Stunted discus? (pics)

[Plant Crazy]

Hi there,

I purchased these 6 discus about a month ago. When I first put them in my tank, they were quite shy and darted to the back whenever they saw me approaching. However, in the last week, they've been coming to the front of the tank when they see me, and are now avidly eating out of my hand. :D They have great appetites.

Anyways, I've been reading that if they have eyes that appear largish in proportion to their body, that they might be stunted. Do you think that my discus are stunted?

http://individual.utoronto.ca/sliu/aqua/discus-apr21-06.jpg

[wolfbane]

They look quite young yet. How big are they, nose to base of tail? Be sure and feed often and well, they will pick up growing. The tank is planted and graveled?

[Plant Crazy]

They look quite young yet. How big are they, nose to base of tail? Be sure and feed often and well, they will pick up growing. The tank is planted and graveled?

Hi wolfbane, yes they're probably what you would consider to be juvenilles. I'd estimate them to be about 3 inches from nose to base of tail.

I'm feeding them frozen blood worms at the moment, and they readily eat them. They're still establishing a 'pecking order', but all in all, they seem to be happy and healthy.

Yes, I've got Flourite substrate, and a planted tank. Metal halide lighting, pressurized CO2. In hindsight, I probably should've gotten adult discus instead. However, at the time, I didn't know of local breeders, and thus purchased the juvenile discus from a LFS.

[Alight]

It's really hard to tell stunted fish from fish that just have big eyes at the size you have them. The key would be to know how old they are, but since you got them for lfs you can't know. I they are 5 or 6 months old, the answer would be yes. If they are three months old, no. You will only know the answer when you grow them to their max size. If they end up at 4 inches, yes. If 6 inches plus, no.

Large eyes can be a sign of stunting, but can also be just a property of the individual fish. In any case, large eyes are considered a flaw. But, unless you are trying to show them, who cares? It's more important that the fish are healthy and colorful, and yours look to be both.

[Westie]

Really really horribly stunted. As a Discus whisperer'. You should do the right thing and give them to me.

[1977]

From this pic I would say you are ok, the eyes don't look too large.

[steve.ryall]

hi Plant,

Now others here might say I'm wrong, but the key to good growth is good food, your fish look ok for now, but feeding them only bloodworm might be a problem. I have been well informed by a UK renound discus keeper that bloodworm, although a good edible food, is more like giving your fish a mac'donalds every day. Its a fast food which they will eat readily, but really has no real value as far a growth food is concerned. A good beefheart mix contains all the nutrients necessary for good growth along with other foods, but please do not only feed your fish on the one food, specially bloodworm.

I am sure some of the other more experienced people here on Simply might have something to say about that, but vary the food for good non-stunted grow outs.

HTH,,Steve

[kaceyo]

I agree with Steve about needing to give your fish a more varied diet. Bloodworms alone won't get the results that a good mix of foods that includes some vegies, meats and vitimins/minerals. I have to disagree about bloodworms being junk food for discus. In fact, they are used to bring pairs into breeding condition and are a very good food for our fish. Also I think wc's play as important a role in good growth as diet. Maybe even more so. If you want to see good growth on your juvies do daily wc's of at least 50%.

Kacey

[Plant Crazy]

Thank you all for your helpful replies!

Alight: As you mentioned, I bought them from a LFS, so I don't know how old they are. I've had them for a little over a month. It took them about 3 weeks until they felt comfortable with the tank. I'd say that I've been feeding them heavily for the past week and a half, since they now all have developed voracious appetites. Everytime I walk by the tank, they come begging, and act as if they never been fed!

Steve and Kaceyo: I have been lazy in my foods. They just love the bloodworms so much, and I've stocked up Hikari bloodworms (I have several 16oz flats in my chest freezer now). However, I also do have the Hikari discus bites as well as the Tetra bits. I was thinking of trying to throw some of those in during the morning, instead of the bloodworms, to see if they'll take to those. Admittedly, since I do not have a bare bottom tank, it will be practically impossible to tell if they are eating the dry foods, since the uneaten food will dissolve and blend in with the gravel. :(

Due to my hectic schedule (resident), I don't have enough time to do daily 50% water changes. However, I am doing 50% water changes every four to five days.

[bennyblanco]

2 me they look fine!!! nice fish:D :D

[Alight]

Plant Crazy, so how big are these now? A good grow out growth rate is about 1 inch per month. If these fish were behind because of poor care previously, they may catch up quite a bit if you feed them well now.

I feed tetra color bits (soak them in about 3 drops of vitamins per serving and some tank water to soften them up before feeding), Hikari frozen blood worms, Hikari mysis shrimp, Hikari Discus pellets. I also throw in some zucchini from time to time. Originally it was to supplement algae for the otos and plecos, but some of the discus really like it, too.

You will need to increase water changes as these fish grow up. Measure nitrates to know how often. Keep them at 10 ppm or under for best growth. Figure out a way to do the changes more quickly (have storage tank and a good pump, for example).

[Plant Crazy]

Hey Alight, thanks for the advice. My discus are about 3" from mouth to tail base. They have grown a little since I purchased them (don't know exactly how much). They took a few weeks to acclimatise to the tank when I first purchased them, so I don't think they really grew then. I think the observed growth has been in the past two weeks since they've settled in.

What kind of vitamin drops are you using to soak your colour bits?

My nitrates are consistently running about about 6 ppm (it never goes higher, since my plants consume it at a fast pace). I truly wish that I could do daily water changes, but with two infants and a busy schedule... It would be awesome if one day I could rig up an automatic water change device (maybe once the kids grow older, I can bribe them to do the water changes for me). :D

[bennyblanco]

Hey Alight, thanks for the advice. My discus are about 3" from mouth to tail base. They have grown a little since I purchased them (don't know exactly how much). They took a few weeks to acclimatise to the tank when I first purchased them, so I don't think they really grew then. I think the observed growth has been in the past two weeks since they've settled in.

What kind of vitamin drops are you using to soak your colour bits?

My nitrates are consistently running about about 6 ppm (it never goes higher, since my plants consume it at a fast pace). I truly wish that I could do daily water changes, but with two infants and a busy schedule... It would be awesome if one day I could rig up an automatic water change device (maybe once the kids grow older, I can bribe them to do the water changes for me). :D


i use zoe heres a link http://www.aquariumpros.com/p-KEN00265,KENsi.html:D :D

[dixiedog]

Really really horribly stunted. As a Discus whisperer'. You should do the right thing and give them to me.

Durn, beat me to it. :mad:

[wild_heckel]

Beautiful colour BD.

I like to ask a question about body shape of young discus if I may.
I went to an aquarium shop that sells many discus today. They have one tank with approximately 20 blue diamonds around 2" - 21/2" (head to tail).
I was going to get some but I am not sure if they will grow nice and round. They all have thin forehead and quite pointy, similar to the picture posted by Plants Crazy on this thread. Sorry Plants Crazy, this is not in any way a form of criticimn of your fish.
How can I tell if they will grow nice and round?
I am also concern if they are stunted. Next to the blue diamond tank was a snakeskin tank of similar size but most of them have rounder shape. The pigeon blood tank has the most rounded shape of all the young discus but I like blue diamond colour the most.
Maybe I should take some pictures and post them here, if they are not sold by then.

[Clay]

Plant Crazy, if you don't mind me asking, what size is your tank and what do you have in there with them?

[thebluyak]

his sig says a 150 gallon so assumming that would be it possibly

[Clay]

his sig says a 150 gallon so assumming that would be it possibly
Erm, he doesn't have a sig...

[pcsb23]

Looking at the photos and reading the thread and being brutally honest I would say that they are a little behind where they should be. The eyes are a little large for the body and one or two of them have a slightly arrow shape. This does not mean they are or will become poor fish. A lot will depend on the next few months as to how they finally turn out.

However you have your hands full trying to grow out juvvie discus in a fully planted tank. These fish need feeding 5 or 6 times a day and with a mix of high quality foods like beefheart, frozen blood worm, frozen mysis, white worms, and a good quality flake or granule food.

Also if the DOC's (dissolved organic compounds) are allowed to accumulate they will suppress the growth in the fish too. The only practical way to remove DOC's is regular water changes, preferably daily.

There are a number of things you can do to help, you can put the granule/flake food in an auto feeder for when you are not at home, feed frozen in the morning (blood worm, beefheart etc..) and in the evening when you get back in. You need to find a way to increase the w/c's, using a pump in a storage barrel speeds the process. I can do 50% w/c's on 6 tanks in under an hour using stored water and a pump. You should be aiming for 33-50% daily, at worst every other day.

This does not mean that your fish won't grow or be healthy, they look healthy now, only that they will not achieve their optimum growth.

[krislewis3]

Hey plant crazy.... Just curious how your fish turned out.... It would be educational to hear from you now!!!

[Second Hand Pat]

Hey plant crazy.... Just curious how your fish turned out.... It would be educational to hear from you now!!!

Hi Kris, the last post to this thread was 2006

[MrsIHguy]

My blue diamond looks exactly like yours, he's growing slower than the others but he is growing. May be a little stunted but a nice looking group

[Skip]

Hey plant crazy.... Just curious how your fish turned out.... It would be educational to hear from you now!!!

If you look above poster name.. it gives date and time of their post...

If you click their name... then window pops up.. click view profile.. then you can see the join date and last log in date..

Crazy plant last came to sd.. May 2006.. so its a good way to see if poster of old threads is still active

[pastry]

Well, you never know if any of these folks come back or watch from afar. Certainly doesn't hurt.

[John_Nicholson]

I don't really know but my guess is it did not work out the way they hoped and they left discus with the notion that they are hard to raise and die without any reason at all....LOL. That is what often happens when people try to raise them in planted tanks. If they were highly successful they would probably still be around, but they normally run into trouble and just disappear......


-john

[Skip]

Well, you never know if any of these folks come back or watch from afar. Certainly doesn't hurt.

ok.. LOL>> sure..

but then you can't look at the PICS (that's half the fun) without logging in and SD keeps track of that... but it would be safe to assume.. no log in in 7 years.. they changed hobbys..

[pastry]

Skip, I went several years of looking at this site before even registering... then when I did, I only did a few posts and took over a year off at one point. So yep, it could happen bud. I'm with you on the odds but it's not entirely ridiculous.

[lx2077]

Here r my discus I'm also new to the hobby and have no spending limit on the care of discus I even went as far as purchasing a standby generator in the event of a power loss I'm currently feeding 4 times a day on an automated feeder (high quality flake) along with a variety of 1 treat a day switching b/w frozen blood worms,live black worms, live brine, beef heart, and zucchini...can you guys tell if mine are stunted don't know age exactly however my BD are 2 months and almost doubled since I purchased them and my little guy is only 3 weeks since I purchased

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[lx2077]

Stunted? http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/12/09/eqaqysup.jpg

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[lx2077]

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/12/09/6u3adane.jpg

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[lx2077]

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/12/09/unanurug.jpg

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[lx2077]

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/12/09/qabahu4e.jpg

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[lx2077]

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/12/09/ybynu8yp.jpg

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[lx2077]

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/12/09/jy2ahanu.jpghttp://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/12/09/e3yvanys.jpg

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[lx2077]

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/12/09/ju3a4ata.jpghttp://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/12/09/hu4utu2e.jpg

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