Bare Bottom VS Gravel

[Westie]

I'm relatively new here but, not new to discus or any type of fresh and salt water set-ups. I've spent the last couple of days reading all the threads here and have found a HUGE rift between bare bottom tankers and those with gravel and/or plants. It seems you all have an opinion and I'd like to hear it.

I'm an aquascaper and could go through life just designing tank layouts but,what I'm not interested in here is the aesthetic quality of the tank but, instead the health benefit of the two. I've kept Discus in both types of tanks though mostly to breed in a bare bottom. It seems many bare bottomers do daily water changes where planters are more every week or two.

And can someone point out whats so bad about undergravel filters? I'm here for two seconds and I'm chastised for having one. I've kept every type of tropical fish with one for the last 30 years, some fish for 10 years at a time, with no problems. So, if your a marine biologist or just a guy with a tank your opinion is valued here.

[brewmaster15]

Hi Westie,
Welcome to Simplydiscus.com! Basically your questions are one that we hear alot here. Though not the case here, as you mention having Discus before, its also something many novices to discus question, because the bare tanks are foreign to them.

To break it Down... Discus can be kept in either Bare bottom tanks or substrate...For maximum growth and health of the fish as juveniles, bare is best for the simple reason that you see the waste and are less tempted to forget the maintenence. This is why moderators here try to stear Novices to the bare tanks, verses substrate....Historically we have learned novices with discus will have a greater chance for success with a bare tank. Additionally theres less places for parasites and their eggs to hide, as well as little chance of oxygen difficient pockets of substrate that might liberate foul gases to the tank. Bare tanks allow someone to feed multiple times a day and maintain a clean tank. It allows the feeding of messy foods like beef heart , which in a gravel tank is not good (it falls in the cracks, rots, and then the fish get ill.) That doesn't mean someone can't succeed with substrate and discus, just that in the beginning Its easier going Bare.

Most have better luck raising discus in bare tank. My advice to those asking for it on the subject is...Buy the fish small and grow them out in Bare tank, Then try them in your various substrate tanks.Or Buy larger fish for the substrate tank. In the end you'll have larger happier discus. I use either bare tanks or silica sand which because of its small particles allows less waste in.Always remember though to treat a substrate tank with a medication is always more difficult than Bare glass is...So QT on Fish for a substrate tank is extremely important.

That said, I have seen some very beautiful substrate tanks and healthy fish, so I know they are both possible given the experience and dedication.

Hope that helps,
al


Ps..

Undergravels are not a problem..its maintaining them religiously, before theres a probelm.. I used to use them too, years ago. Discus come from prestine Amazon water and that water has a very low bacterial load because its so acidic... The bacteria ladden gunk in the UGF can lead to some serious bacterial issues and give a place for parasites to lay in waiting.

[DarkDiscus]

It's definitely quite the debate.

Many members also get very touchy, so just try to be patient.

My take on it is this: I was told early on to go bare bottom. I listened and have had great results. I never had a lot of luck with most plants anyway. Therefore if someone asked for my advice, I would suggest bare bottom.

Now, if someone had a great planted tank and had a real mastery of the water chemistry involved and wanted discus - I'm sure they could handle it.

Maybe not growing out, because of all the food involved, but adult discus in a planted tank are cool. I've even heard some people having luck growing out in a planted tank.

HTH.

John

[ppv1951]

i think UG filters are great. and, i've kept discus with them. but, it required pulling the plants up every week, stirring up the gravel to emulsify the mulm and filtering it out with a diatom filter. a lot of work every week. bare bottom is the way to go to keep the tanks ultimately clean. you can add things like driftwood and potted plants and split the difference.

pat.

[dixiedog]

I never could keep plants alive. My plastic ones definitely lasted longer.

:D

That said, Brewmaster pretty much nailed it.