We got news for you Discus_KC/Stendker/Discus Hans USA.

[Discus_Hans]

Because we have more requests for the Stendker Discus as Joe & I can handle from Maryland we had to look for a solution. And we found a guy with some empty tanks Jack of Discus_KC is gone help us out by distributing the Stendker Discus to. The first week of Februari the first Discus will arive at Jack's,
off course the first Discus that will arive are the "most hot item in Usa at the moment" the adults, if you want to hand pick your Disus, contact Jack of Discus_KC
For the moment the shipping in USA will be done only by Joe, Jack first want to work out all fine details on the shipping, because we want the best for the fish, Joe & Hans.

[Dkarc@Aol.com]

Way to go Jack!!

-Ryan

[fcdiscus]

You sure he has enough tank space! LOL, Frank ;D

Hey I have seen that pic before HEE HEE HEE
Those tanks wont be empty long..........


Randy 8)

[Tad]

Go Jack Go!!!!!!! :thumbsup:

[M0oN]

I can't seem to find a photograph of the Stendker Discus on this page using the search tool, does anyone have a few pictures they could post? Or is Stendker simply the name of a breeder? Either way I'd love to see some pictures. :)

[CARY_GLdiscus]

GO JACK GO!
Rmember You do not need to be a known shipper with north west! ;)

[Bladerunner]

I can't seem to find a photograph of the Stendker Discus on this page using the search tool, does anyone have a few pictures they could post? Or is Stendker simply the name of a breeder? Either way I'd love to see some pictures. :)


Hi,

check out this link:-

http://www.diskuszucht-stendker.de/pages/about_us.html

They are in my humble opinion the greatest Discus i have ever come across (i am fortunate in that i am UK based and live very near to a leading Stendker dealer)!!

Cheers,

Martin

[Jason]

Congratulations Jack!

I better get your filters to you soon!

-if you go with northwest, dont tape the box up too tight because they will open it and re-seal it, they open every styro, thats why you dont need to be a known shipper.

[yogi]

This sounds like great news for all parties sellers, middlemen and customers. Way to go.

[ronrca]

:thumbsup:

Hooray for Jack! ;)

[korbi_doc]

:bounce2: :bounce: :bounce2:

Hey Jack!!! I knew you'd find a way to fill those multitudinous tanks!! WOW!! Go guy!! You are gonna have such fun!! lol, Dottie ;D ;D

[oodi]

:thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

Judi
:)

[ping]

:thumbsup: :thumbsup:
Will you ship to Oz Jack ? ;D
Too far for me to hand pick em ;D
Good to hear this news :) :thumbsup:

Regards,
Ronny

[wildthing]

A rambling conversation & speculation about economics & discus.

First off, these Stendker fish are very very nice fish at very very nice prices, a very good purchase .

Jerry said this is good for sellers middlemen & customers....It seems to me that the only benefits of these fantastic prices are for the hobbyist & only in the short term.......

Ironicly , last week I was heavily critisized on this forum by a German importer/exporter for selling a wild discus for $80.....far below market, it will kill the market.....& here are these domestic beauties coming in from Germany at $80....

While thinking about the prices I have to wonder to myself, knowing what it costs to raise a domestic fish in this country....& EU is not much different......someone here is probably selling at a loss, or at best break-even........I guess it must be Stendker themselves as I really wouldn't see any point or logic in either Hans or Joe going to all the trouble of doing all the work for less than McDonald's burger-flippin $$s , it would be self-defeating. Well, we already know that Stendker's are overproducing by 400% so this is IMO probably what is called 'market dumping' , to get rid of excess fish at any price .....hopefully without crashing the price of fish in the home market.

So what happens with 'dumping'?.......if it were the steel trade the US Gov or almost any other Gov usually would impose tariffs to protect the domestic industry......but it is just a tropical fish so.....that won;t happen ;D

I am glad I am not heavily into domestic discus as a primary income at this time.....a few breeders that I know are not thrilled about these fish appearing as it is very hard to compete & still pay the fish's bills. I think a few breeders may end up biting the bullet soon because the market trend is towards oversaturation.....more & more hobbyists are able to successfully breed discus and more , high quality & cheaper fish arrive from overseas. The Asian breeders will lose a part of their US market share so they will be forced to cut prices....hobbyists will have to give away their babies for free just to have any room, fewer & fewer will want to buy from professional importers as hobbyists will supply much of the demand for free..importers will have to drop prices & work more on volume sales to survive.....& then the syndrome repeats.
I think from an economic point of view this is all very interesting....will prices continue to drop or will there be a bounce.....Bull market or Bear? who will survive & who will not be able to continue in the discus buisiness....If Discus are like Diamonds then this is kinda like DeBeers releasing their stock of diamonds onto the market & letting the price float....the world market would of course collapse as diamonds are not really rare, they are just with-held from the market to maintain the market $$value.
Discus are also priced for their rarity....and what we can see is they are daily becoming less & less rare while new color varieties which used to be able to support the market are appearing less & less frequently as color genetic dead-ends are reached. ( the only struggle is for new names for discus LOL)

::)

These fish are both way too cheap & way too expensive at the same time!
;D

[jim_shedden]

very interesting Dave.

thanks for the insight

jim

[gparr]

OK folks...have I missed something here in the midst of all the EXCITEMENT...where are the prices and sizes posted???

Gordon

[korbi_doc]

:yikes: :yikes: :yikes: :yikes: :yikes: Well David, you have just put into words what I, & I'm sure, many others have been thinking 'bout this changing economic picture. That is a great, insightful overview of any industry's development. But, as is often said, "this too shall pass", & hopefully the American market can withstand & endure. & I believe it will, well said, Dottie ::) ::) ;D

[mikebutch]

Dave,

Interesting insight...I wonder what the future holds for domestics?

MIke

[Denny]

The breeders who are marginal will suffer, but the ones who provide service and support will do just fine in the long run.

I am not sure you could say 80 dollars is overpriced when I see wilds posted for sale for 35 or 40 dollars each.

If the germans overproduced by 400 percent, then maybe they are going for ecomomies of scale where they produce higher numbers and sell at lower prices to make their profits just like farming and the livestock industry does.

as far as hobbiests being successful breeders and taking market share consider this, if it is a hobby for them and they want to give fish away, that is fine because it is a hobby, not a business. I doubt mant will turn pro because of the hassle of shipping, that will keep it local. And all of those free fish they give away should increase the amount of people who turn to discus keeping as a hobby and possibly grow the market so that there are actually more people looking for discus. Compare the percentage of households in europe that have aquariums with the american percentage and I see there is room for growth.

[fcdiscus]

Actually, Dave makes a very valid point! Frank

Good point Dave......Hard to say what the discus market will do in the long run.......Will this and other orders like this run some people out of the business??.....People breeding and importing come and go almost daily in this hobby......And todays market is no different than it has been for years....its all about quality, and who can deliver it.

If you cant continuously supply high grade discus you wont be around long......The only difference today is that many many more people can deliver that quality, so the market has no place to go but down in price.......But that said, the good breeders will be here as long as they wish so long as they keep selling high quality discus, because of the name they have made for themself...You sell high quality fish you get repeat business...you sell low quality discus your out like last weeks newspapers......

For years quality has meant making big bucks for the breeder .....I never have figured out why a red turk is sold for 15-20 dollars and an ABC crossed with an XYZ discus is 80 dollars for the same size fish when the cost to raise both fish are the same..Sure you have the demand for the newer fish which at one time could refect a higher market value but today so many of the breeders have the newer strains so I dont think the demand is there today as it once was... Breeders can re-name the fish ten times but in the end it is still the same fish as the breeder across town or across the world is selling.....There is only so many ways you can cross a discus...It goes back to the old saying...what ever you have thought about doing, someone has already beat you to it and did it........

Sure the breeder has spent time outcrossing his stock and growing the fish out ect ect..for the newest strain...if you want to call it a strain as many dont breed true, and I agree to a point that the breeder should be compensated somewhat for creating a new strain or improving an old strain but at what cost.
100%, 300%, 500% over market value.

And yes I do believe the market is becoming oversaturated.
Even to the point of high quality discus...
Look at the number of people breeding and importing these days just here in the States.....
When you look at the number of breeders...and I mean big time breeders around the world....the ones that have 50,000+ discus......."Dumping" 2000 discus at cheap prices is smart business.

The loss difference is no different to them then it is to a small time breeder raising 150 fry that dumps 10-20 of his fry to a local pet store for half of what he could sell them for elsewhere....They have to go somewhere because they are costing him/her $$ everyday they sit in their tank. So making a few buck per fish is better than making none at all.

Discus are not the hard to keep, impossible to breed fish that people thought they were 5-10 year ago and many people are exploring this side of the hobby for the first time because of this but I think the supply is way more than the demand in todays market at least for 85-90% of todays strains........

For those of us that have been around this hobby for awhile just look back.....5-10 years ago we were paying 75-80 dollars for a 2 inch fish that we can get all day long now for 20 bucks or less.
Sure some discus will always bring high $$$'s because people are willing to pay the price.

I look at it like the auto industry...some people want a 2500 dollar used economy car and others want a new 100,000 dollar sports car.......but 90% of the people want something in between.........So what is the in between price......Who knows but is should make for an intersting ride...........

JMO


Randy 8)..

[Discus_Hans]

David, for a part you're right, Stendker has a lot in stock.
On the other hand they tried to sell their Discus for many many years in the USA. They had contacts with, let us say a BIG GUY in the market, he always found their prices to high, loking for the big profit.
The Discus are for Joe & me (and Jack now) not our main income, we do it more or less for fun (I garantee you I've fun).
Advertisment in the magazines to promote those Discus cost a lot of money and we tought we could spend this money in a differend/better way.
Knowing a lot of people burned their fingers/money on very nice pictures till they got the Discus :( :( :( Nice pictures but recieving bad fish.
Those 2 shipments (and maybe a few more, not sure yet) are to introduce the high quality of Stendker's Discus in USA.
Why not spend this advertisment money on the Discus people in giving a HIGH discount on the fish, so many can see the pictures do right to the quality of the fish they get.
And who can better "advertise" the Stendker Discus as the happy customers???????
Remember this promoting deal is not for ever, normaly an adult like this cost dubbel the money,

Hope this clears some things of why and how, Hans

[Discusgeo]

Congratulations Jack!
Boy are you gonna have your hands full.

A very interesting post by WIldthing and I think he is correct.

Now if I can get my wilds to start breeding.

[SLY]

competition is tough my friend but i do agree on what david said..at the end of the day it's the hobbyists that choose who to buy from and who's reliable to deal with. ;D

[Miles]

Very Good Point Sly.

Miles

[Jeff]

Humm... i have another idea for a poll.