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lemondiscus
05-11-2009, 09:29 AM
Hi, first I wanted to say hi to everyone on here! This is my first post to the site and I have been on another forum for a while but have not had any stimulating conversations as most on the board don't keep Discus and the few others that do think they know a lot but have only been keeping them for a few months.

I have a 125 gallon tank that I keep stocked with the following:
6 Wild Heckels
5 Red Sunsets
1 Marlboro Red
1 Mayan Jade
1 Blue Turquoise
1 Domesticated Brown
-- 4 Corydoras
-- 4 Cardinal Tetras (had 20 but I was fighting algae and lost most)
-- 10 ish Oto Catfish

I keep a planted tank. Here is a picture.
http://www.ryanerb.com/images/tank/tank415.jpg

I keep the following parameters and have been successful at keeping them but still working to get pairs.

Temp - 88
PH - 5.8
GH - 65
KH - < 10
Nitrate - around 10ppm
Nitrite - 0
Ammonia - 0

I currently have what I believe are 2 males guarding territories in the tank, but they dont seem to have any females interested yet.

1 male guards a piece of driftwood and the other guards one of my 3 filters intake tube... both males are Wild Heckels and dont seem interested in any of my domesticated ones in the colony. There is what I think is 1 female that the one by the driftwood will let come over without becoming aggressive toward it. The only thing these 2 will do is gently bump each other around a little bit, but then the female swims off gently... maybe they will pair, but I know... patience!

Here are some older pics of a few of the Heckels. These pics were taken a few minutes after acclimation to my show tank.
http://www.ryanerb.com/images/tank/Heckel1.jpg
http://www.ryanerb.com/images/tank/Heckel2.jpg
http://www.ryanerb.com/images/tank/heckelGroup.jpg
http://www.ryanerb.com/images/tank/discusGroup2.jpg

I have been keeping Discus for around 4 years now and previous to the Discus I kept Oscars. I have 4 tanks right now... my 125 show, a 55 gallon isolation/breeder tank if needed, a 30 gallon Angelfish breeder tank and a 20 gallon Class N Endler tank.

AquatiCreations
05-11-2009, 09:41 AM
Hi,and welcome to Simply!

These fish are absolutely beautiful, I always enjoy looking at heckels.

Thanks for sharing!

lemondiscus
05-11-2009, 07:24 PM
Ok, so today I decided to take a risk. I picked out that male guarding the driftwood and that 1 other Heckel that I think is a female and put them alone in the 55 gallon tank.

No I guess I wait and see what happens if I did pick out a true pair or if I snagged 2 of the same sex. They did group together when added to the 55 and are sticking together the whole hour they have been in the tank...

On the plus side they are the only 2 fish in the tank (no smaller fish to pick off spawns) and it is in my bedroom upstairs so there is no house traffic in the room with them.

The 55 gallon tank has a few pieces (2) of driftwood and an Amazon Sword... I will upload pics of this setup and the 2 that I picked out a little later today.

lemondiscus
05-11-2009, 07:52 PM
Ok here is some pictures of my 55 with the pair? of Heckels.... They are not happy campers getting moved as you see in the picture... I figure in another few hours they will be ok and moving around a bit more...

I think the one on the right is the male and the one on the right facing the camera is the female... (that is correct given I was right in picking them by behavior...)
http://www.ryanerb.com/images/tank/heckel.jpg
http://www.ryanerb.com/images/tank/heckelbreeder.jpg

and one of what is left for Discus in my 125... They want food if you cannot tell! lol

http://www.ryanerb.com/images/tank/heckelTank.jpg

Darren's Discus
05-11-2009, 08:00 PM
Welcome to simply,
very nice tank and fish,all the best with your heckel pair.

cheers

lemondiscus
05-11-2009, 08:04 PM
Thank you, from the past few years of research on this strain, I need all the luck I can get!

My main worry is that I picked a male and a female.... None of my Heckels have shown me their breeding tubes... some of my domestics have and just observing the males getting chased away by the one guarding the wood and the one allowed to get next to the other I feel that they kind of want to pair... with 13 other Discus and other smaller fish that would be preditors to the eggs, they just may not feel safe enough to spawn.... or I am wrong...

Eddie
05-11-2009, 08:22 PM
Thank you, from the past few years of research on this strain, I need all the luck I can get!

My main worry is that I picked a male and a female.... None of my Heckels have shown me their breeding tubes... some of my domestics have and just observing the males getting chased away by the one guarding the wood and the one allowed to get next to the other I feel that they kind of want to pair... with 13 other Discus and other smaller fish that would be preditors to the eggs, they just may not feel safe enough to spawn.... or I am wrong...

Heckels are tough to breed bro.

Eddie

lemondiscus
05-11-2009, 08:32 PM
I know... I have been working with and researching Discus for a few years!

I have not even had luck with domesticated.... honestly I have came closer to a pair with the Heckels than the Domestics.... I think my Domestics are too young still though (most of them)

I actually got the Domestics to train me for keeping the Heckels! The Heckels were my dream fish! :D

SriAngel
05-11-2009, 10:34 PM
We.come to simply!

Its always great to have a fresh pair of eyes on the Heckel scene. Honestly it shows that you have put in a ton of work and done lots of research. I am sure you will have success in your future. My untrained opinion is that it is a pair in the Heckel biotope, have you thought of introducing a third heckel into that tank to get the pair to defend their territory. I know with the domestics adding a third female gets the pair in the "mood". Best of Luck and keep us posted!

lemondiscus
05-11-2009, 10:48 PM
At this time that makes me nervous... I wonder if they are not pairing in my show tank due to the stocking on the tank.... I am going to try it with just the 2 of them for a month or 2 and if nothing happens I may look for another female and throw her in...

Eddie
05-11-2009, 11:02 PM
At this time that makes me nervous... I wonder if they are not pairing in my show tank due to the stocking on the tank.... I am going to try it with just the 2 of them for a month or 2 and if nothing happens I may look for another female and throw her in...

How do you know its a male and female. :o

Eddie

lemondiscus
05-12-2009, 06:54 AM
I dont "know".

I made an educated guess because the one was cleaning and guarding the driftwood. In my experience keeping cichlids that is male behavior. I have some domestics that I have visually sexed as Males that this one would not tolerate.

The "female" was guessed because it is the ONLY other fish that the one guarding the driftwood would allow to come near that area. "She" just had other choices it seemed and was not 100% sure she wanted him...

I figured if I took those 2 and put them together there will be no choice but for them to try to pair if they wanted to spawn at least a little.

There still is a possibility I was wrong. Visually in body, they are a bit different in shape but I know better than to try and sex a Discus that way! A few years ago I sexed one that way using its fins.... it seemed to be a female because its fins were rounded off, but I caught its breeding tube hanging out and it was undoubtable a male.

I have bred Oscars and Angelfish successfully so Discus would be my next endevor. Both of those species are not identifyable by color, pattern or anything else visual. You have to read the behavior or see their tubes down..... or see fertile eggs, if you are not used to looking....

BTW, Oscars are VERY hard to breed IMO. Angelfish are REALLY easy... I kind of figured that Discus would be in the middle... again I was wrong.. In the past few years I discovered they are MUCH harder than people make them out to be... lol

AquatiCreations
05-12-2009, 08:21 AM
Is that moss,or algae on your driftwood? I gotta say,it looks nice. :D

lemondiscus
05-12-2009, 09:23 AM
Is that moss,or algae on your driftwood? I gotta say,it looks nice. :D

LOL!!!! That is too funny! It actually is Black Beard Algae... I got that junk in my tank from a sword I brought in... It took over my tank, I fought it with Peroxide for a while and killed off my Cardinal Tetra shoal and just gave up... It actually only grows on my driftwood now and I kind of like it myself too! :D

Sometimes I have seen my Wilds pecking at it... it is like another food for them!

Occasionally it gets onto plants, in which case I do a diluted bleach dip for the plants and its gone....

lemondiscus
05-12-2009, 11:14 AM
Could anyone also tell me the river of origination of these by the photos I have? I was thinking they look like Marimari's but they are too yellow it seems... Not sure... Any help?

lemondiscus
05-13-2009, 09:14 AM
Conditions of tank - 55 gallon as of 05/12/09

Temp - 83
PH - 6.6
GH - 3°dH
KH - 2°dH
Notes: 2 are eating a bit better but still not used to activity in the room. Sometimes I come near the tank and they dart away and hide. They are eating well though. Stress bars are lighter than yesterday and they are still side by side with only gentle nips and nudges. The 2 are ALWAYS together and NEVER separate. I have observed the assumed male pecking at the driftwood here and there... no real cleaning yet nor do I expect anything to happen fully yet.