Not sure about discus... new tank!

[vdavidguerrero]

Hello SimplyDiscus :).

Well this is my first post :D

I have a new 55 Gallon that has been running for 2 weeks now with 3 goldfish for cycling in it and it has:

Black background.
Black stand/canopy.
Pool filter sand as a substrate.
10G DIY sump wet/dry filter with a 290GPH pump and 3/4" overflow.
2 H.O.T magnum HOB Canister filters

Everything started as a African Cichlid (peacock and haps) project, but after reading and reading I'm not sure anymore, and I've always liked discus but I thought I needed plants for them to thrive but now I see that's not true.

So the reason why I'm not sure:



Should I leave the pool filter sand? I don't know about bare bottom
Do I need plants?
Any suggest on a show tank with low tech plants?


The reason why I want cichlids:


I want to breed them
I like the colors, of course.
I like the fact that it can be with more fish.
I like them!


There are some pictures of the tank as it is right now. What do you suggest on decoration, and substrate, and plants?

Thanks!8963289631

[discuspaul]

Welcome to the forum Vincent.

Sounds like you've done some homework, but perhaps not quite enough.
Your tank is ok for 5 or 6 discus, but that's all - nothing else.
And the 3 goldfish would not make acceptable tank-mates if you wanted to keep them - they have to go.
It may be ok to keep the PFS, but to be on the safe side if you're intent on keeping discus successfully, imo you should remove the sand and fish, completely re-start your tank set-up, (paint the tank bottom white), do a fishless cycle using ammonia, go bare-bottom to begin with, and arrange to get 5 or 6 reasonably-sized discus from a well-known, reputable & experienced source for supplying quality fish.
Any one of the forum's sponsors will be fully suitable for that.
But first things first, please take the time to read through all of the stickies here in this 'Discus Basics for Beginners' section.

Best of luck to you.

[vdavidguerrero]

Thanks for The input! I just got the comet goldfish to cycle the tank. I don't intent to keep them.

So do you think the dark background and withe bottom will make a good contrast? And what about decoration or plants ?

I will go through the forum to keep reading.

Thanks

[Lighthouse7]

Go with discus just take in all the info that SD has to offer you and you wont regret it. - Lighthouse

[Kyla]

those goldfish r still pretty new... it would be wise to wait a full 2 months before replacing them with discus, as they may carry disease and pass pathogens on to ur new discus. they may not get enough BB established to handle the load of 6 big discus. using ammonia to cycle the tank would prob give u a better bacteria colony.

if u are new to discus i would also repeat the suggestion above to paint the bottom of ur tank white and remove the sand. u can always add the sand back later, after your discus are settled and thriving and healthy. but it will make things easier in the beginning - no uneaten food to foul in the sand, easy clean up, BB for treating the fish if they fall ill at first, etc

u can have all sorts of decor in ur tank. u dont need live plants, but some varieties i have found to be hardier: java fern, java moss, anubias, cryptocorne, water sprite, duckweed, valisneria, swords, saggitarius, bolbitis - of these (if u do bare bottom) java fern, java moss, anubias, and water sprite can grow well without substrate

but i would also hold off on plants initially, until the fish r healthy and h know u wont need to treat the tann

[haile161]

i used to use white sand for my aquarium but after few months it was very dirty and not easy to clean up the mess, and my final choice is bare bottom. keeping discus with your gold fish is not a good idea b/c they may carry virus. if your are new with discus, i recommend that dont keep discus with any tankmate.
Hai

[DonMD]

People will have different opinions on sand v bare bottom, plants v no plants, etc. Read as many posts as you can and make your own decisions. I would just like to add that with a black background you should really avoid any pigeon-based discus because they will pepper a lot. If you can afford it, buy non-pigeon fish from Hans or Kenny or one of the other sponsors here on Simply that will stand out from the black background. And Paul is right, in that size tank you shouldn't have more than 5 fish. Good luck, and keep us posted on your progress. -Don

[vdavidguerrero]

Thanks don! I went african with that tank since that was the origanal meant to it, but I can't stop thinking about discus, so I have choosen the spot in the house and will built a 65G (36x18x24), I just want to make sure discus will be good in a tank that has more depth, instead of length?

Thanks,

[MadMatt]

This would be a great tank for a pair and raise an entire small spawn.
Give it a go!... Many of us can help you thru it.
I think Kenny sells pairs, I'm not sure where your located.
I would do a beautiful jumbo pair of adult discus.
Make sure you plumb in water changing hoses, you need to do daily water changes, so the bucket thing get super old, fast.



Thanks don! I went african with that tank since that was the origanal meant to it, but I can't stop thinking about discus, so I have choosen the spot in the house and will built a 65G (36x18x24), I just want to make sure discus will be good in a tank that has more depth, instead of length?

Thanks,

[vdavidguerrero]

This would be a great tank for a pair and raise an entire small spawn.
Give it a go!... Many of us can help you thru it.
I think Kenny sells pairs, I'm not sure where your located.
I would do a beautiful jumbo pair of adult discus.
Make sure you plumb in water changing hoses, you need to do daily water changes, so the bucket thing get super old, fast.

Hey matt, thanks for the input. But can I do the small group(5 or 6) like I was told I could on the 55?

Thanks!

[discuspaul]

This would be a great tank for a pair and raise an entire small spawn.
Give it a go!... Many of us can help you thru it.
I think Kenny sells pairs, I'm not sure where your located.
I would do a beautiful jumbo pair of adult discus.
Make sure you plumb in water changing hoses, you need to do daily water changes, so the bucket thing get super old, fast.

This is not sound advice to be giving to a novice to discus, and discus-keeping, imo.

Breeding discus and raising their spawns successfully is not an easy task, and when undertaken by newcomers to discus-keeping, can lead to it being a frustrating and disappointing experience.

Some of the negatives on doing this, in addition to the novice's complete lack of experience with keeping discus, are that a 55 or 65 gal tank is generally considered to be too large for the spawning exercise, and for the parents to later be looking after/nursing the spawn in the first few weeks of their lives. A 20 gal tank is usually the norm for this phase of the breeding process, and following that, one or more larger tanks will be needed to accommodate the growth of the young fish as they begin to get larger, after having been separated from the parents.

The assumption here is that anyone wanting to get a breeding pair is keen on raising the spawns properly, and not just allowing a pair to continue the spawning process without positive result over the longer term.

So David, think about this very carefully, before you become enthused enough to pay the high price for a mated pair, only to find that what develops after that proves to be too much of a burden for you.

[vdavidguerrero]

This is not sound advice to be giving to a novice to discus, and discus-keeping, imo.

Breeding discus and raising their spawns successfully is not an easy task, and when undertaken by newcomers to discus-keeping, can lead to it being a frustrating and disappointing experience.

Some of the negatives on doing this, in addition to the novice's complete lack of experience with keeping discus, are that a 55 or 65 gal tank is generally considered to be too large for the spawning exercise, and for the parents to later be looking after/nursing the spawn in the first few weeks of their lives. A 20 gal tank is usually the norm for this phase of the breeding process, and following that, one or more larger tanks will be needed to accommodate the growth of the young fish as they begin to get larger, after having been separated from the parents.

The assumption here is that anyone wanting to get a breeding pair is keen on raising the spawns properly, and not just allowing a pair to continue the spawning process without positive result over the longer term.

So David, think about this very carefully, before you become enthused enough to pay the high price for a mated pair, only to find that what develops after that proves to be too much of a burden for you.

Hey discuspal, that was just a suggestion matt put in, I don't want a matting pair now. I want to breed them but down the road... I just want to start with juvies around 2 inches, same specie or maybe two top. I want to build the Tank so I can put it in the Living room, but I won't be breeding untill I move.

Do you think 65(36x18x24) or 90 (36x24x24) is as good as a 48" long tank with less gallons like a 55G long?>

Thanks,

[discuspaul]

I feel that any tank larger than a 55 is a more appropriate selection for anyone starting out with discus.

If you decide to begin with just 5 or 6 discus, with no tank-mates, then the 65 gal is the better approach.
If however you wish to add more discus to the initial 5 or 6 at a later date, or start off with more than 5 or 6 from the get-go, &/or keep a moderate community of dither fish in a community tank environment, then go for the 90 gal.

But please do yourself an immense favor & do not get 2" fish, no matter that the cost may be quite low & therefore that much easier on the wallet. At that size the discus are still really 'babies', with under-developed immune systems, and very prone to falling into ill health if faced with the least deterioration in water quality & conditions.

This size of fish requires large daily wcs in a bare-bottom tank, and multiple daily feedings, and anything less than that can easily compromise their health and development. Also, at that stage in their lives, if not cared for under ideal conditions, the risk of their developing into a stunted or poorly-shaped condition is high.

It's false economy to go the 2" route, as you run the real risk of dropping many $$ in lost fish that you would not likely face if you got fish of double that size from the outset.

So please consider starting off with discus of very near, or larger, than the 4" size, and obtained only from a well-known reputable & experienced supplier of quality discus ( not a LFS or an unknown breeder who has not established a good reputation).

Do that and your chances of success are high - other approaches will likely produce unsatisfactory results.

[vdavidguerrero]

Thanks for taking your time to response Paul.

I think I will do that, I still have a long road until I get to buying the fish, since I will be building this tank and its filter, I'm trying to design a Water changer, and all the good stuff and also have to wait for it to cycle. I think I will go with 65G if I want to keep my GF :p.

Thanks!

[MadMatt]

65g tall is a great tank for 5 older juveniles, 4" is a good size, they will be very forgiving, I would have suggested nothing under 3inch for the same reason Paul suggested.
Discus are pretty easy to raise and keep, don't let these guys scare or intimidate you, the secret is very simple;
Ultra ultra clean clean water and large daily water changes. If you can do this they're pretty easy to keep.
Remember, you keep the water, the water keeps the Discus, so just keep awesome clean clean water and keep up with those water changes and the rest will follow.
As far as raising a spawn its challenging to say the least and this is why so many of us do it, once you get over the keeping good healthy fish hump, you will want the challenge of spawning and raising. Nothing quite beats the sight when they all break free (from the cone) and feed of the parents slime coat. It's a real feeling of accomplishment, watching them grow into juveniles its something that I think all accomplished aquarium-ist should experience. But it does take dedication or you will have major failures as you go, not to mention trouble shooting anything that could araise with municiple water, etc.
The 65g tall size I love, remember Discus love to swim up and down, so the height they will love. Try to resist the feeling to want to jam more fish in the tank then 5 Discus, if you crowd them it will be hard to keep the water super clean and the Discus won't have room to move naturally.
Ever seen two male Discus spar???
It's awesome.
I have a 120g show tank with only 7 of my favorite adults and two older juveniles, my wife and myself really get to see the natural behavior of this awesome fish.


Thanks for taking your time to response Paul.

I think I will do that, I still have a long road until I get to buying the fish, since I will be building this tank and its filter, I'm trying to design a Water changer, and all the good stuff and also have to wait for it to cycle. I think I will go with 65G if I want to keep my GF :p.

Thanks!

[discuspaul]

Thanks for taking your time to response Paul.

I think I will do that, I still have a long road until I get to buying the fish, since I will be building this tank and its filter, I'm trying to design a Water changer, and all the good stuff and also have to wait for it to cycle. I think I will go with 65G if I want to keep my GF :p.

Thanks!

Good for you David.
Feel free to contact me when you're ready to get the discus - just let me know where you're located, and I'll be happy to direct you to the best source nearest to you for getting high quality discus.