Fishless cycle or maintenance idea....

[brewmaster15]

Hi all,
Its gardening season here and I was doing a project in garden when I had a thought on biofilters....Basically I was "speed Composting" ( my own term..so don't try and look it up!) a bale of hay... You do this by soaking a bale of hay with water and using ammonia on it ...The ammionia acts a nitrogen source for the bacteria and the hay is broken down as part of the process......The process is easy to monitor as it generates lots of heat... The idea here is kill any weed seeds in the hay before using it..

Parts of this should sound familar as what goes on in our fish tanks...

This time when I started the composting I had no clear ammonia to soak the bale with so I tried something different... Miracle Gro....I figured it was a decent source of nitrogen and it was...worked like a charm..

So..My thoughts are why not use miracle gro to cycle a tank or to maintain one when theres no fish? Any one ever try it?

Miracle Gro All purpose fertilizer contains..

15 % Total Nitrogen( of that 5.8% is Ammoniacle Nitrogen and 9.2% is urea Nitrogen)

It also has non- ammonia ingredients but I can't see them harming the biofilter...The tank may just need the lights out to prevent an algael bloom from the phosphate.

Contains...
Availible Phosphate....30%
Soluable Potash........15%


Boron... 0.02%
Copper.... 0.07% (water soluable)
Iron.......... 0.15% (chelated)
Manganese... 0.05%(Chelated)
Molybdenum ...0.0005%
Zn................0.06% ( water Soluble)


Haven't tried it yet..but seems like a viable alternative to clear ammonia when it can not be found?

Thoughts any one?

-al

[Chad Hughes]

Al,

Sounds like it would definately work. A lot of the ingredients that you state are in the miracle grow are items that I add to my planted tanks every 3 days. I guess figuring out how much to add is half the battle.

The next time that I am in the market to cycle a tank I'll give it a go!

Thanks for the tip!

Best wishes!

[Ed13]

I know someone that does just that, except he actually likes to let the tank get super green before sometime later dropping in livebeares or other fry. Not for discus though.
I can't see it going wrong, just no light and a 100% WC BEfore adding fish. No diseases since the nitrogen is only derived from urea right?

[Chad Hughes]

That's the way I understand it!

Great suggestion Al!

Best wishes!

[Dkarc@Aol.com]

We use backwash water from our polygyser filters to get bacteria into a new system....and a case of beer to get ammonia/nitrogen into it LOL. I wonder though how long the nitrifying bacteria can go before any significant die off would be noticeable? The miracle grow sounds like a great idea. It may even be better than what we have been using in the past (ammonia) as it has trace mineral elements. We have argued in class before the importance of these trace minerals to the nitrifying bacteria.....are we maintaining the water (through filtration) for the fish or for the bacteria to maintain the fish??

-Ryan

[Disgirl]

I just found this thread and want to give it a try. I have set up a 60 gal tank with gravel, few rocks and wood. Will add some live plants in the next few days. No fish for weeks, and it will be a community tank, no discus (???) I want to try using Miracle Gro fertilizer and see what happens. With no fish in the tank I feel brave enough to do it and experiment. Someone please tell me how much to add per gallon of water and how often? Chad? I can let this tank be the SD "guinea pig" for fert instead of ammonia to do a fishless cycle. What do you think?
Barb:)

[Chad Hughes]

I just found this thread and want to give it a try. I have set up a 60 gal tank with gravel, few rocks and wood. Will add some live plants in the next few days. No fish for weeks, and it will be a community tank, no discus (???) I want to try using Miracle Gro fertilizer and see what happens. With no fish in the tank I feel brave enough to do it and experiment. Someone please tell me how much to add per gallon of water and how often? Chad? I can let this tank be the SD "guinea pig" for fert instead of ammonia to do a fishless cycle. What do you think?
Barb:)

Barb,

I don't think any of us know exactly how much of the prduct to add as it's not a tried and true method of cycling. It's all principle and hypothesis at this point. You have an excellent opportunity to give this a shot and become Al's pioneer in the use of MG for cycling.

This is how I would approach it. In 60 gallons of water, I'd start with a tablespoonf or MG pre-dissoleved in a quart of water. Pour it in the tank and allow it to circulate for an hour. Check your tank parameters. If you have ammonia present between 1.0 and 4.0, allow that to rest until the cycle shows nitrite and nitrate. If you have more than 4, you could let that go as well since you don't have fish. Less than 1 and I would add another tablespoon.

I hope that helps a bit! Let us know how it goes! I'm glad to hear that your plants arrived on time! I look forward to pictures!

Best wishes!

[Disgirl]

Thanks Chad, I will go put some MG in the tank right now and test as you said. Will keep an eye on how it does and let you all know. Have some plants in there, lights on, filter running and now to add the "miracle". I guess this means that the plants will be getting fertilized and good bacteria will start growing all at the same time with not a single fish in there. This may be a discovery :D
Barb

[Chad Hughes]

Barb,

Sounds great! If you have added the plants that I sent you, then your bacteria beds will colonize very qickly! If I were to guess, I'd say you should see signs of a nearly full cycle within about 7 to 10 days. Let's see what happens!

Best wishes!