PDA

View Full Version : Easy Water Change



wgtaylor
06-14-2009, 11:06 PM
Well the title says it, Easy Water Changes for my contest discus.
I hope this method can make changing water easier for someone just starting out that only have one or two tanks.

We moved into a new house a couple years ago and had several projects to complete before I can build another fish room.
Last December we built a two story double garage. Got lucky, the whole month of December was sunny and 75 to 80 degrees.
The garage project got completed ahead of schedule and I am seriously thinking it would make a really nice two story fish room.
Besides, who ever has room in their garage to park a car. My last garage got converted to a fish room.
After the garage was built, in between rains, came a large deck and stairs coming into the front of the house and a stairway leading
into the kitchen area. Just a couple more things to do before final inspection then......the fish room. :):)

In the meantime I started collecting a few tanks and discus which I setup in a spare room in the house. Some of these tanks have
sump tanks built into the cabinets below the main tanks. This room has just about all the tanks I want to handle until I get a more
permanent setup for them.

My small fishroom
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll50/wgtaylor/Water%20Change/smfishroom.jpg

Then came Al and the contest discus and I became one of the lucky ones chosen to raise contest discus. I had to figure
out where to put their tank. I wanted to keep them separate from the other fish like they were in quarantine.
Being proud of having contest discus and wanting anyone that come to visit to see them, I decided they should go in the front room.

Contest discus tank
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll50/wgtaylor/Water%20Change/tanklocation.jpg

Now, I have to do daily water changes and have learned five gallon buckets are heavy and I would have to carry them quite a distance.
I got a sump pump to put it in the bathtub, attached a fifty foot hose and a valve on the end. I run the pump while the tub is filling at the correct temperature and run the pump about another five to ten minutes after filling the tub to outgas the co2, getting rid of almost all the bubbles that collect.

This works for me but it may take longer to stabilize the water in other areas of the country with different water parameters.
This would be a good time to add prime or other dechlor products but since I have no chlorine or chloramines I can shut off the valve on the end of the hose and the water is ready to pump to the contest discus.

It only takes me fifteen to thirty minutes to clean and fill the contest tank but three hours to suction up and dry out a water spill so now I save time by paying attention. :p

I just have to make sure my timing is good to get everything cleared out of the tub before my wife's bubble bath time.
Actually she has given up trying to change my ways and I leave her with a spotless clean tub. We work well together. :D:D

Can hold up to seventy gallons of water
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll50/wgtaylor/Water%20Change/wtr-chg-pmp.jpg

Can adjust the temperature to a tenth of a degree
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll50/wgtaylor/Water%20Change/temp-adj.jpg

I use a siphon connected to a regular garden hose and drain the water outside. I never drain more water than what is shown in this picture.
Every other day I wipe all sides and bottom of the tank, airlines and all other surfaces before their water change so all that is washed out the siphon. While the tank is siphoning I can start their new water coming in on the opposite end of the tank and really flush out the tank by letting the water come in and go out the other end at the same time.
The valve on the end of the hose allows me to fill the tank at full flow or turn the valve nearly off and aerate and fill the tank slowly. The contest discus like the full flow now that I give them their noon feeding of pellets when I fill their tank. They really get happy as soon as the water starts.

By changing fifty to seventy five percent of their water and then refilling makes them poop, every time, so they are ready to eat again.

My minimum depth of water
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll50/wgtaylor/Water%20Change/waterchange.jpg

After the tank was set up for a while I was comfortable with the water parameters. Now I do weekly checks of ammonia, nitrite, nitrates and tds.
These should stay fairly consistent until the discus get bigger and are eating more and generating more waste. I can easily add another 15 minute water change when that happens.

Gotta check that water
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll50/wgtaylor/Water%20Change/watertest.jpg

My tap water in ppm
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll50/wgtaylor/Water%20Change/tap-ppm.jpg

My tap water in micro seimens
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll50/wgtaylor/Water%20Change/tap-ms.jpg

I got this thermometer at the food section at a grocery store. It has a calibration button to keep it's accuracy to one tenth of one degree f or c.
You fill a glass with crushed ice and water, press the cal button until it reads thirty two degrees f or zero degrees c. Too easy, even for me.

Calibratable thermometer
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll50/wgtaylor/Water%20Change/temp-cal.jpg

I have been blessed with clean soft water straight from the tap and this is working really well for me so far. I was ready with a conditioning tank like I had used in the past to age the water. This is a fifty five gallon barrel with a pond pump inside at the bottom and a aquarium heater. By opening and closing valves, that are standard hardware at any hardware store, I can fill the tank or cycle/agitate the water in the barrel or pump the water out to the fish tank. The barrel has a removable lid for easy cleaning.

Lots of good food, wiping out the tank and daily big water changes has always been the favorite method to growing out juvenile discus. :)

Aging water is always best
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll50/wgtaylor/Water%20Change/aging-brl.jpg

Fill - Airate - Pump
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll50/wgtaylor/Water%20Change/aging-brl-top.jpg

Hope these ideas can be used by someone to grow big happy discus and make water changes a little easier. :)

Bill

calihawker
06-15-2009, 12:09 AM
Awesome thread ya got started there Bill!:thumbsup: Great pictures, very informative. Exactly what this contest is all about!

Keep up the good work my friend!:)

wgtaylor
06-15-2009, 12:37 AM
Hey Steve, that's quite a compliment coming from you, the master of water changes. :)
Thanks a bunch !

Bill

dean9922
06-15-2009, 10:09 AM
VERY NICE SETUP YOU HAVE AND SOME GOOD IDEAS GIVEN....THANKS AND GOOD LUCK!!!!!!!!!!!

Mr Wild
06-15-2009, 10:20 AM
Hi Bill
Great read! Tell me how do you manage with TDS at 29ppm. Did you lose any discus that came into your tanks from other sources? Our tap water (rain water) is between 12-20ppm and any newly purchased discus just died within 12-15 hours of introduction to the water here. I have had to go the age/ airate/ add ro minerals for my tanks now. Would like to hear how your cope.

calihawker
06-15-2009, 10:35 AM
Hi Bill
Great read! Tell me how do you manage with TDS at 29ppm. Did you lose any discus that came into your tanks from other sources? Our tap water (rain water) is between 12-20ppm and any newly purchased discus just died within 12-15 hours of introduction to the water here. I have had to go the age/ airate/ add ro minerals for my tanks now. Would like to hear how your cope.

That's interesting Kath. Bill and I both spoke about our low tds levels, mine is down around 20 out of the tap, and we decided to go with what we had to raise these discus. As you can see there have been no adverse effects so far.

I'm wondering what kind of acclimation method you used. Both of us used the plop and drop method. Maybe someone has another idea why you had problems. :)

acroken
06-15-2009, 10:49 AM
Awesome post Bill:) your w/c method is outstanding! Thank so much for the information. Your contest discus look great too! Clean operation you are running there.

Kenny

Mr Wild
06-15-2009, 10:55 AM
That's interesting Kath. Bill and I both spoke about our low tds levels, mine is down around 20 out of the tap, and we decided to go with what we had to raise these discus. As you can see there have been no adverse effects so far.

I'm wondering what kind of acclimation method you used. Both of us used the plop and drop method. Maybe someone has another idea why you had problems. :)

Well I tried everything before TDS was even mentioned and once I changed that all was well. I can honestly say that new fish would only last 12-15hours MAX before they just died all the time breathing fast but no colour change no obvious signs of sickness and from all different shops. Once Chad (avionics30) took me through TDS and what it is etc (I had no clue) I changed what I was doing and since then I have had no probs. I used to wc just as described in this thread, straight out of the tap - regulate the temp - run it in and all was "supposed" to be fine. It was always ok when I had fancy goldfish but the discus just croaked. So as you can see I was shocked to see they were ok with 29ppm. Hope it goes well for you both - I will be reading!

Mr Wild
06-15-2009, 10:57 AM
Oh and it was the drop and plop then tried to slow acclimation on some following discus didn't matter they still died.

kpotter2
06-15-2009, 09:25 PM
Great looking Fish and post!

What EC pen are you using? I want to get one,but don't want to pay 100.00 for it. It look like a good one where did you get it.

Thanks

kyle

Chad Hughes
06-15-2009, 11:27 PM
Bill,

Cool setup!

Your tap water has a really low TDS! That's nearly RO. Have you had any problems with any of your discus that you keep? I don't even keep breeders in water that soft. LOL! I've found that in the lower TDS ranges, discus become listless and don't do well. As Kath mentioned, she was sadly experiencing death. Water chemistry can be a real bugger!

Best wishes!

wgtaylor
06-15-2009, 11:51 PM
Apologize for being gone all day, took the grandkids up the coast to do some crabbing at a little fishing town. Had a great day.
Bill


VERY NICE SETUP YOU HAVE AND SOME GOOD IDEAS GIVEN....THANKS AND GOOD LUCK!!!!!!!!!!!

Hi Dean, thanks for the compliments, hope anything here can help someone get a start.
Bill


Hi Bill
Great read! Tell me how do you manage with TDS at 29ppm. Did you lose any discus that came into your tanks from other sources? Our tap water (rain water) is between 12-20ppm and any newly purchased discus just died within 12-15 hours of introduction to the water here. I have had to go the age/ airate/ add ro minerals for my tanks now. Would like to hear how your cope.
Hi Kath, I have to get all my fish shipped to me, always pick them up FedEx at the airport, only lost one because of shipping prob. Received many, many discus with no problem at all.
Really soft water can cause the ph to drop without doing water changes. Mine drops slowly from 6.5 to about 5.0 in about ten days. Gh and Kh less than 1 and never had a quick drop (ph crash).
So, my water stays pretty stable, just low conductivity, similar to the Amazon where they came from. My discus love it.
I was thrilled to get chosen for this contest to see if my soft water affects the growth rate in comparison to others. So far I haven't seen any sign that is going to be a problem.
Bill



That's interesting Kath. Bill and I both spoke about our low tds levels, mine is down around 20 out of the tap, and we decided to go with what we had to raise these discus. As you can see there have been no adverse effects so far.

I'm wondering what kind of acclimation method you used. Both of us used the plop and drop method. Maybe someone has another idea why you had problems. :)

Thanks Steve for covering for me, it's all your fault you know that I took the day off. Automatic water changes, planted tanks, Las Vegas...etc. Sounded too good. ha ha
Good Times, take care,
Bill


Awesome post Bill:) your w/c method is outstanding! Thank so much for the information. Your contest discus look great too! Clean operation you are running there.
Kenny

Hi Kenny, thank you for the compliments, had to do something easy so I wouldn't miss a water change.
Bill


Well I tried everything before TDS was even mentioned and once I changed that all was well. I can honestly say that new fish would only last 12-15hours MAX before they just died all the time breathing fast but no colour change no obvious signs of sickness and from all different shops. Once Chad (avionics30) took me through TDS and what it is etc (I had no clue) I changed what I was doing and since then I have had no probs. I used to wc just as described in this thread, straight out of the tap - regulate the temp - run it in and all was "supposed" to be fine. It was always ok when I had fancy goldfish but the discus just croaked. So as you can see I was shocked to see they were ok with 29ppm. Hope it goes well for you both - I will be reading!


Hi Kath, I know Chad is good with discus and has certainly given you good advice, especially since it is working good for you. I wouldn't change a thing.
Got to be honest though, I have never heard of soft water at 20 ppm kill discus in less than 24 hrs. You have me curious, I would like to go back and read your posts.
Is it possible your soft water also had a very low ph ? A plop and drop into very low ph could cause a ph shock death quickly. They can handle an increase in ph better.
By raising your conductivity you may have also raised your ph. ???
You know, everyone's water is unique to where we live and we all have to learn what's best for our discus. Keep it stable and clean it usually works.
Bill




Great looking Fish and post!
What EC pen are you using? I want to get one,but don't want to pay 100.00 for it. It look like a good one where did you get it.
Thanks
kyle

Hi Kyle, they have them on-line for $50, good meter.
http://www.airwaterice.com/category/10/
Thanks,
Bill

Mr Wild
06-16-2009, 09:42 AM
Bill
I am very happy with the result of the water treatment I emply now, as it works, I wouldn't be game to try anything else as I have had instant success! Old threads are here somewhere. Search on TDS and my online name and also the other one was "what am I doing wrong". Will have to redo PH from tap - originally 6.2. Tank now 6.4 I have also added a few pieces of coral.

wgtaylor
06-16-2009, 09:58 AM
Bill,

Cool setup!

Your tap water has a really low TDS! That's nearly RO. Have you had any problems with any of your discus that you keep? I don't even keep breeders in water that soft. LOL! I've found that in the lower TDS ranges, discus become listless and don't do well. As Kath mentioned, she was sadly experiencing death. Water chemistry can be a real bugger!

Best wishes!

Hi Chad,

I am by no means a water expert and have only kept discus in this area with softer water for less than two years.
I've never heard that soft water is bad for discus, after all, their water is usually much softer where they come from.
I believe Malaysia has water out of the tap at ph 6.0 and 100 ms. I would love to mimic their success with discus.
I have also read that harder water can accelerate their growth and that is one reason I wanted to participate in this contest.

I purposely have kept everything I am doing as absolutely simple as I can to minimize most variables.
I will use my soft water as is from my source and un-supplemented food to see what effect my softer water will have with their growth.
It will give me a baseline to make adjustments, if needed, in the future. Of course if you are right then I will fail miserably in this contest. :(
I sure hope I don't kill these contest discus.

Bill

Scribbles
06-16-2009, 07:53 PM
Great wc setup. Thanks for sharing.

Chris

Ed13
06-16-2009, 08:35 PM
:thumbsup:VERY NICE! Interesting to say the least!:thumbsup:

Armandi_Fishcarer
06-20-2009, 08:43 PM
Bill, great thread, really enjoyed the read. This is what this hobby needs, informers. People need to see the difference in people doings! :D

Regards
Ahmed ;)