After cycle water parameters?

[agave60]

Hello,
Well after a few weeks I think my cycle is complete, but I need advice on my GH/KH/Ph readings.
Ammonia 0, Nitrite 0, Nitrate 25 (after doing a 90% water change, before change nitrates were at 40).
My water is very soft out of the tap and doesn't change much after aeration.
GH: Tap 60, Aged 60, Tank 80.
KH: Tap 50, Aged 40, Tank 30.
pH: Tap 7.8, Aged 7.0 Tank 6.0
TDS: Tap 139, Tank 221

Can someone please help me out and suggest what I should do to bring up my GH and KH in order to have a stable PH.

Thanks,
Carlos

[Cosmo]

Carlos,

How long is the water in the tank before the ph drops from 7.0 to 6.0 ? Given the readings your giving your tap water seems fine, and a TDS of 221 should be sufficient to hold the ph. How long are you aging it? and how long is it in the tank before the ph drops from 7.0 to 6.0. Could be you simply need to age it longer??

Post a little more info on the tank.. size of tank, number/size of fish, type of filtration, gravel/planted or bare bottom, and what your WC regimen is? Could be several factors that are effecting the ph... overloading the bio filter, over feeding, insufficient gas exchange, or even failing to clean the filters often enough could be contributors, but difficult to tell without knowing more..

Have you tested your tap water for nitrate.. these readings are awfully high, particularly after a 90% WC but any of the above could be contributing to that as well.

There are additives such as ph stable you can add to stabilize the ph, but this may not be what you need..

Post more info so more people can jump in

Jim

[funkyfish]

are u use ing some kind of additive that sounds kind of wierd . do u have air stones in ur storage contianer. post lik cosmo sead so folks can get a idea what is going on . any fish in the tank what kind of filter how often do u change the water

[Sergey]

Hi Carlos,

IMO, keep changing water. There seems to be enough nitric acid left over in the tank after cycling to change your tap water to those parameters you're seeing.

Regards,
Sergey.

[agave60]

Thanks for the all the replies and here goes a little more info.
Setup: bare bottom 65 gal, Aquaclear 500, Penguin Emperor, two heaters (holding steady at 85.8), no additional aeration.
Maintenance: I was doing a fishless cycle so no water changes until yesterday, I was only adding aged water due to evaporation.
Additives: only Bio Safe to detoxify tap water.

I'm not sure how long it took for the Ph to drop because I wasn't constantly testing for ph, only ammonia, nitrite and nitrate. After yesterdays water change the ph is holding steady at 7.2. Nitrates are down to 10.
What I do notice is an oily film on the surface of the water, in my saltwater tanks I would increase surface agitation with a powerhead, but I know discus like a calm evnironment so what do you guys think about adding a sponge filter?

Well hopefully this gives you a little more in order to analyze what is going on. Is it possible that my high nitrates were causing my Ph to drop?

[funkyfish]

i noticed that if there is not enough aireation in the tank it will do that just ad a air stone it should go away. i get it on my planted tanks all my discus tanks have hydro sponges in them so i don't get that on them
good luck
if it has stablized after the water change it was the high nitrate level
wc,wc,wc,wc,wc,

[Cosmo]

Hi Carlos,

Yep :) This info puts a whole new light on things. The fishless cycle explains the hi nitrates and contibutes to the ph drop as well. If all is holding steady now you don't need to be adding anything to adjust your water... except.

That oily film is a problem. It prevents gas exchange on the surface which is also a contributor to your ph drop...C02 buildup. Would not use powerheads as I've found my Discus hate them, you're right, they prefer calmer waters.

Since your powerfilters aren't doing the job agitating the surface enough, I'd add a couple of big airstones, you'll get the same breaking of the surface tension the powerheads would give you but with considerably less current, and not a forced stream of current at that.

I have 4 giant airstones on my 180 and 2 on my 90 for just this reason Pumping air thru the tank and all the exploding bubbles on the surface force the bad gas out and let the good gas in :)

Could be all you need and you'll be ready to go :)

Congrats !

Jim

[agave60]

Thanks a lot guys.

One other question about ph, a very well know breeder in my local area (miami, fl) told me that my ph must be at 6.5 for the discus to be happy. He recommended I adjust with muriatic acid. I've read many posts and articles that suggest ph stability is more important than a specific reading and adding chemicles to adjust only result in future problems.
What are your thoughts?

[funkyfish]

ph 8.1 here fish are happy and growing

[Carol_Roberts]

No need to adjust pH to grow out juveniles . . . mine are in 7.8

[Cosmo]

No need to adjust your ph down, but if you ever were going to, there are safer ways to do so than muriatic acid :(

[Russ]

I had a similar problem with my ph droping drasticly overnight after I put it in the discus tank. My problem was that I had a very low KH and I added some crushed coral in a nylon bag to raise it. It worked like a charm and stablized my ph.

[agave60]

Russ,
What did you get the crushed coral (was it saltwater substrate), and where did you add the nylon bag (in the aged water or main tank)? Just want to be prepared if the pH drops again.

Thanks,
Carlos

[Cosmo]

Carlos

:confused: :confused: :confused:

I thought you were indicating you wanted to artificially lower your ph (w/ muriatic acid perhaps) .. you're actually having ph crashing problems :confused:

Jim

[agave60]

No, the pH has now stabilized at 7.2. The cause of the ph crash were the high nitrates, but after a 90% water pH has stabilized.

I only want to know what kind of crushed coral is used to harden and how it is used for future reference.

The breeder I'm buying from keeps all his fish at 6.5, how concerned should I be about bringing them home to 7.2. What acclimation procedures should I use?

Thanks,
Carlos

[HTown Discus]

The breeder I'm buying from keeps all his fish at 6.5, how concerned should I be about bringing them home to 7.2. What acclimation procedures should I use?

http://forum.simplydiscus.com//showthread.php?t=42153

[Carol_Roberts]

No worry - they can go directly from 6.5 to 7.2