i will recive my new discus in couple days now but ph is 6...do i have to increase i

[ionas.simion.damian]

120 gal fluval fx5 press co2 with inline reactor
i have some peat nuggets from weiss (they say replicate black water)
2 big malaezian and1 big mopani driftwood
lots of swords and anubias
83 f temp
0 nitrite amonia and nitrate

8 cory 3 bristlenose and about 10 3" discus
should i take the peat out to get the ph at 6.4-6.6?

[RyanH]

As long as it's stable your fine. Just acclimate them slowly if they came from higher pH water. I'd use the bucket drip method if they are doing ok when you get them home.

[ionas.simion.damian]

so what s the lowest that can go?

[RyanH]

They've been found in the wild in water so acidic it would burn your skin.

[discus bob]

One more thing, once you get the fish in and start regular water-changes keeping a stable PH may be more difficult. If you can keep it stable without using a lot a additives you fish will do well.

[Apistomaster]

Making regular water changes tends to stabilize the water chemistry rather than the other way around.

It is also better to add the discus immediately and none of the shipping water. The drip method is so yesterday.

[kirkp]

Larry,

I appreciate the knowledge and experience you have and which you willingly share with this forum. I have a few years experience although no fish right now but I have a question for you.

Why do you say that the drip method is "so yesterday"? Granted, it's been around for awhile but in my experience it works well. You indicated that it's better to add the fish immediately but I would think that would be worse. Isn't it a certainty that the water in the bag will be significantly different than the tank water? I would think a person would be better off letting the temp and pH adjust slowly and avoid the sudden shock of quickly placing them in the tank.

Thanks for everything.

Kirk

[Graham]

Actually Kirk, if the fish have been in the bagany lenght of time the pH of the bag water will be lower than your tank water. The high levels of CO2 will drop the pH down into the 5's to low 6's.

The problem with the drip method is that as soon as the bag is opened the CO2 will start gassing off. As it does the pH will rise. The high ammonia levels that have built up in the bag become toxic once the pH is above about 7.2. The drip method just allows that NH3 to become toxic.

In your case with a pH of 6 it wouldn't be a problem....but overall they are much better off out of the crap water in the bag.

G

EDIT needless to say they should be temp acclimatized

[DavidH]

Follow Graham's advice, I lost fish due to the pH change and have used the heat and drop method ever since.

Dave

[Apistomaster]

Graham and Dave have explained the rational for using the the removal from the shipping water ASAP as well as I could. If there is a large difference between the bag temp and the aquarium then equalize to approximately the same but do not open the bags until you are ready to remove the fish.

This method has gradually come to be recognized as the best practice for handling all shipped fish. It may seem counterintuitive but it is the best method.
The CO2 build up inside a shipping bag actually has two desirable effects.
1. It keeps the pH below 7.0 reducing the toxic effects of ammonia.
2. CO2 acts as a fish anesthetic reducing the fish metabolism rate during shipping.

[Don Trinko]

Most of the dealers recomend matching the temperature and then transfering using none of the water that was used to transport the fish. Grahm and others have pointed out the reasons. It is not that the drip method is bad but that the water they have been shipped in is so bad (especialy after opening the bag) that you are better off getting them out of it ASAP.
If you pick your fish up and tranport them yourself (only several hours in transport) the drip method can be beneficial IF there is a LARGE difference in water paramiters. Don T.

[kirkp]

Thanks for the replies everyone. I get what you're saying and it does make sense. I've always used the drip method but that was on bags of fish that I'd bought locally. I've never shipped fish in. Therein lies the difference. But oh, how I'd love to ship in some nice wilds.

Thanks, Kirk