ___0_

- nitrate reading __0__

What type of water or combinations of water sources do you use? If it is an RO/tap/well water mix, please list percentages in the mix.

- well water ____

- municipal water __100%__

- RO water ____


9. Any new fish, plants or inverts added recently.

No new fish or plants

10. Include any pictures or videos you have which shows the symptoms. If you can't add them to this post, please provide a link to them.

it's the one on the right closest to the bottle

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u208/dragon1974_photo/Mobile%20Uploads/20151126_212642_zpsjklgxcpq.jpg

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u208/dragon1974_photo/Mobile%20Uploads/20151126_212642_zpsjklgxcpq.jpg
Darkest one in the pic
http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u208/dragon1974_photo/Mobile%20Uploads/20151126_212510_zpsafzuny7b.jpg

Bottom discus in the image
http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u208/dragon1974_photo/Mobile%20Uploads/20151126_212451_zpsi8oj6xj4.jpg[/B]

The other discus in the tank

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u208/dragon1974_photo/Mobile%20Uploads/20151126_212609_zpsep4lgwb2.jpg

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u208/dragon1974_photo/Mobile%20Uploads/20151126_212606_zpsjpaegup5.jpg




OK if anyone has any input please hit this post.

@ Pat, you have this type of fish, have you seen this before?

[rickztahone]

No nitrate readings?

[dragon1974]

Reading 0 or close to 0.

6 discus in a 75 gal tank

[dragon1974]

Did a full on WC lastnight and will do one when I get home again

[Lighthouse7]

Wow sorry to hear about the ones you lost. I have been keeping up with your posts because i also am growing out some f1 from Eric got 6 blue royals from him, and i have 4 left and thry are doing great now aftet have bump in the road where i lost one first which i would have culled anyway because it seemed to be deformed, but the other one died similarly to what you're talking with yours but i forgot to put my Hob back on after water change and only had spounge filter on during a metro/salt treatment, found him dead next morning, since then i treated all my four left no meds but heat treatment 95 + 3 of them immediately began to eat like pigs again, the forth one i put in hospital tank alone 97+ and metro 2 table spoons Epsom salt 7 dsys. Changef water and salt meds every other day and thank God he is now with others eating even more than them! - Lighthouse

[dragon1974]

Ok so I'm down to my last 2. I've started a metro treatment schedule. Funny enough the all are eating and not flashing or anything. Sat and watched them eat and poo and all showing black poo.

The only thing is when I find them dead the bodies are not dark and no stress bars show. Might be something but at this point I'm out of ideas. Lets see if the metro will clear up the last 2.

[Dis82]

Sorry for your loss. Did you touch base with Vern? I've been following your threads to see how these guys turn out. Good luck with your last two

[dragon1974]

Nope, I was going to call him a week ago but I started to get busy with the kids ..... The last one died this morning when I went to check on the tank so I was going to email him today.

Actually I'm going to do it now.

[Lighthouse7]

Have you been feeding same food the whole time? - Lighthouse

[dragon1974]

Yep nothing changed over the last year when I rejigged my setup. BH and FDBW. Same mixture I used in my BH for the past year

[Lighthouse7]

Maybe try changing the menu totally - Lighthouse

[jawfish]

Sorry to hear about your misfortune Dragon1974.

Did Vern ever get an idea what was going on ?

Fred

[Akili]

Sorry to hear about your misfortune Dragon1974.

Did Vern ever get an idea what was going on ?

Fred dragon1974 you should get in touch with Vern,I was at his place this afternoon and he said you send him an email through his own website.

[dragon1974]

Yeah I talked to him. I was going to give him an update on how it's going. Things have stabilized and the remaining 2 are not showing anything. I've bumped the temp to 30 and after talking to Vern, stopped the Metro treatment in favor of adding aquarium salt. Everything seems to have leveled out and again the last 2 seem to be normal. I'm going to do some daily WCing and by the new year see where I stand with this group.

As previously stated my other 2 tanks have not shown signs of anything other than pairing up. I can see 3 pairs in the Wild Green tank and 1 in the SP tank. We'll see what happens

[dragon1974]

Small update,

The last 2 F2's are looking normal, eating and playing like nothing happened :)

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u208/dragon1974_photo/Mobile%20Uploads/20160105_182212_zpsyjppyynz.jpg

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u208/dragon1974_photo/Mobile%20Uploads/20160105_182222_zpsldzr5cgh.jpg

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u208/dragon1974_photo/Mobile%20Uploads/20160105_182229_zpsyook3eve.jpg

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u208/dragon1974_photo/Mobile%20Uploads/20160105_182235_zpslamjm6x4.jpg

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u208/dragon1974_photo/Mobile%20Uploads/20160105_182212_zpsyjppyynz.jpg

Hope they make it to the end so I can get some babies from them

[Lighthouse7]

Hey dragon glad to hear things are better for you now - Lighthouse

[Dis82]

Glad things have turned around. Are you planning on getting a few more from Vern?

[dragon1974]

Thinking about it, but I'm going to wait a bit till I see what happens with the Wild Green set. The wild greens are coming up to a year in Feb so they should be prime age for some babies. Probably around in the Summer months I'll look to by more stock. I was thinking to get some more of the F2's as my group got thinned out, we'll see what happens.

[Dis82]

Ya I guess you won't need more if your filled up with fry. Goodluck

[dragon1974]

Well for all the success I'm having with my other tanks, I have to say this was the most difficult group I ever had.

I'm down to the last ( I call him Chingachgook). I think I narrowed it down to either the tank or somehow the heater was causing the damage. ATM, I have Chingachgook in a 20 gal growing out and eating. Man I really wished this group had worked out. Talked to a lot of experts on the causes of this tank and everyone was stomped. Believe me, this tank I pulled out all the stops and never slipped on cleaning and feeding. I neglected the other tanks a couple times just to make sure this tank got the queens treatment.

For now I'm still keeping up with 90% daily WC and feeding twice a day with BH and FDBW.

We'll see what happens. I'm uploading a vid shortly so you can see the last of the Mohicans.

https://youtu.be/Cnd8uysDFQ4

[Second Hand Pat]

Chingachgook looks fantastic and hungry. :) Really sorry this group didn't do well for you and no one could often any real help. :(
Pat

[dragon1974]

No Problem Pat, I don't think anyone knew really. I didn't want to shotgun the treatment but what can anyone do. I really believe it's the tank bc my other groups have 0 problems (knock on wood)

[jawfish]

Man I'm sorry to hear about your misfortune with these guys.
I was really rooting for you with them as I've been waiting on Vern to get another batch for me to get some of my own.

Your last mohican does look really good :-)

Fred

[dragon1974]

Hey Fred,

Yeah I was hoping that they would have workout like the Wild Green bunch but what can you do. I think I might be with you on getting another group from Vern when they are ready.

I'm hoping that with some luck and keeping up with my cleaning that the last one will reach adulthood and I can cross it with the wild green bunch.

Only time will tell.

[nofearengineer]

This is so sad. Such beautiful little fish. Not very encouraging to a noob like myself either.

[dragon1974]

Small update, my last F2 is coming along nicely (Fingers crossed). only 2 things I did is change the tank and kick the temp up to a nice 87. Eating and playing normally and I'm actually thinking to mix him with my SP group. I might have to use the hero fish approach and see what happens, but I'm sure nothing will in the end.

Pics and a vid to follow

[Lighthouse7]

Hey dragon thanks for the update ive been rooting for you and your discus really sorry you lost some but the one you have looks good, as you know i lost 3 of my 6 royals also - Lighthouse

[dragon1974]

Yeah I was watching that Lighthouse. It's frustrating to know you're doing everything but something keeps killing them. If I did do something wrong I would own up to it, but that was the reason I changed my habits and stock. Now I see some progress with my other 2 groups. I've narrowed it down to either the tank or the heater as I've changed both and now everything seems to have settled again.

I'll hold out until this last one gets to adult and see where it goes. I want to go back to Vern to get some more Cuipeua's at some point but I'm holding out till my other adult group starts to give back babies.

[Akili]

Must be so frustrating that you had a pretty good start then all of a sudden things started to turn the wrong way.

[Lighthouse7]

Ya having vern so close by is a blessing wow - Lighthouse

[dragon1974]

Yep

[jawfish]

p.s. just having Vern in our country is a blessing, but yhea I'd trade off the 4.5 hour trek :)

I'm currious to see how your little guy is going... I'm still waiting on Vern to get some more to snap up a batch.

Cheers,

Fred