female eating frys

[monching]

History:
Young pair about 16 months old.
spawned twice in my community tank both times eggs were eaten.
transfered them in their own 20 gal. Breeding tank.
Spawned trice with few wigglers and was told the chances of them being
eaten for being fewer than normal.
The last spawning gave me around 15 fry but the female started eating
them on their 4th day of free swimming.
Is this normal? The first 2 spawn were eaten right after free swim and the
last spawn was 4 days after free swim. I already though they will
push through with it as they are growing fast just to see them eaten by the mama.
Should I leave them together until they learn or separate them for now?
Feedback will be highly appreciated.

[Keith Perkins]

I'm guessing either you've rarely or never raised a batch of fry before the way your post is presented. Assuming that's the case no doubt you're anxious for the experience. Normally so few fry isn't worth bothering with, but if you've never done it before that kind of changes things. Next time around why don't you try removing the female before the fry go free swimming and see how dad does alone with the fry. If you can get the fry to 3 weeks old or so you can reunite the parents and see if they can get it right on there own then while you take care of the first batch.

[monching]

I'm guessing either you've rarely or never raised a batch of fry before the way your post is presented. Assuming that's the case no doubt you're anxious for the experience. Normally so few fry isn't worth bothering with, but if you've never done it before that kind of changes things. Next time around why don't you try removing the female before the fry go free swimming and see how dad does alone with the fry. If you can get the fry to 3 weeks old or so you can reunite the parents and see if they can get it right on there own then while you take care of the first batch.

You are dead right Keith :) I'm relatively new to the hobby (15 months to be exact) and this pair is my very first true pair although I have another 4 pairs in my community tank that keeps on laying eggs week after week. I was already told by the gurus on the forum about the chances of them being eaten due to their numbers that is fewer than normal and the pair are young and inexperience. The sight of them growing up close and personal is also one reason I want the babies to live even just a few and at the same time making the pair proven that they can raise babies. Now my 15 fry is down to 4 on its 5th day. I believe the female want to spawn again 'cause she's starting to do this shaking/quivering thingy. I was also told that patience is a virtue and just leave them alone and they will figure it out and will do it right soon. Just curious about why care for the babies for 5 days and just eat them after.
Thanks for the input and might try your suggestion if the mama will still do the same. I have no problem with the papa as he is so caring base on my observation and the mama will just eat the baby if it happens to pass in front of her.

FYI the mama in question is the one in my avatar. :)

[Akili]

FYI the mama in question is the one in my avatar. :)That's one pretty female.

[DonMD]

You can also try putting a screen or cage around the breeding cone just after they lay and fertilize the eggs. I have done that many times. You can search the forum for posts on breeding cone screens, I'm sure there must be a lot of posts on how to make them.

[CliffsDiscus]

You can remove the fry on the third day before the female eats them, and feed fresh hatch bbs.

Cliff

[pastry]

Wait, you ended up lately with a few fry? So possibly two problems: (1) female eating spawn and (2) low low hatch rate? Or is she eating "some" here and there?

[monching]

You can also try putting a screen or cage around the breeding cone just after they lay and fertilize theeggs wigs. I have done that many times. You can search the forum for posts on breeding cone screens, I'm sure there must be a lot of posts on how to make them.


Thanks for the input Don but my problem is not the egg being eaten but the fry. Both of them will tend the eggs, seen them fanning the eggs with their fins up to putting the wigglers back each time wiggler detached from the cone. Then they will take care of them(in the last case for 3 days) just to see them eaten by the mama.

[Akili]

Next Time take the mama out just before they go free swimming, see if that helps.

[Larry Bugg]

I think the first thing you need to figure out is why you are having such a low hatch rate.

Domestic discus still carry a lot of the instincts from their wild ancestors. The reason fish have such a large spawn is because the chances of survival in the wild are low. They have large spawns so in the end a few will survive. When they have a small spawn they will instinctively eat the eggs/fry and spawn again hoping for a larger spawn so the odds of a few surviving increases.

[nc0gnet0]

I think the first thing you need to figure out is why you are having such a low hatch rate.

Domestic discus still carry a lot of the instincts from their wild ancestors. The reason fish have such a large spawn is because the chances of survival in the wild are low. They have large spawns so in the end a few will survive. When they have a small spawn they will instinctively eat the eggs/fry and spawn again hoping for a larger spawn so the odds of a few surviving increases.

^^this^^

Don't dink around with 15 fry, figure out why your hatch rate is so low, address it, and raise an appropriate amount of fry.

[monching]

I think the first thing you need to figure out is why you are having such a low hatch rate.

Domestic discus still carry a lot of the instincts from their wild ancestors. The reason fish have such a large spawn is because the chances of survival in the wild are low. They have large spawns so in the end a few will survive. When they have a small spawn they will instinctively eat the eggs/fry and spawn again hoping for a larger spawn so the odds of a few surviving increases.

Thanks for the reply Larry,
Base on my observation, the male is not hitting it right 'cause the female lays her eggs too low on the cone and the male being bigger is having a hard time doing it right. I had a good hatch rate the first time I transfered them in their own breeding tank which I started a thread (fry having problem finding mom and dad) and end up being eaten, next one is low so is the last one that end up being eaten also. The only difference right now is they let the fry eat and grow for 5 days before mama fish starts eating them.

[nc0gnet0]

Find a way to raise the cone up a bit by placing it one a makeshift stand of some sort. Your not going to "fix" this problem (parents eating small bathes of fry). Again, put your efforts into larger hatch rates.

[monching]

Find a way to raise the cone up a bit by placing it one a makeshift stand of some sort. Your not going to "fix" this problem (parents eating small bathes of fry). Again, put your efforts into larger hatch rates.

Will do the best I can Bro. Just arrived home and found the last remaining 4 fry still alive. Their 6th day.

[Akili]

^^this^^

Don't dink around with 15 fry, figure out why your hatch rate is so low, address it, and raise an appropriate amount of fry.Ramon not trying to hijack your thread,What size of spawn is worth the effort?

[monching]

Ramon not trying to hijack your thread,What size of spawn is worth the effort?
I fully understand what you mean, I would love to have at least 80% hatch rate or more. I'm not in a hurry anyway. I have no where to put it, just want to experience having fry and see them grow.

[Akili]

I fully understand what you mean, I would love to have at least 80% hatch rate or more. I'm not in a hurry anyway. I have no where to put it, just want to experience having fry and see them grow.The reason I am asking is that my young turquoise pair spawned 10 days ago for the very first time and there is about 36 fry attached. Being the first successful spawn it will kind of a hard decision to cull.

[monching]

The reason I am asking is that my young turquoise pair spawned 10throughys ago for the very first time and there is about 36 fry attached. Being the first successful spawn it will kind of a hard decision to cull.

You are definitely right, I will not cull mine just in case the 4 remaining fry pulls through. I'm not a breeder, just a plain hobbyist who would like to experience breeding and having fry.

[Akili]

You are definitely right, I will not cull mine just in case the 4 remaining fry pulls through. I'm not a breeder, just a plain hobbyist who would like to experience breeding and having fry.I am a hobbyist too just like you.By the way what part of GTA you are in?. I am about an hour drive to the east of GTA.

[monching]

I am a hobbyist too just like you.By the way what part of GTA you are in?. I am about an hour drive to the east of GTA.

Etobicoke, Bloor and Westmall

[Akili]

Etobicoke, Bloor and WestmallCouple of Local Fish Stores just west of you have some nice looking Discus.

[monching]

Couple of Local Fish Stores just west of you have some nice looking Discus.
Yup Mississauga Aquarium is just 5 kms. from me. That's where I got my juvies December of 2014, the ones that are laying eggs right now and this pair in question.

[John_Nicholson]

Most pairs will not mess around with less than approximately 20. For me anything under 50 is seldom worth my time, effort, and tank space.

-john

[Akili]

Most pairs will not mess around with less than approximately 20. For me anything under 50 is seldom worth my time, effort, and tank space.

-johnI made a deal with my wife.This spawn as it is the very first,it is going to be saved but in the future only 40 or more.

[monching]

Most pairs will not mess around with less than approximately 20. For me anything under 50 is seldom worth my time, effort, and tank space.

-john
I hear you John�� but you're a legit breeder and I'm not. I'm still in the learning curve of the hobby. I'm not in anyway want to be a breeder but rather just want to experience the same. I don't have a space to grow them out anyway. If ever the time will come and I will have a 40++ hatch rate, they will be sold and will just keep a few of each batch for my community tank and future pairs.

4 remaining fry still alive, mama stop eating them.

[Akili]

Ramon let's hope next spawn is not "Dinner"☺

[monching]

Ramon let's hope next spawn is not "Dinner"☺

Hoping and praying :)