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Gamblet
02-18-2003, 07:29 PM
Hi all,

I'm 16 and have a 3', 39 US gallon tank in my room. Right now I'm cycling it with zebra danios, and after I plan to go into cichlids. I haven't made any decisions as to what type of cichlids though.

I know that because I'm almost a complete novice (I've read a lot, but have no experience) I'd have a lot of trouble caring for discus. Plus they cost a fortune at the LFS :p

But I'd still like to know what it takes to set up a discus tank. What's the right path for a beginner to take? Breeding wouldn't be important at the start, simply looking at them would be pleasure enough! Perhaps, if I could handle looking after them, I could get some cheap ones from a breeder.

Ryan
02-18-2003, 07:42 PM
The best thing that you can do, in my opinion, is to read through this section of the site (Discus Basics for Beginners). Go back to the very first page of this section and browse the headings for things that interest you. Many newcomers have posted in the past few weeks regarding new discus and most of the answers you are looking for are already here.

There are threads regarding tank setup, fish selection (What to Buy vs. What Not to Buy), water changes and conditioning, you name it.

After a bit of researching through the Beginners area, you can post with questions on things you are still unsure of or that you couldn't find in your reading.

Ryan

jeep
02-19-2003, 12:39 AM
I don't think you'd have a lot of trouble caring for discus especially of you're not breeding. All you have do do is decide that's what you want and get yourself into a routine.

As long as you start with healthy discus from a reliable source and read the info provided here you should be just fine.

Good luck!!!

Gamblet
02-19-2003, 04:09 AM
Thanks for your replies. I'll do some research (when I don't have homework... :p ) and see if the discus is the fish for me. If I don't go discus, angels are the next choice.

Gamblet
02-19-2003, 08:55 AM
I don't have much homework tonight, so I spent some time reading the posts. Discus keeping looks a lot harder than I thought it would, but not so hard as to be impossible.

The most dejecting thing I read is that you need at least 6 discus in your tank for them to form a pecking order. The most I could have in mine (39 US gal) is only 4 :( Does this rule out the prospect of keeping discus altogether, or will I get away with four? I see groups of threes and fours kept in lfs tanks.

Secondly, how much do baby discus cost (US$ is fine) ? As I said, I'd have four juveniles grow up together. My dad said he'd chip in for the cost of one of them, but I'd still have to pay a sizeable amount for a 16 year old!

Secondly, can someone explain what sort of filtration is needed? At the moment I have an Atman 500lph internal power filter. It agitates the whole water surface, but I suspect I'd have to upgrade for the discus. Would 1 internal power filter (how many lph?) and an air pump powered sponge filter do the job well enough? If I have to fork out a substantial amount on a new filter, then maybe keeping discus isn't for me yet. It might be too much to afford.

jeep
02-19-2003, 10:33 AM
6 is the best minimum number to have as juvies, but I started with 4 and I had no problem. All grew out big and fat and healthy on a main diet of a beef heart mixture. You're correct about not having more in your size tank. Mine was only 9 gallons more than yours.

As far as filtration goes, I'm not familiar with an Altman, but I had an Emperor 400 only and I did 30% water changes per day. And this was a planted tank (not recommended). I would think the addition of a Hydro sponge would be good in your tank for about $8 plus the air pump. Most filters will say the size of tank they are recomended for. Water changes are the most important issue in a tank the size of yours. Are you sure you couldn't spring for a 55g a few months down the road? That way you could start with 6 discus...

Keep in mind, I'm only posting my experiences. I'm not telling you what's best for you...

I don't know where you're located, but you can get quality discus juvies starting at about $25 to $30us plus shipping. Outside the US, I have not a clue but there are discus breeders all over. Check out the Buy, Sell, Trade as well as the Breeders section. Better yet, post a question for breeders in your area.

Just remember, the best (and least frustrating) way to keep discus is to start out with healthy stock and maintain good water quality. The best thing you could do is to read like Ryan said. And don't let other peoples bad experiences discourage you. Just learn from them and be prepared...

DarkDiscus
02-19-2003, 10:53 AM
Gamblet,

Welcome to the site and to the hobby!

The way I see it is this: You have two roads before you, both equally fun and enjoyable.

Road 1: Read and learn everything you can about discus you can. Listen to the advice and buy good fish and devote yourself to the discus. Only you really know if you are ready for the commitment, so think about it and make the decision. If you decide it's not the right time and you want to hold off, pick road 2.

Road 2: Go with some easier cichlids. Read a lot and learn all you can. Decide on a fish that you like and one that's pretty hardy. You can do really well with one good water change a week (not daily), there are less stringent requirements and you can more easily add decorations and/or plants to the tank.

That said, were I you at your age, I would go with the discus! I went the other route, and had a lot of fun and learned a lot about cichlids and made some money breeding them on a small scale basis. That said, here I am now at 34 and I'm just a year into discus and I wish I had the advantage of time like guys like you and some of our younger members have. By the time you guys are my age, you will be true experts on discus.

Good luck with the decision!

;)

John

Gamblet
02-19-2003, 08:19 PM
US$25? That's about how much they cost at the lfs. I thought I'd be able to get them a lot cheaper from a local breeder... I found a cichlid classifieds site for where I live (Perth, West Australia) so I'll make some enquiries there.

Just confirming, would a 500lph internal filter and a sponge thing be enough filtration for my tank? I don't mind getting a more powerful internal filter, just as long as it won't cost a fortune. I could use the Atman then to age the water before I change it (tap water here is ph 7.3, then it goes up to 8 after a day or two).

One more question for now - why do discus need so much more care than other fish? They live in the amazon right, so water conditions would fluctuate to the extremes with the different seasons. But here I get the feeling that they're very delicate.

Oops, just one more :) DarkDiscus, what would be some easier cichlids? In my tank I have a thin layer of gravel and a fair few plants ready to go in the ground.

Thanks again for the replies, I'm really enjoying learning about these wonderful fish, even though I feel like groaning when I learn how much effort is needed to look after them ;)

fossil
02-19-2003, 08:22 PM
I hear you buddy, I'm 15. Money is a big issue when dealing with discus, even more of a issue at a young age. >:( I have just saved enough money to get a new tank( just a tank) I still have to buy a filter + light gravel and plants AND fish.( and light) UHHHHH Man thats like another $200 at least...................man i should have got a new bike haha.

Cause when u get everything plus fish a 50 gallon tank will probly cost $300 at least. I'm glade so see some younger people getting into discus. Any way good luck.

DarkDiscus
02-20-2003, 10:15 AM
Gamblet,

"Easier cichlids" that you would enjoy and which could easily survive on 1 good w/c a week would be most of the central american species and a good deal of the african species.

One fish I would suggest would be the green severum. They are tough and look good and are discus-like. In the 39 gallon tank, you could go with a colony of dwarf africans - I had 2 pairs of Lamp. brichardi (daffodil) in a 45 piled to the top with rockwork and ended up with hundreds of fry and all kinds of activity. It was an absolutely gorgeous set up.

Your basic cichlids like Jack Dempseys, firemouths and the like could be lots of fun at lower cost.

Read up a bit and see what you like. Frankly, most cichlids, including discus are tough, but some just need a little less care to be perfectly healthy and happy.

John

PS. Let us know what you decide!

Gamblet
02-20-2003, 07:49 PM
I'm still undecided. My dad took me to the lfs last night and they had beautuful discus for AU$60 (something like US$27 I think). Because I need four fish, this is still totally out of my price range :(

I've discovered the Perth Cichlid Society, which might be a help in getting cheaper juveniles. Are these organisations good to join?

If I don't go discus, it's gonna be either angelfish (american cichlid tank) or electric yellows (african tank, perhaps N. brichardi instead...).

DarkDiscus
02-21-2003, 10:45 AM
Gamblet,

Definitely join some of the cichlid societies. Learning from the direct source is easier and there may be good hobbyists willing to sell you fry cheaply. I think that's a great idea.

As for your other thoughts, they are also great fish. You would enjoy them. But, of course, they are not discus!

Just decide ahead of time what your budget is. Sit down and calculate what you can afford and work from that.

John

Gamblet
02-21-2003, 08:25 PM
I just posted a message on the society's message board asking if anyone has any cheap discus fry for sale. US$15 per fish is about my limit right now, unfortunately.

I've got a question about water changes in general (for any fish). Say I put the water that's going into my tank in a big bucket to age overnight (pH goes up etc). Would I then have to heat that water before I put it in the tank? If I do, I'd have to buy another heater, which would mean much less money to spend on discus...

April
02-22-2003, 12:41 AM
Gamlet. go down to the aussie thread. and theres a ton of aussies posting on there. one or two are from perth..but most from sidney. but you will meet alot of aussies. and they may know where you can get some young fry.
http://forum.simplydiscus.com//index.php?board=18;action=display;threadid=2348
introduce yourself and tell them how old you are and would like to get started. never know.
there are quite a few teenagers on the forum who do quite well with discus. if you have the time and you like discus....you may get other cichlids now.bt you will still want discus. or think about them. so..take your time and decide.
in the meantime nice meeting you. hope you stay.