when is the time to stop powered filteration?

[wo]

Hi,

I have a pair of browns who laid eggs about 8 times but none of them hatched; the eggs either ate at day 2 or day 3. Even once I covered the eggs with wire net till the eggs became dark and looked to hatch at any momemt. So I took the net away and the female ate all of the eggs at once. So on this Tuesday morning they spawned again that I put the net on and did 20% WC with little formalin added. Today the eggs look the same but I can see the dark ring inside. It is now about 48 hours. No single eggs hatched yet. Instead the upper part of the eggs turn white.(1/3 of the whole egg) So my question are:

1) The symptom of eggs partially turned white:
a) Eggs are about to hatch.
b) The eggs are dead.

2) When is the more safe time to remove the net?
a) When they are newly hatched.
b) Hatched for 1-2 days
c) When they are free swimming?

3) I currently run the powered filteration and sponge filteration at the same time. When is the time to turn of the powered filteration?
a) Now. Shouldn't wait.
b) The moment they are hatched.
c) The 1-2 days after they are hatched.
d) When they can free swimming.

Sorry to ask so many question at a time but this is the my first and more likely to succeed experience. Thanks for your kindly helps.

[grrrr8guy]

Excellent questions I want to print this thread off after the answers come in.

grrr8guy

1) The symptom of eggs partially turned white:
a) Eggs are about to hatch.
b) The eggs are dead.
Hard to say out seeing the eggs, any pics??

2) When is the more safe time to remove the net?
a) When they are newly hatched.
b) Hatched for 1-2 days
c) When they are free swimming?
anytime you want, if they eat the wigglers they will most likely eat the fry also....but if I had to choose a time I would say as soon as they become wigglers....may eat them may not but at least it will help the parents with their parental instinct

3) I currently run the powered filteration and sponge filteration at the same time. When is the time to turn of the powered filteration?
a) Now. Shouldn't wait.
b) The moment they are hatched.
c) The 1-2 days after they are hatched.
d) When they can free swimming.
Depending on how strong of current you have...If it was on during the spawning phase and the male was still able to fertilize the eggs it must not be to strong...but be sure to have it off before the fry become free swimming...Me I would turn it off now.


HTH Randy

[wo]

Thanks Randy and Grrr8guy.

Randy:

Sadly today there are only 6 wigglers and rest of all the eggs are white with fungus on them. So it appears to me that the eggs became partially white due to fungus infection.
As soon as I removed the net today, the parents ate all the white eggs and left the 6 wigglers alone. At the first few hours they did take care of the wigglers. As this forum has discussed, the parents ate the wigglers. (too few of them) Perhaps another reason is that I was peeping at them every half an hour. (at a close distance) Next time I would not peep them anymore.

I turned off the power filteration when they were about to hatch. Well, the water flowed a little bit strong. I am afraid that the wigglers will be sucked in. As soon as the wigglers are gone I do 50% water change but did not turn the powered filter back on. Because there is a possibility that the parents put the wigglers elsewhere. I plan to turn on the filteration system after 48 hours.

By the way, thanks for your help. Have a nice weekend!

[chuck]

I agree with Randy ...
This is my experience. so take it for what it's worth... ;) ;D
1). if the eggs are white they are infertile. either you have 2 females that pretended to spawn, inmature male or male to old.
2)once the ALL the fry hatch you can remove the net usually the fry wiggling will spark the maternal instincts of the pair.
3) when the fish are spawning Ishut down the external filter. now you can just go with the sponge filter if it is a establish filter (not new).
What I do is I attach a pre filter on the intake tube this way the fry will not get sucked up and it's an extra bio filter. I turn it off when I feed the fry BBS for about 45 min.
chuck

[wo]

Chuck:

Thanks for your help! I like the idea of adding a extra sponge to the intake tube of external filter. Yesterday I went to the LFS and saw all their tanks with one sponge filter and one powered filter with sponge in the intake tube.
Here comes my question; how about large food waste or droppings? Just depend on water change? Sometimes, my discus won't eat a bit at the morning and I just turn on the powered external filter. (No time to do WC) I guess keeping discus is a never ending learning.

[harry]

HI IM NO EXPERT ,BUT I HAVE A BOOK ON DISCUS BREEDING AND IT SAYS WHEN SPAWNING ITS BEST TO TURN FILLTERS OFF AND AS SOON AS DONE TURN BACK ON ,ALSO USE A ANTI FUNGUS TREATMENT IN WATER ,GOOD LUCK,

[wo]

Hi Harry,
Thanks! They spawn again right now. I turn off the filters this time but I did not expect they will spawn so quick so I fed them with Brine Shrimp and hamburger which they did not finish. With no doubt, the water condition should be dirty. I plan to do WC later and add some formalin in the water. I hope this time would let me see the fries. Wish me luck! Thanks!

:fish:

[wo]

In order to gather more information about breeding discus, I browsed some local discus club webs site and found one article about his openion against breeding which made me do a lot of thinking. Here is the translation:
He is a amature discus keeper but bought 20 juvenile discus and 6 of them pairing up within a year. At the beginning, he met a lot of frustration and failed to have fries at the first half years. With a lot of practice, some finally succeed. He was so happy at that time. And he kept all the fries and raised by himself. As the discus kept on breeding he sold all the fries to the LFS at a good price for the first time. He felt like being heaven---he can keep his beloved discus and made money at the same time. After 2-3 times the LFS would not buy his anymore. So he posted on web to sell the fries. Most of the discus buyers from my country used to see discus parents and picked up the fries at site. So half of his fries were sold and half not. He suddenly has the feeling of falling to hell. Now he is regret for breeding them because of the hard work and no return. At the end, he put the fries to sleep. What a sad ending. Now he suggest to people who want to breed----unless you have outstanding pairs worth keeping the strain---Do not breed them if you have no space for them. Just buy the professional discus breeders-people like Al, Cary and Mike. (He mentioned the Chinese names) Let them to improve the strain of discus.
After reading the article, I am quite agreed. I do not have the space, time nor I want to sell them. So perhaps I would only let them breed once and then no more. I never gonna to put any of my fish to sleep at any time!