I'm stupid...help!

[born2lovefish]

I'm 18 years old and been thinking about discus again. I had 2 4 inch ones about 3 years ago. Didn't have luck with them, but my water was crap and I did not do a lot of water changes. I have a 40 gallon breeder that is drilled with a 20 gallon sump that has a DIY wet dry. Has a diy canopy also and I will be putting 2 65 watt compacts under it for live plants. Tank has a sand bottom. I am wondering if I can put some discus in this tank and how many? Also, the pump returns I'm gussing around 300 gph...I have it plumbed so I can direct water into the tank or close a valve a little and open another and more goes back over the wet/dry instead of the tank. Discus don't like fast water right? Thanks for the help.

[fishmama]

Hi Born2luv~

Well, one thing is for certain, everyone of us here has had our fair share of mistakes! And you are certainly NOT stupid (rather bright as it appears from your post.) And that word is "banned" in my house ;-)

I keep learning everyday (often the hard way)...those who are the best have tenacity beyond the difficulties. So keep on researching and asking!

I'm sure someone who knows far more than I will be of great assistance here!

Welcome Back,
Fishmama

[greyhoundfan]

I agree with fishmama. your tank set up sounds pretty good and does show some intelligence.;) There is a general rule of thumb that says you should only keep 1 discus per 10 gallons, that would give you a ball park figure of 4. Howerver I think you can get away with 6 adult discuses so long you keep up with your WCs and change at least 2-3 times a week.

There are a lot of variables that you didn't mention. Were you planning on keeping other fish? Was this going to be a planted tank? If you plan to go the planted route and have a lot of dither fish, than I'd stick with two. SO LONG they are a confirmed pair. IF they're not I wouldn't do it.

It really depends on your commitment on the WC schedule.

[born2lovefish]

Thanks. I had 5 adult wild angels, but I just sold them along with my freshwater stingray. I bred some angels last may and was going to get another pair, but decided not to. The 40 gallon was a project I did beause I got most of the materials fairly cheap, and I wanted to prove I could make it all work. As far as my plans for the 40 gallon, I don't know. I want to put some amazon swords in there and that is about all I have thought about for plants as of now. I was thinking about 3 discus, but didn't know how that would all work out. There is a good current in the tank, and I am not sure how bad that is for discus. I'm going to try to finish up my canopy by this weekend and then I will try to post some pictures of my set up. That might give you a better idea of what I have. Thanks for the help so far.

Oh, if I do not put discus in the tank, I thought about trying to breed german rams. Not sure if anyone has any experience, but any comments or concerns are welcomed. Thanks

[Greg Richardson]

What do you think is a realistic water change schedule for you that you can keep?
What size discus you have in mind?
With this info I think your question can be answered better.

[born2lovefish]

I'd like to keep about three, 3-4 inch discus. I'm hoping since I have a big filter that I will not have to do water changes as often. I'd like to do a water change once a week, but most people say they need them everyday. Just wondering if people are crazy or if that is really needed. Hope that helps.

[aquaticplantman]

Just wondering if people are crazy or if that is really needed. Hope that helps.

Well, yes and yes. They really do need WCs that often and those of us who do it must be at least somewhat crazy for doing it. An oversized filter does little for decreasing the need for water changes in relation to discus. I liken it to a closed room full of people -- you can have a big air conditioner and filter, but you really want to just open up all the windows and get some fresh air in. A filter is not a substitute for fresh water.

There was a similar question not long ago about keeping discus in a similar sized tank. The main consesus was to only keep a mated pair in this tank. You wouldn't want to keep less than six 3-4 inchers, and your tank would be too small for that. Even if a group of three didn't fight, I don't think you'd be happy with their growth in that tank -- especially with it being a planted tank.

Your tank sounds like it's going to be nice, but I'd hold off on the discus until you had at least a 55 gallon set up for them (and make that a bare bottom)

-- Matt H.

[Bainbridge Mike]

You really do need water changes because there are some wastes that cannot be removed by filtration. I think one thing folks may have overlooked is that you have a sump. Assuming the sump is about 1/2 full, then the total volume of water in your system is more like 50 gallons than 40. You might be able to raise 6 discus in this system--but I would not recommend it if you plan to have substrate and plants. If you already have a lot of experience with planted tanks, you might try finding a mated pair of adults to keep in a planted tank.

Good luck,

[Greg Richardson]

With a planted tank I'd do wc once every three days.
Unlike others I see no problem with 4 or 5 in there as long as wc is kept up.

Realize with most groups one will probably get stunted.

Also if your goal is to grow 3 to 4" out to 6 to 7" fish you'd be better off going BB.

But if it's enjoyment and size is not your end goal I think you'll be fine if you do wc as advised.

[Alight]

Check out basalker's post in the planted tank section of this forum before you get too invested here. As he suggested, best to have had success with both planted tanks and Discus tanks (bare bottom here) before you try to do both.

I'd highly suggest you do the new tank bare bottom and grow out some nice Discus, just to become comfortable with that, before you try to go for the hattrick (I know, I know that's three, but Discus + plants+ Discus and plants is three, too!). I think you can do 5 or 6 discus in the 40 with the sump and lots of maintenance. Now I WOULDN"T DO THAT, but then I know better, 'cause I've done it in the past, and I really would never do it again!! Way too much work and the results are less than great.

What I would do is get a least a 55g tank, and grow out 6 or 7 Discus with it bare bottom. Then think of maybe even a larger tank for a planted tank, and add the Discus to it.

[born2lovefish]

Thanks for the info. I am going to take the advice from the experienced people on here. I think I will wait on discus till after college when I have my own place. My 75 gallon right now has a bunch of 8 month old angels that I bred along with 7 3inch clown loaches that would bother discus. I could turn my 75 gallon into a discus tank, but I think it is best if I wait. Anyone ever keep german rams? I might get some of them and put them in the 40 gallon. Might try to breed them or something. Thanks for the help.

[rcomeau]

Here are some Ram links...

http://apisto.bravepages.com/Ram%20article.htm

http://www.thekrib.com/Apisto/P-ramirezi.html#1

http://www.geocities.com/yutaka_loo/index.html

http://oddballfish.com/fishdetail.mv?01C69BF4B2D87FBA00000C4800000000+ram _reg

[born2lovefish]

wow, thanks for the sites. Anyone have good luck with oddball site? I'm looking for some breeding pairs of rams if anyone has any or know of anywhere that is a decent deal. Just let me know. Thanks for the help!

[Alight]

Check out the other fish with Discus threads. Lots of people here at simply keep rams.

Al