VERY NEWBIE!! Need help selecting discus!

[discus_newbie]

Hi, I'm very new to discus, I have read for hours about discus keeping technique and now I think I'm ready for my first school of discus. I'm just not fully sure about the bars of the discus, what do they mean? Or is it just the breeds? And also the darkened areas on the discus, what are they caused by and will they go away? Also if the bars are sign of sickness will they go away when the fish return to full healths?
Sorry for many questions, I just want to learn as much as I can before starting to keep such a beautiful and expensive fish. Thanks for all your help.

[Elite Aquaria]

Vertical bars are present on most domestic based discus when they are young. As the fish matures the bars disappear. Often times when a fish is sick or stressed they will show the vertical bars as adults. Some fish like Blue Diamonds or pigeon blood strains never show vertical bars. Red White and Red golden diamond lines do show bars but they are very faint almost like a ghosting effect. I hope this help a little. Anyway good luck and welcome to Simply.

[discus_newbie]

Thanks for the quick reply. So I shouldn't be too stressful about the bars? What about the darkened "peppered" like on the discus body? Does it represent sick fish? Will it go away?

[Jorge]

Peppering happens in Pigeon blood Discus. The peppering in these discus is the equivalent of bars in other discus. As Dan said, Pigeon blood discus "never show vertical bars", but they get peppering.
If pigeon blood discus get too much stress or if the tank where they are is dark (dark susbtrate, dark background, and son on) they will pepper.

[mmorris]

Have you been looking at the discus in your local fish shop? :D

[Yassmeena]

Most people look for "clean" pigeon discus, meaning ones from a quality source that have less peppering. But under certain conditions any pigeon will show peppering (gravel in the tank, planted tank, stress, illness can ll bring it on).

Bars usually come and go, even throughout the day depending on the fish's mood/stress level/etc.

Some people don't mind peppering at all! I personally don't like it and won't buy a piegon for that reason.

Bars are usually a non-issue with most discus keepers.

If bars and peppering bother you, look into getting albino discus. They wil never bar or peppering because they lack the dark pigment!

HTH and welcome to Simply!!!!

Yasmin

[discus_newbie]

I don't mind bars of peppered on discus as long as it is its natural appearance. I was just worried that the bars and the peppering might be a sign of disease and now I know that it is now :D. Around where I live there is no specialize breeder by my LFS is quite professional. The have a few massive discus display tank and all the discus in there are fully grown and appear to be in good health, so I came to the conclusion that I will purchase mines there. The have 100+ discus of quite a number of strain for me to choose from. I have a 70 gallon tall tank fully cycled and planning to keep about 6-8 juvenile discus (2-3"). I like the cobalts and blue diamonds :). You guys have been great helps, in the future if I have problem hopes that you guys can help me out. Thanks a lot

[mkv]

Just one word of advise, most LFS have bad reputation for being able to properly care for Discus. Two things to do before you give them your money:
Ask them what type of food they are being feed. then ask them to feed them while you watch. Healthy Discus have hearty appetites and should not hide when offered the food. The next thing is watch for signs of proper developement, eye size , body shape, is they are 2-3" they should not show full coloration. That means the fish are older and stunted. Here is the link to another article that cover this.
http://forum.simplydiscus.com/showthread.php?t=46982
Hope this helps.

[Scribbles]

Welcome to Simply and discus. You might want to take a look at some of the sponsors here. They all have good healthy stock.

Chris

[Jhhnn]

Unless you have a very, very good lfs (the exception to the rule), you'll want to buy from a sponsor or from a breeder local to you.

Some discus breeds have bars, some don't. Normal discus usually have nine bars, snakeskins have 14. Within a given strain, some fish will show their bars more than others. some of my blue scorps (all from the same hatch) show their bars almost all the time, others do so only rarely and partially. They're all healthy. When the fish are sick or stressed, they'll show whatever bars they have more than usual.

Do yourself and your fish a favor- develop a water changing strategy and the means to make it easy before you ever get the fish. A little extra investment now will pay big dividends in the long run...

While there is a great deal of conflicting opinion as to the frequency and magnitude of water changes, no serious keeper would claim they're not necessary, and nobody has advanced the notion that making it easy isn't a good idea, either. Juvies have enormous appetites and demand lots of food to obtain proper growth. That means low stocking densities and unusual filtering means, or lots of water changing, take your pick.

If you want to know what good juvies look like, study the offerings from Kenny's Discus and some of the other sponsors... print pics and take 'em with you to the store so you can compare the chunkiness, eye size, and everything else to what they're offering...

And good luck, too- we all need a little of that...

[discus_newbie]

Hi everyone, thank you for all the replies. I would love to buy discus from sponsors but unfortunately I don't live in the US, and around me there are no known discus breeders. And this LFS is the best place I could find. I'm just wondering if i can keep discus with angelfish? I know this has been a long debate but what are the disadvantages of keeping them together, do they fight/harrass? And also I have a 70G tank, I'm thinking about recruiting 7-8 juvenile discus, is this a good number? Thanks

PS: A member above said that having gravel in the tank could make pigeons have peppered. Does it effect significantly? Thanks again

[Moon]

If you are thinking of starting with juveniles I would not have gravel. Young discus eat a lot and create a lot of waste. It is difficult to keep a tank with gravel clean. Start with a BB tank and add gravel later when you discus are grown.
I've never kept angels with discus and not able to comment.

[Armandi_Fishcarer]

Firstly welcome aboard Simply!


And this LFS is the best place I could find. I'm just wondering if i can keep discus with angelfish? I know this has been a long debate but what are the disadvantages of keeping them together, do they fight/harrass? And also I have a 70G tank, I'm thinking about recruiting 7-8 juvenile discus, is this a good number? 1. Here in Australia we have some great lfs, that specifically target Discus & have got quality although will myself ditter away from most. I here lots of stories about other countries lfs.

2. Yes you can keep angels & discus together & yes it has/still is debatable. Most debats stem around disease, about habouring the same. I myself have never had such issues when keeping them together & never have any with my fish. Angels come in handy with discus for reasons such as shy discus will come out, non/low eating discus will trigger too eat, as the angels are real aggressive eaters. No, discus don't get harrassed by them, they may keep the angels at bay when older to show who's tank controller. Angels should be smaller(half size of discus) when purchased too give the discus more chance to grow better. Lots more discus too angels in the tank!

3. 7-8 is a good number for that size tank with good filtration. I would get them at 3-3.5inch though!

Regards
Ahmed ;)

[discus_newbie]

Ok. Last night I just went to the LFS and got 4 discus at 3", I know this isn't a good number but this is my first time so i just want to get 4 to see how things go, if all go well I'll get another 4 from the same store next week. I have 2 turquoise, 1 blue diamond and a 3.5" inch pigeon (I don't know which strain of pigeon but its a pigeon:D). Last night they haven't been swimming much but now they started to roam around a bit more. I had 5 bigger angels in the same when i put them in, but the angels started to nibble a bit on them so I moved all 5 to another tank. This afternoon, I place a bit of brineshrimp in the feeding cone but they haven't seem to be eating, do they need more time to adapt?

[Eddie]

Yes, they can take a while to get comfortable. I would not have mixed the new fish with your angels, this can cause problems if your angels were carriers of something that they have an immunity to, and your new discus don't. Plus, your discus are probably well stressed which makes them vulnerable. Going with 4 to see how it goes is not a good idea, 5 or 6 is better, you'll see.


Best of luck,

Eddie

[discus_newbie]

Thanks Eddie, I'll get more asap, I was just scared that something might go wrong and $200+ would go to waste. How long do you reckon before they start going crazy for food? DO you guys just drop frozen bloodworm/brineshrimp into the tank or use the cones?

[Eddie]

Thanks Eddie, I'll get more asap, I was just scared that something might go wrong and $200+ would go to waste. How long do you reckon before they start going crazy for food? DO you guys just drop frozen bloodworm/brineshrimp into the tank or use the cones?

I just drop it in, let the fish forage around and eat when they are comfy. Don't let it set around too long though. Sometimes it takes weeks for them eat depending on the past and present conditions. I'd leave the lights off and give them some chill time. ;)

Eddie

[discus_newbie]

oh, thanks Eddie

[jaykne]

As Eddie said mixing the angels was probably not a good idea, keep the lights off for about 5 days, make sure you are doing lots of water chages, not sure what you have the temp is at but I would have it at 88F that will get them up and moving, and eating allot faster, then later when they are eating like pigs you can bring it down, for me I keep the temp at 88F untill I get them up to about 5inches then take it down to between 84 to 86F. Brinshrimp and frozen blood worm are good but as soon as you get them eat you need to get allot of other good high protien food in there diet. If you notice them just hiding all the time, not eating and fins clamped good sighn there is somthing wrong, water conditions you check first and then move on from there. The best thing you can do is get some pictures of them and post them on here, most people that have had discus for a while can tell from a pic if they look sick and tell you if they are good discus, biggest thing to remember is young discus need lots of feedings and lot of large water changes. I feed at least 8 times a day and change out 80% of there water every day. Larry

[discus_newbie]

Hey jay. my current temp is 84-86F. Its been 24hrs since they were introduced into the tank now, they seems to be swimming around together but still very shy, when i approach they all hide, I guess its not so bad. I've learn more on this forum everyday thanks to you guys :D

[Armandi_Fishcarer]

Congrats on the purchase :D I wouldn't put new fish into a tank with other fish straight away & would have placed them into a BB tank with maybe a fake plant & added some melafix into the water as this seems to help, when introducing or moving around your fish at home.

Lights should be low for a day or so, & feeding to a minimum. Fish will still forage around for food when lights out, especially when at a young age. If you are keeping all room/tank lights off, try & keep a desk lamp "On" near by the tank. When turning on lights, have the room lights on 1st for a little while, then turn tank light On, this will assist in acclimatization.

Angel fish as I've said before should be much smaller too start with. When all are adults you will find things will be different. Bigger fish will harrass small fish, sometimes the other way around depending on superiorty & Age of fish!

Regards
Ahmed ;)

[jaykne]

Hey jay. my current temp is 84-86F. Its been 24hrs since they were introduced into the tank now, they seems to be swimming around together but still very shy, when i approach they all hide, I guess its not so bad. I've learn more on this forum everyday thanks to you guys :D

Just keep the tank lights off, like I said take the temp up to 88 even 90 get them eating fast, very normal for them to hide soon you will have them eating blood worms from your hand.

[H82LOS3]

[QUOTE=discus_newbie;554924]Hi, I'm very new to discus, I have read for hours about discus keeping technique and now I think I'm ready for my first school of discus. I'm just not fully sure about the bars of the discus, what do they mean? Or is it just the breeds? And also the darkened areas on the discus, what are they caused by and will they go away? Also if the bars are sign of sickness will they go away when the fish return to full healths?
Sorry for many questions, I just want to learn as much as I can before starting to keep such a beautiful and expensive fish. Thanks for all your help.[/QUOT

Thanks for this thread, i learned alot