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View Full Version : my confesion....I am not worthy :(



happygirl65
02-07-2008, 01:15 PM
So my sad confession is that when I asked the question about QT I had already purchased 6 discus from an online source.

Taking into account all the responses I decided that with only a 10 gal available to me that was not cycled that it was probably better to put them in the 46 gal planted tank and forego the QT this time. (my first time with discus incase that is not painfully obvious)

Admittedly I beleived that since the tetras and kuhlis had all been in this tank for 7 months with no losses even in the beginning that they probably didn't have any diseases.

The discus seller assured me that they would be healthy with no diseases and that I would not need to worm them.

I didn't use a sponser here (BIG mistake) and it ended up taking two days in transit to me. (They only offered USPS Express shipping) 2 out of 6 were DOA. While it was packed in styro with 2 small heat packs the bags were zip tied shut and there was almost no air in the bags by the time I got them. Two fish per bag and the water smelled FOUL. I began kicking myself in the butt harder than I ever have before. :mad:

So I followed the sellers instructions for acclimating to the letter and confirmed after staring at the two dead ones for 3 hours that they were infact dead. (Seller says he will refund me for the 2) :(

I left the lights off in the tank for the entire day, didn't feed, wanted to let them settle in and such. Within a few hours all 4 of the ones who made it were swimming around, hiding occasionally but coming out to check things out and going back behind plants etc.

Today I turned the lights on and they are hiding as I expected them to, they are taking turns venturing out more and more but I am noticing damage to them. Mostly fin damage.

A couple of them look like the top (dorsal?) fin is fuzzy and I am not sure if this is amonia burn or a fungus...it doesnt really look like any fungus I have ever seen before (I have kept FW fish for 15 yrs and seen just about everything....or so I thought)

One keeps swimming into the current and swimming sideways but I am not sure if fin damage is causing him trouble there.

Now I am wondering if I should stress them further by removing them to the 10 gal and using filter media to instantly cycle the small tank. The advantage I guess being that they would have nothing to hide behind and I could see them better, as well as using less medication should I need to.

I could do several wc per day if necessary either way, I am just not sure what to do.

I can raise the temp but I am not sure how high to raise it, I can add salt but am not sure if I can add aquarium salt to a planted tank.

I can tell you before I ever buy more discus I will have a large QT available (learned my lesson there for sure) and I will have them shipped the fastest way possible from a sponsor here:o

I am open to any comments but please remember that I have been beating myself up for 24 hours now. :( Anything constructive is appreciated.

aquaticplantman
02-07-2008, 01:51 PM
Sorry to hear this. If the seller is going to actually refund money for the DOAs (as opposed to a credit on some future order), then that's the best you can reasonably hope for. It's obvious you learned a valuable lesson here about buying discus. Hopefully other newbies will take heed.

Now for damage control. Personally, I would leave them in the tank they are in, keep the temperature between 86 and 88F, and do a salt treatment. Most plants can handle that for a few days or so. Definitely do as many water changes as you can as long as you are able to do it with pre-conditioned, aged water.

The four you have left sound like they are in okay shape if they are peeking out every now and then. Frozen bloodworms are a good treat to entice them to eat. Good luck.

-- Matt H.

GulfCoastDiscus
02-07-2008, 01:56 PM
Sorry to hear your bad experience. I NEVER ship out fish on a two day shipment. I always do same day or overnight delivery.

happygirl65
02-07-2008, 02:03 PM
Sorry to hear this. If the seller is going to actually refund money for the DOAs (as opposed to a credit on some future order), then that's the best you can reasonably hope for. It's obvious you learned a valuable lesson here about buying discus. Hopefully other newbies will take heed.

Now for damage control. Personally, I would leave them in the tank they are in, keep the temperature between 86 and 88F, and do a salt treatment. Most plants can handle that for a few days or so. Definitely do as many water changes as you can as long as you are able to do it with pre-conditioned, aged water.

The four you have left sound like they are in okay shape if they are peeking out every now and then. Frozen bloodworms are a good treat to entice them to eat. Good luck.

-- Matt H.

OK, I will do that. I hope others will take heed as well. If you cheap out, you will get what you pay for....I should have known....:(

Elite Aquaria
02-07-2008, 03:20 PM
Sorry to hear the misfortune...:(

I think I would fill the 10 gallon tank with the same water the fish are in then proceed to work with observing the fish for any illness...you can add salt and up the temp to around 88. I would also keep food to a min. and only feed clean food like FBW...no Beef Heart.

Good Luck...

pcsb23
02-07-2008, 06:33 PM
It's a 6 and 2 3's situation as to leave them or move them. Any cross contamination will have happened so that won't be eliminated by moving them. Teating in a planted tank though is a pain. I would suggest leaving them where they are and keeping the tank spotless. I would not even add salt at this time. Just lots and lots of clean water. I'd also keep the temps normal, ie around 84f (29C). Wipe the walls and other hard surfaces regularly and use prehetaed conditioned water if possible.

Oh and don't beat yourself up too much, believe me I've done worse in the past!

happygirl65
02-07-2008, 07:58 PM
Well I just did a 60% wc today and wiped everything down. My messing around in there scared them back into hiding but I felt like it was probably important to keep doing it anyway.

My water is well water so I don't need to treat it with chemicals and I tested the temp before beginning to refill on the water coming out of the python. The pH stays stable at water change due to the CO2 injection in this tank and according to my digital meters there was no change in temp or pH after the change.

(Of course having had this tank up for 7 months I already knew how the parameters would react at water change time)

So doing water changes is quite easy on this tank, the hardest part is trying to keep my dog from playing with the python hose out the back door!

I think I will keep them where they are just because this tank is the most stable in terms of pH. If I tried to move them I would have to acclimate them to a higher pH and I really don't want to stress them any more than I need to right now. It is tempting because I want to watch them more carefully but after what they went through already I am scared that this just might finish them off.

I have filled up the 10g and am heating it just incase I really need to do something quickly but I am hoping they will continue to get better.

judy
02-07-2008, 08:19 PM
I hope they make it for you.... if they've survived this far, maybe there are a few angels with gills perched on their dorsal fins..

Kenny's Discus
02-07-2008, 08:32 PM
Hi happygirl65, the hiding part for new arrivals, especially for a small # of discus like your 4 is not to be unexpected. If it's not too severe, slight fin damage from ammonia burns can heal itself quite rapidly. Follow the advice given by our friends here to keep the water clean and warm, observe them for a few more days to see if they will settle down more. IMHO I will also add salt at 2 tbs/10g as a mild de-stressor. I hope they'll come around for you soon don't be depressed we're all here to help.:)

Kenny

happygirl65
02-08-2008, 04:03 PM
I thank you so kindly for your words of encouragement! :) It makes me feel really good to know there are some people out there who understand and support what I am trying to do. :)

DiscusOnly
02-09-2008, 12:22 AM
Great to hear that the Discus are coming around. Who did you get these Discus from. I think it would help others in avoiding this seller for their future Discus purchase.

happygirl65
02-09-2008, 08:51 AM
Great to hear that the Discus are coming around. Who did you get these Discus from. I think it would help others in avoiding this seller for their future Discus purchase.

I think I will wait a few more days then post it in the review section. Then at least I can accurately report whether or not I got refunded for the DOA.

I can say there is a thread already there about this cleverly named web only seller that I didn't see until after I had received them, and I wish I had. :( There were LOTS of replies to the thread, most of them not good. I thought because they clearly paid a lot of money to promote their site that they must be a good seller. Reading that thread made me realize that as a newbie to discus I probably just threw my money away on these guys. Which is really sad since this has been a dream of mine for so many years.:(

I would HIGHLY recommend staying away from any seller that only offers USPS shipping, as express can still take 2 days or longer and caution ANY newbie to be wary of anyone who tells you this is fine because the fish can live for a week in the bag because of their excellent packaging....my answer now is....sure they are alive...most of them:(....but that doesn't mean they are in good shape and now I have to nurse them back to health which is not something a newbie should need to do. (and I am not so sure that their packaging was that great being that they were zip tied shut and had almost no air left when they arrived)

Get your new fish to you in the fastest way possible. If you can pick them up do it. If you can't then airport shipping might be best. I think these fish might have been ok if it didn't take so long to get here.

My fish got a lot of damage in shipping. A LOT. I have had lots of other fish in my lifetime and have never seen one as bad off as the one I now call Rocky.

I removed Rocky to his own tank so he can recover (hopefully) without being picked on. I can watch him more carefully now and I added salt to help destress him.

One of the 3 remaining in the display tank has a white thing on it's side that I am not sure if it is an injury, or something else. (The fish were shipped 2 to a bag so who knows it could have gotten poked at in shipping)

It doesn't appear to be flicking or scratching. So I still need to watch all of them carefully.

I would also say to anyone thinking that your new fish don't need a QT to think it over, because I wish I had put them all in QT now, not because I think my tank wasn't good enough or clean enough, but because they got so stressed from shipping and now it is hard to watch them in a planted tank where they have lots of places to hide.