Breeder, Importer, and seller survey..

[brewmaster15]

Hi all,
This site has some really experienced people out there who probably have had some excellent experiences (good and bad :) ) with bringing in and shipping out fish.

I'd like to ask all the breeders, importers, and sellers and collectors out there what they reccommend for quaranteen time, and any treatments they reccommend/use themselves.


Also if they send fish out to labs when they get them as a routine, or only if there is a problem? I had started a thread on labs in teh disease board and would like to expand on it.
http://forum.simplydiscus.com//index.php?board=4;action=display;threadid=4583

Last question, can anyone shed any light on what exactly The USDA does when fish are imported into the USA. I also am interested in what other countries do when fish are imported. I have no experience with this.

Anyone with experiences here, please share

The more information you all can provide the better. I think this is a really grey area for many hobbyists and it would be great if you could shed some light on it.

Thanks,
al

[jim_shedden]

Hi Al : I had imported some small discus from Thailand almost a year ago and the Canadian gov't just wanted to make sure that the Thai's had included a bill of health. This was a certificate that was enclosed on the outside of the box. The only other thing they checked was something called EDC which checked the computer to see if the species was on the endangered list. This is why they must see the scientic name on the packing slip. Other than that there was nothing else. The health certificate made me giggle a little.

[Dennis_Hardenburge]

Al
Here goes, first I don't ship a lot of fish and not very often do I bring in new fish.
My tanks are all in the garage ( my fish room ) except one tank in the house, new fish go in the house. At one time I just used an empty tank for new fish then several years ago I purchased some new fish and with in a few days was fighting a columnaris out break in all tanks, after that episode I decided that the quarintine tank had to be totally isolated from all other tanks.
I treat all new fish for flukes and worms with a 21 day flubendazole treatment. The 21 days are my normal quarintine.
I don't send fish out unless I have a problem I can't identify.
As far as importing, all I have done is bring fish in from Canada, this requires a Fish&Wildlife inspection and all they are concerned with is the species, if wild caught they look in there little book to make sure it is not an endangered species, after the Fish&Wildlife inspection you take thier paper work and go to Customs, all Customs is concerned about is the dollar amount, if it is over $2,000 you will pay a tax. You need to let Fish&Wild life and Custom know about the arrive 48 hours in advance. This is all just minor inconvenience.
Dennis

[April]

when i got fish from Australia....they didnt even need a health certificate. but.they have very strict rules so guess their considered a safe country. just my invoice with the scientific name on it and paid my taxes and go.
but...thats canada. no import license.

[brewmaster15]

HI Dennis, april, and JIm!
Thanks for sharing your experiences here. I thought when I wrote this post it would be great one... lots of info on Quaranteen, importing experiences etc. for the hobbyist.

Viewed 192 times , and only 3 posts... Hmmm, guess it was not as interesting as I thought it would be. ::) :)

-al

[DREW]

I think it's a good post Al. I want to import some discus from Asia or Roy sometime down the road. I'm curious on the expense of it. I know some Asian price list can be cheap with some nice strains but I wonder on the expense with meds, shipping, permits, gov't hassels if any and health problems to humans or pets. I imagine their are a lot of people wondering the same kind of things but have no experience in doing it. I think Cary had a post or a reply about importing fish I'm trying to find. It talked about disease mostly, some known and some unkown health issues.

Drew

[brewmaster15]

Hi Drew! Thanks :)

The post you are looking for is Here..
http://forum.simplydiscus.com//index.php?board=10;action=display;threadid=2980

That was a great post by Cary! Information that is well worth remembering !

-al

I do not like that One!

I sound Mad >:( well the info is good the tone could be better.
And the spelling and all that other Schitt LOL! There is still alot of info left out! :oJoe a little help :o Am just not in the mood for this one anymore. Some of mine were good most were bad. How about someone with a good side of info. Come On there are lots of Breeders here that import. Come on pay Your Dues to Simply and Help out! hee.hee.hee
Cary Gld!

[brewmaster15]

Thanks Cary ,
Yes the tone was not exactly warm and friendly!, but the message was still a good one, and appreciated by many!

I know there has to be a lot of great info and experiences out there, so come on people step up to the plate.

With trade being as global as it is, sooner or latter many will try it, better to learn from those that have experience here than flying blind.

I have alway been a big advocate of quaranteening any new fish. Whether imported or domestically acquired. I'd really like to hear what every one does , especially those that do this for a business do in this regards, and why they do it?

any info here would be great!

thanks,
al


:)

;)

Brew, I am not surprised by the inactivity of the post as most people who import do not readily admit that they do. Most just say they do not import and breed everything in their hatchery. In some ways, they may feel it is a strike on the ego--who knows????? ???

USDA has nothing to do with the importation of any animals--fish included. Their juristiction encompasses plants and food. One needs a separate license for Flora and Fauna and it is not so easy to obtain.

Fish and Wildlife is the governing body for the importation of fish. Although, the US does not demand it a health certificate accompanies all my shipments. I only medicate if needed and have not had the need to in some time.

An occasional oxygen depleted fish will arrive due to a punched bag. If it has not been long--rebagging with new water and oxygen sometimes helps. Also, I have had good luck placing the fish in just enough water to cover it --thus reducing osmotic pressure and using hydrogen peroxide ( an oxygenator ) If the fish lies down for an extended period --past three days--then it most likely has brain damage due to a lack of oxygen to the brain.

Personally, I have not needed to send fish to the lab. I would not hesitate to though if something came up that I am not familiar with. It is a good idea to have the water in the receiving tanks at about 88 degrees upon arrival with additional aeration.

I see alot of people contemplating importing. Yes the license is inexpensive---but the results may not be. :'( One may have very little leverage after the sale. Many but not all exporters guarantee live delivery. Some will only replace DOA's on the next order--so it is entirely feasible that one will never completely recover if each order brings more DOA's. Try suing internationally.

My first year, I imported 3,000 pcs. Being the largest US importer from Penang--This month I am importing 800 pcs. It is a crap shoot for the little guy to import. Without a doubt, he will neither get the best fish nor best price. The cheap price lists people see are never reflective of the quality. The sweet price is soon forgotten when one "the deal" sours due to the quality. :-[ I would rather explain the price now than make excuses later! Many exporters policy for a certain price ---is contingent on the entire tank being bought. IMO, One needs to set up a relationship with the exporter as in any business proposition. I decided to import exclusively from one individual. IMO, this is the best chance one will have to get the best that individual has to offer. ;)

Shipping is expensive: From Penang via Singapore Air: $3.50 per kilo only after 100 kilos minimum ( 250 lbs.) If less than 100 kios, then it is almost double at $5.50 per kilo. There are box charges and handling charges. Costs incurred going to the port of entry. I live in Maryland and travel to New Jersey to receive the fish--3 1/2 hours each way. Time to put away the fish---typically 6-12 hours depending on the size of the shipment. If I lose any fish after the first day--they are mine and I save money on feeding them. :o

When a sale is made there is time and expense in housing the fish, conversing with the customer, reserving a flight, bagging and packing, driving to the airport and following up after the sale as most customers --even when asked do not call back right away to confirm the shipment arrived safely.

So there you have it--Everything you wanted to know about importing discus , but were afrid to ask.
Anyone wishing to import --have at it! If you received a nice Asian Discus--Thank your Exporter--If you recieve a nice one from an importer ---Kiss him or her! Regards, Joe

[Liz_Streithorst]

:-* :-*...And in advance for the 7 that are coming :-* :-* :-* :-* :-* :-* :-* :-[

Liz

[brewmaster15]

Thank you Joe!

-al

[discusadam]

I have imported just one time from Malasia and I had no problems other than paying all the fees. Going to Chicago to get the fish a 5 hour ride one way. I was able to get a waiver now and I can import to Metro Detroit airport about a 1 hour ride one way much better. However no one said what you have to do about a license. If anyone wants a license to import it costs $50 from the Fish and Wildlife service ph. 612-713-5356. Yes you can get the fish cheaper but the time and aggrivation involved most of the time if you are just interested in getting just a few fish it is not worth it.

discusadam, Thanks for your input. As Detroit Metro is not a point of entry ( which Cary can attest ) one must get a broker to trans ship the fish at an additional fee.A waiver fee is an additional $20 for two years stating you can bring fish in to any other designated port of entry other than the one listed on the license request form. The discus must clear customs at a designated port of entry which Detroit Metro is not. The additional time involved in the delay to the airport of choice may jeopordize the shipment as most exporters guarantee the cargo to original point of entry. With your particular shipment with 10 hours driving time plus 3-4 hours at O'Hare was probably worth it in gold.

I am glad you received your fish in good condition and had a good experience. The easy part is the license ---the expense occurs after they land! Once agin thanks! Joe ;)