Ornidazole vs metronidazole for hex

[Dhavalsp]

Has anyone tried using ornidazoleinstead of metro... better half life and fewer side effects...

What do you all think?!

[John_Nicholson]

Since nearly every fish swimming has hex I would say you are probably treating the secondary issue. You will have far better success figuring out what is causing your fish to not be able to cope with the hex like every other healthy fish in the world does.

-john

[Second Hand Pat]

Has anyone tried using ornidazoleinstead of metro... better half life and fewer side effects...

What do you all think?!

Dhaval, you have any research (links) on Ornidazole being used in fish? I could not find anything with a quick search.
Pat

[bluelagoon]

This is what I found.https://www.researchgate.net/publication/288116389_Oral_treatment_trials_on_telescope_fish_ Carassius_auratus_experimentally_infected_with_Ich thyophthirius_multifiliis_Fouquet_1876

[pitdogg2]

only problem i see is all the trade names are wrong for the drugs. Flagyl is metronidazole,Ornisid is Ornidazole and Flagentyl is Secnidazole in the USA.

Metronidazole 36 and 24mg/kg B.W. day Ornisid®
Secnidazole 36 and 24mg/kg B.W. day Flagyl®
Ornidazole 36 and 24mg/kg B.W. day Flagentyl®

[Dhavalsp]

Interesting article.

I think ornidazole has almost double the half life, so basically we have more drug in the water even at 24 hours. Additionally, the treatment time is shorter due to high potency.

I am treating my fish with metro already, so I will not be switching over, I was thinking of following up 10 metro treatment with 5 day ornidazole, if needed. (then might as well drop the fish off at the nearest drug addiction center)

[Dhavalsp]

Since nearly every fish swimming has hex I would say you are probably treating the secondary issue. You will have far better success figuring out what is causing your fish to not be able to cope with the hex like every other healthy fish in the world does.

-john

I John, I completely understand your point. I am investigating, but I have not changed anything so this is a difficult case to solve... I am really clueless, only thing I can think of is that I am mixing more warm water to get the temperature correct. I have been using straight tap water for over 9 months now...the ph swing is next to zero....I think the warm water I introducing more bubbles which is making them uncomfortable for about 15 mins post WC(> 80 % daily)... another thing could be hoses on canister filter...I will keep looking...

[bluelagoon]

Maybe the micro bubbles are still stressing them a bit and over time stress = issues.Just a thought.....We do not know your WC routine.

[atlantadiscus]

I John, I completely understand your point. I am investigating, but I have not changed anything so this is a difficult case to solve... I am really clueless, only thing I can think of is that I am mixing more warm water to get the temperature correct. I have been using straight tap water for over 9 months now...the ph swing is next to zero....I think the warm water I introducing more bubbles which is making them uncomfortable for about 15 mins post WC(> 80 % daily)... another thing could be hoses on canister filter...I will keep looking...

Hoses on canister filter? What could they be contributing?

[Dhavalsp]

Hi Mervin, i do about 80-90% WC daily...

The hose on canister catches a lot of gunk on inner walls...i generally rinse it with hot water every 3-4 months...

[atlantadiscus]

Gunk may be unattractive,but it does not promote parasites.

[Second Hand Pat]

Interesting article.

I think ornidazole has almost double the half life, so basically we have more drug in the water even at 24 hours. Additionally, the treatment time is shorter due to high potency.

I am treating my fish with metro already, so I will not be switching over, I was thinking of following up 10 metro treatment with 5 day ornidazole, if needed. (then might as well drop the fish off at the nearest drug addiction center)

My one concern with ornidazole is it's possible effect on internal organs due to it's higher potency. Also note that in the study linked ornidazole was being used for an external parasite. When treating internally the meds take about five days to have any effect.
Pat

[Dhavalsp]

Gunk may be unattractive,but it does not promote parasites.

well, I always thought otherwise. Gunk = impurities = source of bacteria and parasites and all other dreadful things...if not, then I can rule that out...

[Dhavalsp]

My one concern with ornidazole is it's possible effect on internal organs due to it's higher potency. Also note that in the study linked ornidazole was being used for an external parasite. When treating internally the meds take about five days to have any effect.
Pat

agreed, we need an experiment...

I have tried Ornidazole on German Rams some time ago, they recovered but I lost them few months down the line...not sure if I can conclude anything from this...

[Dhavalsp]

General question on Hex, after treating with Metro (400mg/10Gallon), within how many days do you notice that Fish has stopped pooping that white stringy stuff? Thanks!

[Dhavalsp]

during medication, I generally add Epsom salt and Metro at the same time when I drain the tank for WC. Do you think Salt and Med react, making the treatment less effective? Also, do you recommend use of salt during Metro treatment?

[Second Hand Pat]

I use Epsom salt if one or more fish are bloated or swimming with their head slightly pointed downward.
Pat

[pitdogg2]

well, I always thought otherwise. Gunk = impurities = source of bacteria and parasites and all other dreadful things...if not, then I can rule that out...

that "gunk" is beneficial bacteria.

[Dhavalsp]

that "gunk" is beneficial bacteria.

Honestly, I was not aware of that...I always thought that was due to waste accumulation...and was of no benefit at all...I need to research this further...

[Dhavalsp]

I may have found trhe source of the issue. My pleco has been pooping long stringy poop too...I thought this was normal earlier but my reading from last few days tells me otherwise. She eats well and still has poop which is long and connected with transparent links..

here is a video of pleco poop: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i78O0o-Peek

How do I go about this now...

[brewmaster15]

Interesting article.

I think ornidazole has almost double the half life, so basically we have more drug in the water even at 24 hours. Additionally, the treatment time is shorter due to high potency.

I am treating my fish with metro already, so I will not be switching over, I was thinking of following up 10 metro treatment with 5 day ornidazole, if needed. (then might as well drop the fish off at the nearest drug addiction center)

I have no experience on ornidazole...but the comment on it having twice the half life in the water.

Half life is determined in an organism. Its often written that metro has such and such a half life in an aquarium tank..to the point that people fear its not effective so do multiple doses a day. That interpretation is wrong though...

Metro like most medications breaks down in a fish tank but I have yet to see anything on the rate it breaks down.

Half life is determined by tests in the organism and is usually related to how the liver breakdowns down a med and how its excreted. Its even possible for some brealdown components to still be effective...so no one knows what the effect of the aquarium environment is.

Hth,
Al