DON'T MIX ANGELS WITH DISCUS

[stevestauberjr]

All noobs don't make the mistake of even trying to put them with angels EVEN Small ones, today i got my first pair of Discus, a pair of turqoise. Well I add my discus and keep the lights off and when I checked on them a hour later my angels are nudging them around the tank and pecking at them, luckily no fin damage on the Discus. Well I caught all six angels and moved them to a 40 gallon breeder where they are now overcrowded with my Sailfin mollies and Black neon tetras. At least I checked on them early and ended the situation instead of tommorow morning when the discus would be really freaked. They are doing fine now at least. Now I have to find a place to either put my mollies or Jumbo black neons, Does anyone know if Discus get along with either? I would imagine the neons would make good dither fish.

[Nightowl]

I had a problem earlier this year w/ small angels picking at discus in a large tank.... I gave them away.
IMO, black neons & mollies is an odd mix to begin with, as tetras like soft water & mollies do best in very hard water w/ high ph; even seawater! The neons would be better w/ the discus. J.T.

[stevestauberjr]

The neons are now happily swimming in the 75 with the Discus, which now leaves me with the Angel Molly mix till I get enough money to buy a angel only tank. Sigh.

[Nightowl]

:thumbsup:

[mugen920]

i having the sme problem now too with discus and angels togather in a 60G. i have two 2.5 inches red turqoise and a 3.5 gold and 5 mixed angels. the 2 red turquoise seem not growing at all and eating less. do you think it's becoz of the angels? if i'm goin to remove the angels now, will they become better or it's too late already ?? thank you ???

[April]

hi and welcome to the forum. where in canada do you live mugen? :wave:
how many wc are you doing? if you do daily water changes of about 50 percent or more.you may get them growing. if you can..for now id give them their own tank. they do best in a bigger group to grow out. but not a good idea to add more discus now.as others could carry a virus or skin infection or be carriers and make your other ones sick.
so try to up your wc's if you can for now. what are you feeding? varied diet helps to grow them best.

[Paulio]

http://forum.simplydiscus.com//index.phpboard=2;action=display;threadid=8509;star t=0

;D

[mugen920]

thank you april, i'm feeding them mostly bloodworms and occasionally some flakes. so i should just remove the angels and do daily water changes and they will get better ?

Steve, you might also want to read up on proper quarantining of new fish-rather than just adding them to a community tank with multiple species of fish in it..That can be trouble too..
david

[stevestauberjr]

Well i've been watching these discus for weeks now and I know my loaches are healthy so I didn't see the need. If I had them shipped or something I could see bothering with the quarentine but the fish were bagged for 15 minutes tops.

[jules]

My husband does not like AngelFish because they can carry a disease in their feces which effects the Discus.

I have 4 clown loaches - what kind of loaches are yours?

[stevestauberjr]

I have four one inch clown loaches, 6 black neons one redtail shark and 2 turqouise Discus.

Fish that look healthy may be carriers of many things...I'll repeat my suggestion that you read up on quarantine, and leave it at that...


"My husband does not like AngelFish because they can carry a disease in their feces which effects the Discus." <---posted by Jules: that's just outright heresy, not fact.. ::)

david

[stevestauberjr]

That's cool but if i've watched them for several weeks and the are healthy what difference would it make if I bought them on first sight and kept them seperate for two weeks?

http://forum.simplydiscus.com//index.php?board=4;action=display;threadid=1025

6 weeks would be better(it gives you an adequate period of time to observe them)....moving fish can cause them stress, even if they're only coming home in a bag-and then they'll be more susceptible to a disease they might carry that wouldn't be identified by just looking at them...your fish that you already have might be carriers of something that didn't kill them, and this could be passed on to your new fish...

Obviously they're your fish and it's your choice...Quarantine,quarantine,quarantine, is one of the first rules of discus keeping..the boards are full of threads about people that regret not quarantining---I've been there..

david

[stevestauberjr]

Over the years I've come to realize that if something bad is gonna happen it's gonna happen regardless of quarentine(I keep Saltwater, and Parrot Cichlids) I've had fish I've kept in qaurentine for a month come up with something after being placed in it's new tank on more than one occasion with saltwater and fresh and i've come to realize that keeping up with Water changes, filter pad changes, proper feeding and not overstocking a tank along with buying Healthy hand picked fish in the first place is as important if not more important than quarentine. Since i quit buying fish online and started only buying fish I could observe first hand I haven't had any problems at least not with illness. I'm sure lots of you think i'm a fool for saying this but to each his own and that's part of the fun of this hobby, learning from your mistakes. DON'T PUT ANGELS WITH DISCUS! lol. ;)

[Dave C]

Quarantine is a lesson that many have to learn firsthand. Here was my lesson (http://members.shaw.ca/dclubine/quarantine.htm). Hopefully you will be as lucky as I was and your losses will be low. Sick fish don't always advertise, mine didn't, they looked so healthy I thought there was absolutely no risk. In the end they proved me wrong, mind you the new fish never did get sick, just my existing fish. Of course bad things can happen even if you do everything right, but that's not an excuse to ignore proper fish husbandry.

I don't see that your experience, as detailed in the opening post to this thread, points to a problem with Angels & Discus. The Discus were new, the Angels picked on them. The same thing could have happened if you had Discus in the tank instead of Angels. New fish often get picked on by the existing fish. Especially if you have 6 existing fish and add 2 new ones. It happens. One reason is that the new fish are less likely to be their normal aggressive selves because of the change in venue. Just another reason to quarantine new fish... allows them to get used to your water, food, mtce schedule without being harrassed by fish that are already comfortable and itching for a fight. Fish fight, Discus do it, so do Angels. Quarantine procedures are tried & tested and have merit. Ignore them at your own risk.

[stevestauberjr]

Even with quarentine the Discus would have been new to the angels and would have picked on the Discus when they were added 6 weeks from now. I guess now my Discus are in quarentine anyway since there are alone except for a few bottom feeders because I had to move the angels. I'm not saying your wrong about quarentine, i'm just saying I do things a different way.

[Dave C]

With a 6 week quarantine your Discus would have become acclimated to your water, your feeding, your maintenance, your tank. And problems would have been isolated and dealt with, without the attack of other, acclimated fish. That is one of the purposes of quarantine. When you mixed the fish the Discus would still be moved to a new tank but at least they would be in an environment that they are familiar with, the move would take seconds, the water would be the same and the feeding would be familiar.

I'm not scolding you for not quarantining your fish, we all learn in different ways, but most come to the conclusion that quarantine is a very necessary step. I am disagreeing that your experience points to the determination that Discus & Angels don't mix. It could still be a correct statement, I just don't believe that your experience yields that result.

[Dave C]

p.s. I mistakenly assumed that the 2 Discus that you bought were adults. I made that mistake because you referred to them as a pair of Discus, my mistake, not yours. I believe you'll find that 2 small Discus will have problems in a 75g tank regardless of the inclusion of the Angels. My guess is that they would fare better if the Angels were in the tank as the feeding frenzy would keep them eating. On their own you will have to worry about bullying behavior from the stronger of the 2 Discus or hiding for both fish. Discus do much better in larger groups.

[stevestauberjr]

They are eating fine and get along great so far, and show no fear of me at all as a matter of fact the lead discus comes looking for food when I walk in front of the tank. As far as bullying goes the one always seems to follow the other where ever it goes so far at least.

[Shari]

Hi ya all...I really wanted angels and discus together as I've always had angels...but...BUT...I never realized how lovely and basically sweet Discus were...Angels are wonderful but very aggressive especially over food, mating time and sometimes just because !!!!

A couple years ago I watched two young Angels put my entire tank of Discus on one side (some were much larger than these Angels mind you) That was it...immediate Angel tank was set up and all lived happily every after.

Quar or ooopps didn't quar....treat them all anyway..capillaria/tapeworm/etc. especially if Angels/Cories and Discus have been together. Better safe than sorry.
:wave:

[Debbie]

As a person who keeps angels and discus together I have to say the mix works well most of the time. I have had the same problem putting new discus into a tank with discus. Quarentining helps, and never hurts. I always quarentine. Angels can be territorial, but not always. I think you would have had a problem putting any fish in that tank with 6 angels. I put the angels in after the other fish (discus etc) and that has always worked well for me. Angels and discus are awesome together.

They are fine until one wants to breed. The pair will be very aggressive and attack anything within range of their chosen site. Even Cichlid have to stay away from them. All discus will have broken Anal fins. Altum is naturally aggressive. Do you mix with discus. Veil and long fins are fine.
Angel

[Debbie]

I have had angels breed in the community with discus and there have been no problems other than a bit of chasing. There have been other ones that have paired up and terrorized the tank. They were promptly removed and put in a tank of their own. Angels can be unpredictable at times but worth while. You shouldn't attempt to breed angels in the community because the babies are not easy to raise and they will not survive with other fish around. I have never had a discus with a broken anal fin, not to say it can't happen, but in 20 plus years I have not had that experience.