How much Sleep do discus need?

[Marfie]

I currently have the lights on my duscus aquarium set to 18 hrs of light and 6 hrs of dark....is that too much light becuase in the amazon I guess they would have about only 12 hrs. Any ideas or opionions?

Marfie

[kenhappen2u]

IMO. 18 hours is a long time , maybe after a extended time it may cause some stress and that can open up another can of worms for you and your fish . not to mention the alge . its not like I / we havnt done it myself at one time or another but all the time seems a bit much ...Again IMO


Ken

ps: i have 2 of my 3 tanks on a timer .....8 am on for feeding and 10:30pm lights out . about 14 hours on 10hrs off

[ShinShin]

My fishroom lights are on 24/7.

Mat

[Discus-Hans]

24/7 on, only in the "show room" we put the light a little down when we leave BGE is loving me a little to much lol
And in the part were we breed the BN's we temper the light at night to make them more active,

Hans

[CraigG]

Mine go on at 8am of at 7:30pm this is just for the plants so they have time to photosyntisize.

But at 7:30 my moonlights go on.

[07 Maverick P51]

I currently have the lights on my duscus aquarium set to 18 hrs of light and 6 hrs of dark....is that too much light becuase in the amazon I guess they would have about only 12 hrs. Any ideas or opionions?

Marfie

18 hours is a long time. Do you have any algae problem? Your fishes and plants need more relieve from the bright light. My lights are from 6:30 Am to 6:30 PM, and the fishes are happy and the plants are growing.

[Marfie]

18 hours is a long time. Do you have any algae problem? Your fishes and plants need more relieve from the bright light. My lights are from 6:30 Am to 6:30 PM, and the fishes are happy and the plants are growing.

I haven't had any problems with algae. I wipe the glass every week and periodically wash/scrub the one or two ornaments I do have.

Marfie

[hyperfocus]

I'm just a new guy around here, but i have done allot of research on lighting. I have a heavily planted 90G tank and use 4 55W 24" retrofit in my canopy. I have a pair of 5500K bulbs along the rear, and a pair of 6700K towards the front. I also have 3 lunar led light sets.

They are all setup on timers. The rear 5500k lights are on from 8am to 7pm, and the lunar lights are on from 7pm to 8am (duh). The 6700K front lights are on another timer. They turn on from 11am to 1pm, then again from 3pm to 4pm.

I have tried to simulate a natural day/night cycle and think that both my plants and discus are happy with this pattern of light and darkness. I believe that Discus have evolved larger eyes for seeing in dark, murky waters. Forcing them to be in bright lights would be like driving all day with no sunglasses. Sure you can do it, but it sucks. And like others have mentioned, lights being on for too long may promote algae growth.

Even with the lunar lights, i have designed the layout to leave the most heavily planted 1/4 of the tank completely dark.... This way the fish that prefer darkness have a place to sleep. i.e., some people sleep with the tv or a night light on, but others prefer to sleep without any lights. I assume my fish may have personal preferences as well.

hth!

[Tropical Haven]

My lights go on at 5:30am and turn off at 10pm.

[07 Maverick P51]

They are all setup on timers. The rear 5500k lights are on from 8am to 7pm, and the lunar lights are on from 7pm to 8am (duh). The 6700K front lights are on another timer. They turn on from 11am to 1pm, then again from 3pm to 4pm.

You are a true professional. You also know that plant's ultimate time of photosynthesis is 3 hours after there is light, by using your 6700k, and you would have only two hour window to help them them with this process. Outstanding setup!

[MostlyDiscus]

24 7 for the last 15yrs. Havent had a fish complain yet...:)

[kaceyo]

Is there a reason for leaving the light on 24/7? Obviously it doesn't stress the fish out like one might expect or so many wouldn't be doing it successfully, but why do it in the first place?

Kacey

[prolude006]

I would be curious as to what 24/7 lighting would do to fish. I know plants can adjust to 24/7 light as most hydroponic setups and some greenhouses do this, but fish...I don't know seems cruel to me.
Algae would be limited by the nutrients so that could be controlled regardless of the light times and amounts.
24/7 for my home use cuts into my electric bill too!! Maybe I am just cheap!!lol
I am one for the natural route I guess.

[seanyuki]

I am using a blue bulb in the room after 10 pm to view the discus.

http://i255.photobucket.com/albums/hh127/seanyuki/DSCF2774.jpg


Cheers
Francis:)

[ShinShin]

Kacey,

It's easier than trying to coordinate my work schedual to the day/night patterns we have up here to a feeding schedual.

Mat

[Roxanne]

ok...lights...so anyway, how much SLEEP do discus need? Do they only sleep with the lights off? Do they sit down? Do they even sleep?
:confused:

[Peachtree Discus]

good question. the problem is, fish behaviors appear only subtly different to our eyes, so it's hard to know. every animal rests but land dweller sleep is likely much different. simulating appropriate amounts of daylight is probably the only way to ensure they get the rest they would have in nature. how could you answer that question without doing some sort of analysis a live fish's brain?? :confused:

[GrillMaster]

Hmmmmmmmm....I dont think Discus really care what ya throw at em as far as lights. I bet when they are tired they will take their naps...;) :)

The problem lies when ya start throwin food at em at all hours of the night. I would say my discus dont ever sleep. :D :D

Wish I could do that! ;)

[ShinShin]

They probabally do not "sleep" as we understand sleep. Rest is a more appropriate word, I would believe.

Mat

[brewmaster15]

I used to have the lights on the 24/7 for years... but with all the tanks I have and the inefficient adhoc lighting I acquired over the years... It was literally costing me over $100 month in electric..... Now the light cycle is probably at least 8 -10 hours off... but I always keep on a few small lights as the room is often traveled and that keeps them from getting spooked.


Discus do sleep in some form... turn the lights off for a few hours and turn them on.... ..you see the color has faded, they tend to be on their sides and they take a few minutes to actually "wake up" indicating their brains have definetly gone into low gear:) ... physiologically "sleep" is necessary for all vertebrates in some form...


-al

hth,

al

[Roxanne]

Discus do sleep in some form... turn the lights off for a few hours and turn them on.... ..you see the color has faded, they tend to be on their sides and they take a few minutes to actually "wake up" indicating their brains have definetly gone into low gear:) ... physiologically "sleep" is necessary for all vertebrates in some form...


-al

hth,

al

Oh. My. God. I thought my fish was sick last night because the symptoms you described were EXACTLY what was happening. (Except my little melon head was swimming backwards which freaked me out until they all started doing it...) I must have disturbed them with the lights on and off, me poking at them and annoying the crap out of them when all they wanted was S-L-E-E-P! I had just moved them to a newly cycled tank & I thought it was new tank syndrome...I was wondering how they slept, but I think when you make that land dwellers and water dwellers comparison, it makes it a little easier to get my brain around it..

Thanks everybody:);):)

[Roxanne]

Wish I could do that! ;)

Yeah bro, me too!!:)

[Discus-Hans]

Just like Al said, they do kind of sleep or go in sleep mode if it's dark.
I know when I had my planted tank the were down at the bottom, hanging against the plants and drift wood, off color, and eyes turned down.
When I put on the lights they really had to kind of wake up.

Hans

[Roxanne]

Hi Hans, :)thanx;)

Sleep Mode:D Question:Have you noticed if their eyes go pale, not the black middle, but around that part?

A novice such as myself could easily self diagnose the wrong thing and administer the wrong treatment, which in my case would have been crazy seeing as I have the tanks PERFECT now and there was NOTHING wrong!
And the fish are shoaling, happy & playing & interactive with me and, well, there is peace & calm in my house cos when the fish are happy, so am I. Look after your fish, and your fish will look after you!
.

Rox

[Discus-Hans]

Maybe, think so, not sure, it was many moons ago lol

One of the biggest problems with Discus keepers, PANIC... Discus a little off and WHOOOPAAAAAAAAAAA trow in those medications, ever noticed that people who start with one med a few weeks later need the next one and soon they have Discus that only keep swimming (and sleeping if you want) if you trow in enough medication.

People get headaches, they get an upset stomach, they get a flu, they get "water poopie" they get.......God knows what. I don't use hardly any meds for myself (or my Discus)
I think it makes my body (and my Discus) stronger, first let your body (or Discus) fight it before..........ahhhhh lets not get on my soapbox,

Hans

[Roxanne]

Hans, please Don't get off that soap box, or I'll jump on it!!:D

I agree with letting the old immune system have a go, considering that's what it was designed for...I don't go to the Doctor unless I get a migraine headache!
:)


"Water poopie"....:D:D:D:D:D:D:D

[Peachtree Discus]

maybe i'm beating a dead horse, but i had a scare last night.

last night i came into the fish room (no tank lights and room light off). looking at a newly formed pair that finally got some freeswimmers, of course the 1st thing i remember is i didn't leave on a light :balloon:(pop),...anywayz the parents are kinda sitting in a near death-motionless state, only 1 of them was barely moving at the bottom. i look at another tank and all the fish are kinda huddled at the bottom, floating a bit sideways and not moving. i'm thinking...o sh**, something in the water and :mad: trying to size up the disaster. looked to my breeders..same thing...hanging near the bottom sometimes floating kinda diagonally. then 1 fish kinda "snapped out of it" ....after 5-10 minutes everybody was fine.



Discus do sleep in some form... turn the lights off for a few hours and turn them on.... ..you see the color has faded, they tend to be on their sides and they take a few minutes to actually "wake up" indicating their brains have definetly gone into low gear:)

now i am convinced they were more than just resting....they were all sleeping.

[Roxanne]

scares the crap out of ya though doesn't it if you don't know they do it cos they almost look dead if they are horizontal & not moving...maybe this thread should be renamed, "Discus Do Sleep".....;)

[Discus-Hans]

maybe i'm beating a dead horse, but i had a scare last night.

last night i came into the fish room (no tank lights and room light off). looking at a newly formed pair that finally got some freeswimmers, of course the 1st thing i remember is i didn't leave on a light :balloon:(pop),...anywayz the parents are kinda sitting in a near death-motionless state, only 1 of them was barely moving at the bottom. i look at another tank and all the fish are kinda huddled at the bottom, floating a bit sideways and not moving. i'm thinking...o sh**, something in the water and :mad: trying to size up the disaster. looked to my breeders..same thing...hanging near the bottom sometimes floating kinda diagonally. then 1 fish kinda "snapped out of it" ....after 5-10 minutes everybody was fine.

now i am convinced they were more than just resting....they were all sleeping.

Wes,

I can say only one thing, YOU'RE LUCKY, VERY LUCKY.

If one of your Discus would have scared and start "shooting" trough your tank, 90% would have start splashing. You really could have had a disaster, a BIG disaster, don't push your luck and leave a light on, you never know if you've to go back in later,

Hans.

[Roxanne]

....
If one of your Discus would have scared and start "shooting" trough your tank, 90% would have start splashing. You really could have had a disaster, a BIG disaster....

Hi Hans:D

What disaster? Can you say what could have happened? Do you mean they smack in to the glass?

I saw you Marlboro Jumbos (is that right?) all I can say is WOOOOOW!


Rox

BTW Here's a pic of 1 of my turks asleep under the filter this morning. This is the first time I have seen something odd that I didn't PANIC at as a first reaction!!

[Discus-Hans]

Yes Roxanne,

they can smack HARD in the glass when you scare them with the lights,

Hans

[kaceyo]

Yes Roxanne,

they can smack HARD in the glass when you scare them with the lights,

Hans

Then, if they hit hard enough, it's "lights out" forever!!!

[Darren's Discus]

Then, if they hit hard enough, it's "lights out" forever!!!
Yes had a few of them unfortunatly over the years ! maybe we need air bags for our tanks !!:D my lights go on 6am and off at 10pm and I always have a small night light on in my fishroom.


cheers

[Kenny's Discus]

Very interesting thread indeed.

I myself usually turn my fishroom light off(total darkness) after midnight and when I wake up in the morning I turn their room light back on. One thing I've noticed is that if they did get some rest in total darkness during the night, and if I were to then turn the light off in the afternoon they don't seem to be in as much of sleeping mode anymore. How did I notice that you may ask? Well when I feed my fish first thing in the morning after lights are first lit, it usually takes like what Al said 15 mins+ for them to wake up...but during the day sometimes it takes less or no time for them to swim right at the food which indicates they were more alert, if they did get some quality sleep/rest at night. JME

Kenny

[Eddie]

My tank lights go out at 10pm, total darkness until the sun rises and lightens up the room enough to get my Discus up. So more or less, my Discus wake when the rooster does. I can see them waiting for me as I come down the stairs at 0700, so once I switch the light on, it's all you can eat breakfast buffet. :D

[Roxanne]

I don't think I want to risk the nightmare Hans, Kacey & Darren have had. Would be a terrible event to witness, I think I'll leave a fishy night light on for a little peace of mind. Though all our tanks are in the bedroom at the moment so I guess I will have to sleep on the lounge!!! My poor husband keeps having his fish interaction lessons changed. Do this, oh no I was wrong, do this, no don't do that do this...lights on...lights off..stop...go...you're too close...you're scaring them, get away now they only like me.....:D

Do they see in the dark? Surely, they must have some kind of night vision? I can assume their eyes need time to adjust, when God turns the overhead lights out in South America do all the fish start bumping into each other? Granted there is no glass to crash into, still rocks & stuff though. And, do they not 'sense' the end of the glass in a tank? I guess the answer to the last one must be no.:(

[Peachtree Discus]

they can smack HARD in the glass when you scare them with the lights,


i guess that's probably true. i can remember lots of darting before i switched to 1 of those twisty hi-efficiency bulbs. those bulbs seem to take a few minutes to warm-up and reach full brightness. i think that helps


...when God turns the overhead lights out in South America do all the fish start bumping into each other?

that's funny....i can see them all reaching in front of them with their fins... the way we do to keep from running into anything in the dark. :D:D

[Roxanne]

hee hee..trying to find their night vision goggles..:D

I think there's something in what you said about the light taking a while to reach full strength. Like the sun comes up slowly, our eyes have time to adjust, so do the animals. Rather considerate of the big Guy to wait til we been awake for a while before he hits us with his 450,000,000 watt over head hallelujah lighting set up. ;)

[fishman1978]

awesome question.I just can't get enough of this site. me and my discus love it! lol

[majik]

My poor husband keeps having his fish interaction lessons changed. Do this, oh no I was wrong, do this, no don't do that do this...lights on...lights off..stop...go...you're too close...you're scaring them, get away now they only like me.....:D
:(

Roxanne you are hilarious ive read many threads you have responded to and you often have me LMAO:D

[Roxanne]

.....g'day from across 'the ditch' majik;)...

[Eddie]

Very interesting thread indeed.

I myself usually turn my fishroom light off(total darkness) after midnight and when I wake up in the morning I turn their room light back on. One thing I've noticed is that if they did get some rest in total darkness during the night, and if I were to then turn the light off in the afternoon they don't seem to be in as much of sleeping mode anymore. How did I notice that you may ask? Well when I feed my fish first thing in the morning after lights are first lit, it usually takes like what Al said 15 mins+ for them to wake up...but during the day sometimes it takes less or no time for them to swim right at the food which indicates they were more alert, if they did get some quality sleep/rest at night. JME

Kenny


This would bring me to believe that discus sleep according to the earths positon on its rotational axis (Night and Day). If you leave the tanks lights off all day and night for weeks, will they stay in their sleep like positions and never move, never eat...I don't think so. This is why as Kenny pointed out, his fish were more alert when he had turned the lights on in the afternoon, thats becuase they were not sleeping even though the lights were out. When I stay up very late and leave my tank lights on, my discus move to positions about the tank and just huddle, motionless. In the same still postions, just as if I turned the tank lights on in the morning. So with the tank lights left on, they seem to still sleep in their floating positions, being less active as they are throughout the day. Give it a try, you'll be surprised. Its the lunar cycles ;)

Just a gee wiz thing :o

Eddie

[Roxanne]

but, how do they know what hemisphere they are in?:D

[Eddie]

I mean as far as east and west it doesn't matter but north and south, I guess it would depend how high or how low you are. Anybody on this site living in antartica? Do your discus sleep? :D

[1077]

I do know that my discus aren't always asleep when i think they are. I rise for work around midnight and once or twice a week I place algae wafer or two in the discus tank for whitespot pleco. When i go into the living room where the tank is located I usually sit in the dark for a moment or two and smoke the first cigarette of the day. On more than one occasion while lighting my smoke, I have seen the discus at the spot where I dropped the algae wafer before retiring and well after lights off. I have a standing floor lamp with three way switch for brightness and after the first cigarette I turn on the lamp. Most times the discus are resting behind a large piece of driftwood and take a few minutes before they come to the front of the glass. But on the evenings that I place the algae wafers in the tank they dart for the driftwood when the floor lamp is turned on. I now also add a piece of sweet red bell pepper for the white spot as I am not at all certain that discus don't gobble up the wafers .I have found that the standing floor lamp does not startle them nearly as much as the overhead light on the tank.

[Roxanne]

hey Eddie...only 1 way to tell...the scientific way...blindfold them and then spin em around a few times:D ......Ask Chaz , he is in Antarctica!;) I have had the lights off in the tanks during treatment lately, and I've been spying on them with the "DisCam", and they swim around even with the lights off and rest when they feel lke it, but seemingly to their own schedule.......ask a shift worker if they ever get to interact with their fish...I think it is about when they get fed, the fish aren't asleep when I reel them into the boat at nite, they were awake and eating my bait!! But, if you consider that prawns run at nite, and at certain times of year, that IS governed by the lunar cycle....anything's possible..



...I now also add a piece of sweet red bell pepper for the white spot ...

Hi 1077

Interesting. Can u explain this please?

Rox

[1077]

Roxanne,
The sweet red bell pepper is a favorite of the white spot but the discus thus far have showed no taste for it. So even if the discus are eating the algae wafers before "spot" (girlfriend named it:() finds them ,I can be sure he is getting his veggies. Spot also is fond of everything the discus eat but is largely nocturnal. I have seen him venture out during the day but the discus are quite a bit larger at the moment and seem to spook him. Also feed sweet potato, zucchinni, romain lettuce, cucumber, and sallys seaweed salad which discus rip from the veggie clip before the pleco can get it. He will eventually grow to a reported eight inches, perhaps then things will be different.

[Triadtropz]

thats one reason it's bad to keep plecos with discus,...the discus never sleep, a pleco will try to feed on the slimecoat..

[1077]

You may be on to something. now that I think about it , I don't believe I have ever seen the Discus with their eyes closed.Seriously, I have found that if the plecos are being fed appropriate foods they more often as not show little interest in slime coat of other fish.

[Roxanne]

.... I don't believe I have ever seen the Discus with their eyes closed.....

lol...they don't have eyelids:D

I thought you meant a red bell pepper is good for 'white spot', not "spot" loves the bell pepper....lol....(your GF chose a great name BTW;))

[Daniella]

I don't know. My discus seem to get more relaxed and adopt a sleeping position and location when I close the ligth at nigt and then I only leave an ambiant light in the room. They change their behavior and seem more in a sleeping position, relaxed when this happen. I would not leave the full light 24/7 but that's me. It's just not natural.


Is there a reason for leaving the light on 24/7? Obviously it doesn't stress the fish out like one might expect or so many wouldn't be doing it successfully, but why do it in the first place?

Kacey

[discolove]

I have seen my discus position himself on one the plants of the tank and not move for awhile, I guess hes sleeping or trying to atleast. The first time I saw this I stuck my hand in the tank and poked him to make sure he wasn't dead and then he darted behind something lol. My tank lights go on everyday at 11am and off at 9pm, at which time the moonlights come on.

[prolude006]

All of my discus move to their chosen spot in the tank 10 minutes before the lights go out.
I could tell you what time it is just by watching them. My lights are automatic and I only use the moonlights occasionally to see what they do at night. The fish are stationary if I use a flashlight to see them but they do slowly swim around if I leave the moonlights on for a bit. I feel everything needs a little dark time!!

[hmccsal]

I'm so glad I read this. I had the lights turned off for about a 2 hours and wanted to check on my quarantined discus. Three were huddled by the heater the other 2 by the filter. I thought they were sick, because when I turned the light on they didnt move. They looked like little zombie fish, and they lost the red from their eyes. They were all a pale color. All I can say is "wheeeeewwwww"

[Daniella]

wow, how do they know? Amazing if they can keep track of time like that.

Moonlight? are you talking about the real moon or something else?


All of my discus move to their chosen spot in the tank 10 minutes before the lights go out.
I could tell you what time it is just by watching them. My lights are automatic and I only use the moonlights occasionally to see what they do at night. The fish are stationary if I use a flashlight to see them but they do slowly swim around if I leave the moonlights on for a bit. I feel everything needs a little dark time!!

[MSD]

How do you know Dani? Discus must have an internal clock like we do, when its dark or they are tired they sleep.

[seanyuki]

Just sharing I leave the blue light on 24/7....still could view the discus any time of the night.....even very late at night lah.


Daytime light in the fish room

http://i379.photobucket.com/albums/oo232/aiseanyuki/th_2009_06130001.jpg (http://i379.photobucket.com/albums/oo232/aiseanyuki/2009_06130001.jpg) http://i379.photobucket.com/albums/oo232/aiseanyuki/th_2009_06130002.jpg (http://i379.photobucket.com/albums/oo232/aiseanyuki/2009_06130002.jpg)


Only the blue light at night

http://i379.photobucket.com/albums/oo232/aiseanyuki/th_thDSCF4916.jpg (http://i379.photobucket.com/albums/oo232/aiseanyuki/thDSCF4916.jpg)

Cheers
Francis:)