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Cichlids
05-20-2016, 03:47 PM
I can't seem to figure out these discus. I had 8 and lost 2 they all seemed energetic and then 2 of them went into the corner and went almost black and stopped eating then died. I now have 6 and have noticed that a couple are doing the same thing again. However they all eat like crazy when I feed them and I also noticed that they have a pecking order on who is the top of the chain. Here is some pics of what I am dealing with.

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They go nuts eating

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This guy is the top of the chain I have noticed

http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n16/Cichlids7/20160520_132454.jpg

When they see me they go up to the front of the glass

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same thing when I sit down.

I am not sure if the clown loaches are causing them stress. I don't see them constantly harassing them all the other tank mates leave them alone. I plan to move them out with the rummy nose tetras and corys at month end into an aquascaped 105 gallon I am doing. I hope this helps. I would post a pic of the discus when they go black but since the back of my tank is painted black you can't really see them.

I do 50% water change 5 out of the 7 days a week.

Akili
05-20-2016, 05:17 PM
When Discus turn dark , it's a sure sign of stress or disease and since you have lost some, disease may have been the cause.You will have to medicate all of them.Move them all to a Quarantine tank.

nolefan
05-20-2016, 05:21 PM
What's your water schedule change like ? What type of filtration are you using ? Do you soley feed frozen bloodworms ?

LizStreithorst
05-20-2016, 05:25 PM
Their environment isn't ideal. It might be a water quality issue.

Akili
05-20-2016, 06:15 PM
I do 50% water change 5 out of the 7 days a week.


What's your water schedule change like ? What type of filtration are you using ? Do you soley feed frozen bloodworms ?


Their environment isn't ideal. It might be a water quality issue.Water quality issuse with a schedule like that OP did mention "I do 50% water change 5 out of the 7 days a week."

Cichlids
05-21-2016, 02:55 AM
The water is quite hard here. They will not be in that tank for much longer before I move them over. The new setup up will have fluval canister filter w/o carbon with an inline uv sterilizer follow by a CO2 injection inline on the output side. Right now I am just running a aquaclear filter. I feed them bloodworms/pellets/flakes/brine shrimp and beefheart.

Akili
05-21-2016, 06:34 AM
Mike a couple of suggestions when you do your new setup insert a foam on the intake of the fluval canister filter and do not use CO2 in the night.

Filip
05-21-2016, 07:55 AM
Transfer them in a QT-BB tank and change 80-90% water daily , siphon the poop and food remaining after eating .
Give them a couple of weeks with this regime and they will recover .

My guess is that dirty substrate and maybe dirty filters causes bacterial and nitrate issues , and the only thing that compensates a bit and keeps discus alive are frequent WCs that you preform.

Second Hand Pat
05-21-2016, 08:26 AM
Hi Mike, part of the problem you are having so being a beginner with discus and maintaining them in a planted tank. If you are new to both it would be best to learn the skill sets separately (planted tank and discus) and combine them in the future. I doubt the new setup is going to help you maintain the discus well. Do a little research on both and see what you think. :)
Pat

Cichlids
05-21-2016, 01:46 PM
Mike a couple of suggestions when you do your new setup insert a foam on the intake of the fluval canister filter and do not use CO2 in the night.

I have it set on a solenoid that has a timer that works at the same time that the lights are on. No light No CO2.

Cichlids
05-21-2016, 01:48 PM
Hi Mike, part of the problem you are having so being a beginner with discus and maintaining them in a planted tank. If you are new to both it would be best to learn the skill sets separately (planted tank and discus) and combine them in the future. I doubt the new setup is going to help you maintain the discus well. Do a little research on both and see what you think. :)
Pat

been reading this forum and I don't see myself keeping may fish in the new setup

http://forum.simplydiscus.com/showthread.php?55440-So-ya-wanna-planted-Discus-tank

Cichlids
05-21-2016, 01:51 PM
Transfer them in a QT-BB tank and change 80-90% water daily , siphon the poop and food remaining after eating .
Give them a couple of weeks with this regime and they will recover .

My guess is that dirty substrate and maybe dirty filters causes bacterial and nitrate issues , and the only thing that compensates a bit and keeps discus alive are frequent WCs that you preform.

I think that the loaches are also a stress factor for them and they will soon be removed as well. I might start doing 90% daily next week I just need to move the heater and filter intake down to accomadate such large water changes.

These fish are not like anything else I have had over the past 30 years.

Las Vegas
05-21-2016, 02:01 PM
I agree with Pat. 1st learn the water conditions with the fish in a bare bottom tank. Doing a planted tank is an experienced level of Discus keeping. In a planted tank your Discus will seem fine in the first few months but then "surprise"! illness, sickness and death just instantly happen. And really it's because a beginner discus keeper didn't learn about proper care. Goodluck.

Las Vegas
05-21-2016, 02:03 PM
Oh I have 4 Discus with 2 clown loaches and 2 tiger loaches in a 40 gal tank with no problems.

LizStreithorst
05-21-2016, 02:39 PM
Just wait...I don't know about tiger loaches but clown loaches grow very large. They are also very active. They are not good tank mates for Discus.

Las Vegas
05-21-2016, 03:08 PM
Yes, I know how big clown loaches can get. Right now, my Discus are 5" and the 2 clown loaches are 3" and tiger loaches 2". I don't know how big these tiger loaches will get but they've been this small size now for awhile. Kinda like they stopped growing. They never bother any fish. The clown loaches, if they are not on the bottom scouring the glass bottom, they swim up to the top face of the glass when it's feeding time along side the discus. But if there ever is a domestic dispute between these two groups, my Discus will get the favoritism.

Akili
05-21-2016, 03:57 PM
There never has been a problem with clown loaches when ever I have had them with my Discus.In the book Discus Fish The King of All Aquqrium Fish by Eberhard Schulze Clown Loaches are most suitable, they make very effective scavengers.

Quintin
05-21-2016, 06:27 PM
For now move ur discus to bare bottom tank for grow out phase.feed lots.syphon uneaten food and do lots of water changes.ur discus allready stunted some more than others but can still turn out ok.best of luck.but growing out sdiscus with gravel and plants and fish that outperform them at feeding wont end well.if any sick discus keep seperate in hospital tank for now.the one with clamped fins dark color and heavy bars mite have flagelates allready.ps black back ground also tends to make discus turn dark and pigeon strains to pepper violently

Cichlids
05-22-2016, 03:05 AM
I find the Discus are the more aggressors when I feed. I didn't realize that you can stunt their growth in the juvenile stage.

nolefan
05-22-2016, 03:28 PM
I've always had clown loaches with discus with no issues I think over time they help the discus calm down and not spook over every little movement .. My discus sees anyone near the tank they think it's feeding time .. And clown loaches grow really really slow ..

Cichlids
05-24-2016, 03:15 AM
Its tank setup like these that have me confused about Discus in general. Nevermind the arowana with cardinals....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QUQFFYTPOQE

Second Hand Pat
05-24-2016, 08:05 AM
Hi Mike, if you are referring to keeping discus in a heavily planted tank? It can be done successfully once the needs of both discus and a planted tank are well practiced and understood. Here on Simply we do try and steer new discus keepers away from keeping discus in a planted tank until they are successful with keeping discus well for awhile. We also suggest only marrying the two if the discus keeper is well versed in keeping both separately.
Pat

Filip
05-25-2016, 03:29 AM
Its tank setup like these that have me confused about Discus in general. Nevermind the arowana with cardinals....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QUQFFYTPOQE


Fancy pics and vids on the net can be very misleading because they lack any longterm information, journal or a timeline behind them.
Many of this heavily planted discus tanks often end up with sick discus , but we never get the chance to see that side of the story.

Darcon
05-25-2016, 05:38 AM
but we never get the chance to see that side of the story

I agree in 100% with you, Filip.

When I just started with discus, I wonder about planted tank. I wonder about something like this:

9817298173

Very fast I realized, that it's almost not possible.
I don't want to judge whether the tanks above are true or have been prepared only for the exhibition or photos. It's not a case.
I know that maintaining such a tank for a few months it would be a huge effort.
Already my old tank, which you can see bottom, I've had a lot of work.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DCRYfMXgE8g

and I would not call it planted tank...

William1
05-25-2016, 10:40 AM
Your's is cooler. You've got some big fish in there! Very nice .

Cichlids
05-27-2016, 03:40 PM
Well I ran a Nitrite NO2 test and have 0ppm and a pH of about 7.5 before I did a 75% water change. They all seem to be ok for now but will see.

DISCUS STU
05-27-2016, 04:39 PM
These are great pictures! Love this stuff! Even though Your're top of the pack fish is stunted so you need to plug into the disease and treatment section to figure out what steps to take. As in the picture, Discus will generally eat blood worms enthusiastically even if they eat nothing else, when they stop doing even that then you know that you have a disease problem though the give away is that they will only eat blood worms, that's the time to treat them.

Las Vegas
05-28-2016, 02:50 AM
Looking at the vid, to me, it looks like the gills are flared a bit. They seem to be breathing a bit harder than normal. I think you might want to investgate that. Gill flukes?

Darcon
05-28-2016, 09:07 AM
Thanks for helping guys :) but it's my old tank. I closed it one year ago. Maybe I should not pull this topic here, but I hope that Cichlids doesn't be angry.
Discus Stu: yes, It was just after started bacterial conflict after added new discus... and yes, the biggest one, take it the most. Not all discus, which you can see survived...
Las Vegas: I made this video, just after feeding beef heart mix, I wanted filming standing discus, like cows on the meadow :)
Resume, it's old story... but thanks for your good intentions :)

For consolation, fishes a few months later in the day before the sale :)

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Cichlids
05-28-2016, 10:53 AM
what size were your discus?

Darcon
05-28-2016, 12:00 PM
About 6.5 - 7.0 in. I bought them adults.

Cichlids
06-16-2016, 09:44 PM
Well it has almost been a month with no issues. I changed up the water change schedule to 70% every second day and added some black worms in their diet I got from CAF and they seem to be doing quite well. In fact they are the most aggressive fish in the tank.

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I have been working on a project for these guys I plan to move slowly over in about 3 months once I get the bioload established. Here is a pic but this is for another thread...
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