Confrontational, Disrespectful, and Condescending Responses

[David Rose]

Given the confrontational nature of some of the members on this site and disrespectful condescending way that some choose to respond to other members, it has certainly been ruining my enjoyment I get in reading folks threads and learning on this forum.

I had truly appreciated my interaction with some of you since I joined in July, buying from some of the sponsors recently, and even found myself wanting to donate to support this site even more. But as of late, it seems that the confrontational folks are on the rise and I truly find it very distasteful.

I wish folks would read their replies more carefully before posting and really consider if they intend to upset folks or flaunt their "seemingly" knowlegeable opinions that are unsupported.

I thought we as fellow members were here to help each other, but it is clear that some of you JUST DON'T GET THAT! Having a difference of opinion does't mean you need to be confrontational, disrespectful and or condescending. Please clean up your act!!

[Disgirl]

Well written David and I agree with you. I imagine lots of others will too. SD is indeed a great forum and hope it will continue to be. I have learned a lot here and hope I have also helped some others along the way. Let us all be polite and kind to each other in our posts so this will stay a great place to come and learn and communicate.
Barb :)

[brewmaster15]

David,
I understand your frustration and share it as well...I spend far too much time as it is trying to police some individual's bad attitudes and quite frankly am sick of it... You may have noticed that I have been taking a much harder note with these individuals and thats something that I've instructed all Moderators to do.

I've sent out numerous warnings as well and posted many such as this one....

http://www.forum.simplydiscus.com/showthread.php?t=68498

We've instituted temporary Bans for those that have been repeat offenders in the hopes that a little time to cool off and reflect may change their attitudes.... and for those that just don't get. it or don't care about our rules and behavior here.....They are gone..permanently. I've not the time or patience to deal with it...and it sours the forum for the majority that post in a civil and respectful tone , even when they disagree.

This forum is extremely important to many people and I will not tolerate individuals that trash it or its members...If that sounds harsh to anyone or infridges on peoples perceived freedom of speech......I'm sorry but Members are given this forum free to use...It is not Free to abuse!

I hope that addresses your concerns David,

Sincerely,
Al

[mench]

well said Al...I think the reason Simply has been around so long,besides Al and the mods doing a great job,is that for the most part the Simply folks respect each other...some of us "old timers" remember all the other discus forums that aren't around any more...most of the reasons being that the forums owners let the folks say anything they wanted,weather it was true or not...and boy were there ever some knock down drag em out fights going on...some were funny but a lot of them were hateful and most of us got real tired of the whole thing.
so for me ,I am glad that Simply has the rules it has and enforces them...It is a lot more fun talking about our silly flat fish than all that other junk...
Great job guys and hears hoping Simply is around for a long time

mench

[brewmaster15]

Thank Ron!:)

-al

[roclement]

Mench's statements are very true! The fact that this is not a Club or a paied site allows the owners of the site to police it properly and that is a big reason why this forum has been around for so long and in so many parts of the world.

A great job by all those responsible!

Rodrigo

[David Rose]

I've posted before what a wonderful site this is and the great job the moderators do. I guess I think of it being like SPAM messages getting through even the best SPAM filters. No matter how many hours the moderators spend on filtering through messages this stuff is going to get through. It's not their fault and we all read and interrupt things differently.

But honestly, you have to admit there are and have been some straight out bickering and clashes of wills in threads. So please don't interpret my message as a slight against Al or all the wonderful moderators that contribute their time to making this site great.

[Elite Aquaria]

David,

You make a great point. I agree with you 100%. Confrontational, disrespectful and or condescending post have no place here. Thanks for raising the issue.

[Apistomaster]

How should the experienced knowledgeable Discus keeper/breeders members who have much to teach to those who want to learn, to distinguish between those who are truly grateful someone bothered to share their hard won experience and knowledge with them and helped them become experienced and knowledgeable discus keepers/breeders in their own right, from those who's feelings are so easily hurt because some how the experienced person was straight with them in an impersonal way?

Do we set up a wading pool for those who are not ready to mingle with the advanced hobbyists?
And a deep end where beginners should not tread without a chain mail shark suit and Kevlar water wings?

Most fish keeping beginners have not had much access to those with greater experience until they register on a site with more knowledgeable members.They generally have had access to old books, seen beautiful photos but their first sources of information were often highly inaccurate.

I received my first ever PM today from a beginner who thought I was picking on them. I did not have clue who they were. I was not even given any clue to what the subject was that some how my response was considered confrontational.

I have received over 100 PM's over the years from those who where grateful for my assistance, advise and benefited from my experience.

I know of one member who is as respected by some as I am by others and even though we have both been warned before to take our disagreements off the air, so to speak, still has tried to bait me into another run. I politely said in public that I would not play that game and even with another bit of egging on I just ignored it. That seems to be a reasonable thing to do.

Beginners are respected as beginners, by their more experienced fellow members.
But disrespect, confrontation and condescension are a matter of perception.
What one member finds to be hurtful, another is pleased to get some straight answers.

This seems like an expressed wish for excessive political correctness more than a valid case of abuse but that is just my perception. Perceptions are often mistaken interpretations of intent. Hard to predict how we are perceived by others.
As the poet Robert Burns famously wrote:
"Oh wad some power the giftie gie us To see oursel's as others see us"

[brewmaster15]

How should the experienced knowledgeable Discus keeper/breeders members who have much to teach to those who want to learn, to distinguish between those who are truly grateful someone bothered to share their hard won experience and knowledge with them and helped them become experienced and knowledgeable discus keepers/breeders in their own right, from those who's feelings are so easily hurt because some how the experienced person was straight with them in an impersonal way?

Do we set up a wading pool for those who are not ready to mingle with the advanced hobbyists?
And a deep end where beginners should not tread without a chain mail shark suit and Kevlar water wings?

Most fish keeping beginners have not had much access to those with greater experience until they register on a site with more knowledgeable members.They generally have had access to old books, seen beautiful photos but their first sources of information were often highly inaccurate.

I received my first ever PM today from a beginner who thought I was picking on them. I did not have clue who they were. I was not even given any clue to what the subject was that some how my response was considered confrontational.

I have received over 100 PM's over the years from those who where grateful for my assistance, advise and benefited from my experience.

I know of one member who is as respected by some as I am by others and even though we have both been warned before to take our disagreements off the air, so to speak, still has tried to bait me into another run. I politely said in public that I would not play that game and even with another bit of egging on I just ignored it. That seems to be a reasonable thing to do.

Beginners are respected as beginners, by their more experienced fellow members.
But disrespect, confrontation and condescension are a matter of perception.
What one member finds to be hurtful, another is pleased to get some straight answers.

This seems like an expressed wish for excessive political correctness more than a valid case of abuse but that is just my perception. Perceptions are often mistaken interpretations of intent. Hard to predict how we are perceived by others.
As the poet Robert Burns famously wrote:
"Oh wad some power the giftie gie us To see oursel's as others see us"

Larry,
I'm not going to get into your past issues except to say...you were not exempt from fault there...its old history and there was no reason to bring it up again...though it does illustrate why this thread was started..people disagree and make it personal and it spirals out of control across threads and time..I wonder the reply of the person that it refers to when they read it....Its just got to stop somewhere.


I can make this simple for all the Hobbyists here..so theres no question.

When it comes to civility and forum rules .... I don't really care one bit if someone has been keeping Discus for a day, a year , or since the 1950s and 60's. I expect members of this forum to treat each in a civil and courteous fashion even when they disagree. It is not political Correctness...Its called manners and its something that people often forget when they are sitting anonymously behind a computer screen or separated by hundreds to thousands of miles.

There are many forums out there...This forum has its rules as do all others...We don't charge a membership here, and we only moderate when necessary...but I do ask that members behave in a civil fashion and treat each other with respect as human beings regardless of how experienced they percieve themselves to be.. Experienced members can state what they feel they need to without being condescending and will probably be even more respected for it. Novices should also reply in kind.

Additionally I ask that if this is too much to ask , that the member in question with the attitude issue kindly stop visiting this board as sooner or latter ...They will not have that choice when they cross that line.

Again my apologies to most here...and this really is only an issue for less than 1 % of the forum that somehow think they need not adhere to forum policies.


I hope this is clear to all, if not please contact me by PM and we can try to clarify it more...or regretfully, we can agree that this forum is not for everyone and part ways.

Thank you,
AL SABETTA