Ralph's BB planted tank

[Ralph]

This is my first attempt at a bare bottom planted tank, along with my first attempt with a digital camera, first try at taking aquarium pics, and my first attempt at posting photos. So please be gentle.

This is an experiment to come up with a tank that is easy to care for (cleaning and WCs) that still has the look of a well planted tank. That means no substrate. It has to be easy to vacuum uneaten food and feces. It also needs to be easy to make and inexpensive. And it should be relatively easy to pull everything out of the tank for complete cleaning (or medicating). It is also a halfway step to going to a actual discus biotope, with fewer plants and more branching driftwood.
This isn't for everyone but may be an option for some people who want to reduce the amount of tank maintenance without sacrificing completely the look of a planted tank.
The stump I got from tjudy (who posts here periodically), I like the way it speads out giving the illusion of a substrate. It will eventually have more Anubias on it, but not so much as to hide the wood. It's a real nice piece.
The plants were basically thrown in at this point. I'm trying three bulb plants to see how they do without substrate. The tall one on the left (I know it's hard to see) is that Aponogeton boivinianus that I bought as an Anubias (not one of my prouder moments). It was 3" tall two weeks ago, it is close to 15" now.

This is only stage 1 and is not the final tank, I'm going to need everyone's feedback on what should be added (or removed) to (or from) the tank. My next step is to add some branching driftwood hanging from the top (not touching the bottom of the tank) with maybe some green algae on it. I'm also kicking around the idea of siliconing some sand to the bottom of the tank (which should have been my first step).
Any advice will be appreciated (except "Take better pictures").

[lcs]

I think it's looking pretty good so far! ;D 8) That is great piece of wood!! I have been considering something similar as I plan my discus tank.

How about putting in a couple potted swords? You could hide the pots behind the horizontal parts of the wood. The swords might help provide a variety in color; although they do require a considerable amount of light don't they?

I love the idea of hanging some driftwood from the top of the tank!! It would closely mimic their natural environment and look pretty cool. 8) Are you planning on just floating it on the surface? Would it float indefinitely or would it sink? How would you move it out of the way for total access to the top of the tank?

Just my $0.02!! :D

Lisa

[brewmaster15]

Hi Ralph,

I'd say you have a good start going. Something you may want to try that I have used in the past, its to take a brown nylon stocking, place some gravel in as a weight, add some spagnum peat moss, and plant a few plants in it., tie off at the top. and trim any excess stocking.
This gives you a moldable and removeable pottedplant. I used amazon swords in it but most plants should work. You could then place these in between branches of the wood.

hth,
al

[Don_Lee]

Hi Ralph,

Good beginning! I will be very interested in seeing how this develops for you. That is a very nice piece of driftwood too, great centerpiece for your tank.

Don ;D

[Ralph]

Hi Lisa,
I have some driftwood hanging in another tank. I took a narrow strip of plexiglas and cut some slots on the two ends (those catch the top edges of the tank and keep it anchored in place). I then drilled a hole in the plastic and on into the end of the driftwood, and attached the two together with a wood screw. The wood hangs down into the tank and looks great, especially where it comes down into the water.
This tank is smaller though so I will probably cut the wood so it spans the tank and the branches hang down into the water. It will just pop out for cleaning.

Hey Al,
I had thought of using a large flat piece of driftwood on the bottom of the tank (toward the front). I was going to drill some large diameter holes in it, fill them with gravel, and then put plants in it. I knew though that at some point I would spill the whole thing, either in the tank or all over my rug. I hadn't thought of your flexi-pots though (let's go into business on this).
I think something that suggested a fallen log with a couple swords growing out of it would look great.

Thanks Don (and the tank actually looks much better than the picture would suggest, my admiration for the Gipper has increased significantly). I was very happy that the picture posted though, and it wasn't easy.

[dm]

Great looking tanks Ralph.
I also really like the wood piece. It looks perfect as a centerpiece in there.
How big is the tank?

[Ralph]

Hi Dale,
It really is a nice piece of wood, the picture doesn't do it justice.
That is a 29 gal, it was my hospital tank (which I haven't needed yet). I should have known that I coldn't keep an empty tank in the house and that it would eventually fill up with fish and plants.

[ChloroPhil]

Ralph,

That's awesome! I think it will look very cool once it's completed.

Some of my thoughts are to leave the large swords out for now, most species will get too big for a 29g and the plant will quickly get root-bound if placed in a pot or other constricting holder.

I really like the idea of the overhanging branches. Have you thought about fastening some Ceratopteris to them? The hanging roots and water surface coverage would look really natural mingled with the roots and your fish will love the shade to boot.

You said you wanted this to be a first step towards a biotope tank. How strict are you going to get with the plants? If you're willing to allow a little fudging some Java Fern or Anubias would look spectacular covering that stump. Little pots of Vallisneria would be a good choice for vertical plants...and they grow like weeds.

[Ralph]

There are probably going to be about 15 variations of the "final" tank. That is really what is nice about not having a substrate. Everything goes into and out of the tank in seconds without a mess. But one of the variations will definately be the closest I can get to an actual discus biotope.
Some of the other possibilities will be:
A somewhat bare tank with minimal number of plants and wood.
A tank with leaf litter.
A thin layer of gravel or sand.
A lot of plants from all over the world.
Lots of wood and no plants.
The tree stump on the bottom.
A log type piece of wood on the bottom.
Bare bulb type plants without a substrate.
And others, however the ideas come and go. I will be taking photos of each one. Feel free to pick and choose any ideas that you like and use them in one of your tanks.
Oliver at Below Water said that he has never seen a sword plant in a discus area (my 50 gal has only swords in it), which made me rethink my approach. So they probably won't be a big part of most of the variations.
Again, suggestions are welcome.

[Chaos]

Go for it! Can't wait to see the results. Thanks for sharing your tank and experiment. Oh, you will put discus in it at the end?

[Ralph]

Discus? Oh yeah, I forgot.

Actually, probably not, maybe I can photoshop a couple of them into the tank.

[brewmaster15]

Hi Ralph,
From my understanding there are few plants that are found where discus like to frequent. Mostly the areas are sandy substrate (which is why discus like to blow the food off the bottom of tanks) , a leaf liiter during the flood/breeding season, because Theses areas are generally forest floors.
as a side note,
I remember a post by oliver a long time ago(DIP maybe) where he said in all his travels there, he has never even seen discus breed on anything other than dead leaves.

Your biotype for the discus may be a simple sand tank, driftwood for cover, and dead leaves!

But I do think what ever it turns out to be, the real test of the tank will be to put discus in it!

hth,
al

[Rusty]

I love your idea. Have been thinking about trying something very similiar myself. Regards the siliconed sand, way back when I suggested this idea also I was given a pretty good reason not to. The fish can very easily scrape themselves against this. Also it's not as easy to clean as you would think. Another possibility that I got from this forum and just love the way it looks in mine is to spray paint the bottom, outside of course, with faux sand spray paint. Most people cannot tell that there is not real sand in these aquariums. Regards the hanging driftwood, I was thinking about using wood screw to try and attach large suctions cups. Then they could be hung from anywhere and still easily removed if necessary. Hope this helps. I'm really surprised about the bulbs doing so well without any substrate. Regards Al's idea of the flexible pots, do you suppose he just ties the hose to the plant. Does that cause any problems? Anyhow keep up the good work.

[brewmaster15]

Hi Rusty,
With the gravel in he bottom of the nylons, its just weighted in place in the crooks of branched or even as is and set behind a rock. I have some pics of it from a few years ago, I'll see if I can find them.

Ralph I like this thread more and more, and am thinking of redoing one of my tanks again!
:)

-al

[Ralph]

Well I think the picture taking is getting better.
I've added a branch hanging down from the top and some leaf litter, and if you didn't know already - leaf litter floats. I boiled it to kill any bad stuff and I think it will eventually get waterlogged and sink. I knew that this was going to be a learning experience.
Rusty, I hadn't even thought about the fish hurting themselves on what is basically a sandpaper bottom. My fish don't crash around much but you never know. I want to get rid of that mirror finish that you get on the tank bottom, it destoys the whole underwater illusion. What about some kind of roll up mat that looks like sand?
Al, the tank that you described is probably where I am heading with this, it is tough to say goodbye to my plants though, to me it's as bad as not having any fish.
By the way, how do get the fish to hold still during the photo?

[ChloroPhil]

I like that branch Ralph!

You don't get the fish to stay still, you use a quicker shutter speed, but for that you'll need more light.

[regal]

<Your biotype for the discus may be a simple sand tank, driftwood for cover, and dead leaves>

Dont forget the trees and shrubs, seriously I believe the trees and shrubs which grow are a key ingredient. They would help remove nitrates and I suspect their fallen leaves acidify and sterilize the water ( ever notice nothing grows around a walnut tree). the reef scene has been using mangroove trees for a while now, anyone know what type of trees and shrubs these are? A tank with a small tree growing out of it would be an aewsome site.

[tjudy]

:)

Here is an idea for you Ralph. I used to have a tank that I grew riccia in that was tied onto river pebbles. You have to wrap a lot of thread or monofilament to keep the riccia on, but then the plants grow through and cover the threads very quickly. They looked like moss covered stones. It is a neat effect. you can do it on driftwood as well. I have also done it on driftwood with Glossostigma.

[brewmaster15]

Hi regal,

That would be a sight, but don't use a walnut tree! ;) :)
Many trees put out a toxin that keep the ground bare around them....walnuts are one of them.


Incidentally,native americans used walnuts and butternuts to fish. they bruised the nut husks and threw them into thewater. These bruised husks poisoned the fish so they could eat them... nature is just way to cool.

-al