Fighting > Food

[Dff]

Hi guys,I am, a novice in Discus and have started recently. Due to my inexperience, I would like to seek some advice. Though I've been keeping exotic fishes like Asian Arowana and Black Diamond Rays for years, there's still so much I have to learn from you guys, so I hope you bear with me.

I'm sure guys on here have had experiences where discus exhibited rather persistent aggression between each other, in my case, they even prefer to pick fights rather than eat. What do you guys do to discourage this behavior?

Here's a little background on the fish.

A month ago i started a 250 gal planted tank. While looking for fish to stock up, I chanced upon these 3 discus in my local shop. They looked to have just arrived, but the shop had them in a makeshift container, with no possibility of viewing from the front. Net them out and had a look, looked to be of rather decent quality so I bit the bullet and brought them home.

Video of the setup then:

https://youtu.be/ods6AZ40mjU

Newbie mistake of popping them into an unestablished planted tank, which I've come to realise after much reading on this forum since. They already had sunken bellies when they first arrived, and being in that tank didnt help. After 2 weeks, noticed HITH on 2 of them. Having taken such a liking to them, I went to prepare a 30gal bare bottom tanks with sponge filters. Treated with metro and did daily water changes for them. Tank was set at 88deg F, pH at 6.5. Fish have now started healing and the HITH seems to be closing up. Fish have become more active, which is where my problems started. The bigger marlboro which has become more aggressive, preferring to chase the san merah around. The albino turk, on the other hand, is less prone to getting bullied.

Here is a video of the aggression:

https://youtu.be/eVwt_eXjG4A


Food consumption level for the marlboro and san merah is lower as a result, they still are with sunken bellies, but the albino has been eating well and thus no longer has a sunken belly. Fecal matter for all 3 are all black and normal. Even when food is dropped in, interest in it is there, but the 2 reds would go back to sparring soon after, except the albino, which will prefer to eat. I feed a varied diet, consisting of Hikari Discus Bio-gold, Tetrabits, Frozen Bloodworm and beefheart.

Is there anyway which I can encourage more food intake or lower aggression?

I do have another 30gal bare tank and sponge filters ready, am thinking if i should separate the fish. If so, should I do it by removing the big aggressor, or should i separate by sex, correct me if i'm wrong, but I believe the albino and the marlboro are males, and the san merah, a female.

Fish are around 5inch+.

Thanks for reading and sorry for the long posts.

Any suggestions and recommendations are greatly appreciated.

[Second Hand Pat]

Hi Brandon, if you do some reading you will find that best to get discus in groups of six or more. This helps to spread the aggression. The aggression in the vid is pretty normal. I think you should leave them together for now and spread the food about the tank. Glad you are seeing signs of improvement. I would suggest allowing them to continue to heal and you get up to speed on these guys quick. Especially in the areas of general care, quarantining new fish etc. Here's a great video about general care which is a must see for any discus keeper. It was done by Al who is owner and admin on Simply. You will find other stickies in the beginner section to be useful also.
Pat


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VXe3VKh7qF8

[rickztahone]

Hi Brandon, if you do some reading you will find that best to get discus in groups of six or more. This helps to spread the aggression. The aggression in the vid is pretty normal. I think you should leave them together for now and spread the food about the tank. Glad you are seeing signs of improvement. I would suggest allowing them to continue to heal and you get up to speed on these guys quick. Especially in the areas of general care, quarantining new fish etc. Here's a great video about general care which is a must see for any discus keeper. It was done by Al who is owner and admin on Simply. You will find other stickies in the beginner section to be useful also.
Pat


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VXe3VKh7qF8

Pat hit it right on the nose. You want a larger group which is why you are seeing the aggression. That tank is beautiful, and my guess is that if you were to place them in there, the aggression would substantially lessen, but then again, it the tank is so large it would make feeding rather difficult for them as well. A larger group is your best bet. The quality of these discus isn't bad for LFS stock, however, if you were to go back to that LFS, make sure you quarantine any new fish coming in for a few weeks.

[Dff]

Hi Pat, thanks for the swift reply. I've been and will continue to read up on them, and thanks for the link and advice.
I've also read that it is recommended to keep them at least in groups of 6, but am a little hesistant on keeping that number in this tank size. My growout tank on the lower tier has six 2inchers in them and they are doing great, basically pigging out whenever I feed them. Maybe its because of the contrast in feeding styles of these 2 tanks, but should I have any immediate concerns about the sunken bellies. If there aren't any, I'll just continue to do the same regime and spread food out amongst them.

Thanks again!

Will definitely continue to read up as much as I can. This site is like an online library!

[rickztahone]

Hi Pat, thanks for the swift reply. I've been and will continue to read up on them, and thanks for the link and advice.
I've also read that it is recommended to keep them at least in groups of 6, but am a little hesistant on keeping that number in this tank size. My growout tank on the lower tier has six 2inchers in them and they are doing great, basically pigging out whenever I feed them. Maybe its because of the contrast in feeding styles of these 2 tanks, but should I have any immediate concerns about the sunken bellies. If there aren't any, I'll just continue to do the same regime and spread food out amongst them.

Thanks again!

Will definitely continue to read up as much as I can. This site is like an online library!

The sunken bellies could simply have been because they came in from an importer to the LFS which would have been fasting prior to the ship. Some good food and clean water should help with the sunken belly. However, you noticed the HITH which is an added problem so you seem to have taken care of that. They are now eating, so I say continue doing what you are doing. Try not to mix the 2 different sized groups as the smaller ones would suffer during feeding and overall growth.

[Dff]

Hi Rick, thanks for chiming in and the compliment on the tank, still learning as I go!
I usually do quarantine for all my new fish when adding them to a prestocked tank. In this instance, I skipped it because the tank was empty=bad decision.
I reckon I'm not going to add the discus back into the same 250gal tank, as I wouldnt be able to do as frequent water changes due to the sheer volume. I currently do 80% daily water changes in the 30gal tank.
Those in the grow out tank won't be mixed with these larger ones, (growth inhibitation of smaller fish when mixed with larger fish is also exhibited in an asian arowana community, which is at least one mistake I managed to avoid based on experience.)
Alternatively, I do have another four 30gal tanks ready to go, after I've read enough... Guess I'm quite deeply poisoned!

[rickztahone]

Hi Rick, thanks for chiming in!
I usually do quarantine for all my new fish when adding them to a prestocked tank. In this instance, I skipped it because the tank was empty=bad decision.
I reckon I'm not going to add the discus back into the same 250gal tank, as I wouldnt be able to do as frequent water changes due to the sheer volume. I currently do 80% daily water changes in the 30gal tank.
Alternatively, I do have another four 30gal tanks ready to go, after I've read enough... Guess I'm quite deeply poisoned!

well, the good news is that you didn't do anything wrong introducing new discus in to an empty tank. The bad news is that you shouldn't have put only 3 discus in there, it is just too big for 3 of them. I also saw some angels there, were they there previously? Angels can carry pathogens that discus are less resiliant to.

[Dff]

The angels were added a few days after the discus. The angel and other fish, prior to being added, were treated with sodium nifurstyrenate, befuran and metro, to rid them of pathogens and bacteria for 2 weeks.

I know I should have read up before I bought the discus, but I only found out about the 6 or more recommendation days prior to shifting them out.
Looking forward, what would be the recommendation for this 3 fish after they heal? Should I move them to a bigger tank and add more mates, or do I hope that 2 pair up and then shift the odd one out into another tank?
Adding more fish to a tank this size, would it be a good idea?

[rickztahone]

The angels were added a few days after the discus. The angel and other fish, prior to being added, were treated with sodium nifurstyrenate, befuran and metro, to rid them of pathogens and bacteria for 2 weeks.

I know I should have read up before I bought the discus, but I only found out about the 6 or more recommendation days prior to shifting them out.
Looking forward, what would be the recommendation for this 3 fish after they heal? Should I move them to a bigger tank and add more mates, or do I hope that 2 pair up and then shift the odd one out into another tank?
Adding more fish to a tank this size, would it be a good idea?


You are in a very precarious situation my friend. Moving forward, you HAVE TO QT which means that these 3 fish will be beating each other up in the mean time. I'll let others chime in as I really do not know what the best approach might be.

[Dff]

Seems like I've got a change in the problem.

Apparently, the 2 reds seem to have taken a liking to each other.


https://youtu.be/u0C5hDMOxVU

Managed to catch them doing this almost all the time.

So, is my best bet trying to get a single adult girl, quarantine her for the next 6 weeks, and introduce her to the albino in another tank to try and get 2 pairs instead?

Any help is appreciated!

Thanks!