how to tell a stunted and non good discus

[henward]

OK,
im relatively new to discus but a veteran with monster fish like arowanas and etc.

i have had much experience with water chems and params but...selective discus is another.

the sticky on WHAT NOT TO BUY and SELECTIVE DISCUS
does not have any pictures.

can someone please help me with givingt examples of y oung smaller discus 3 to 6 cms in size and how to tell stunted or reject fish. perhaps the triangular shape ihear about?

also the side effects of getting these fish, what to expect.

i know one to look for is the large eyes small body.
but what else?
need the low down :D

Here are my discus, all of them. i will give approx size beside it, tell me whcih is stunted and wont grow big.

Albino Turquoise 5 to 6 cm
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q163/henwardphotos/Discus/IMG_4163.jpg

6 to 7 cms
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q163/henwardphotos/Discus/IMG_4165.jpg

6 to 7 cms
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q163/henwardphotos/Discus/IMG_4167.jpg

8 to 9 cms
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q163/henwardphotos/Discus/IMG_4171.jpg

4 to 5 cms
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q163/henwardphotos/Discus/IMG_4164.jpg

here are the ones that are large already.
all are 10 to 12 cms

http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q163/henwardphotos/Discus/IMG_4162.jpg
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q163/henwardphotos/Discus/IMG_4161.jpg
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q163/henwardphotos/Discus/IMG_4181.jpg
http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q163/henwardphotos/Discus/IMG_4180.jpg

i have one small blue diamond, its about 3 cms in size. i got it when it was 2 cms, and literally it eats like a pig, no one bothers it. it has grown a cm in 2.5 weeks! i dont think that one is stunted lol its growing fast.

all feedback welcome please:d

[henward]

second and 3rd photo is same fish my bad.
picture 5, front is a re turquoise, behind it is the other one.

all are eating well.

[ifixoldhouses]

2nd and 3rd look stunted to me, look for a football shape and large eyes, maybe more markings and colors on them.

[DiscusKev]

http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q163/henwardphotos/Discus/IMG_4165.jpg

Definately this one, the shape is off badly and even through force feeding, the shape won't look good.

http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q163/henwardphotos/Discus/IMG_4181.jpg

This albino discus has an oval body shape with big eyes, However it look nice to a certain extent.

http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q163/henwardphotos/Discus/IMG_4180.jpg

This one is quite obvious as its eyes stands out a lot, and the shape look awkward due to its steep forehead and its elongated body shape.

Just my opinions, hope you don't no offence.

[Eddie]

Don't shoot.....all of them are stunted IMO. Eye size to body size/shape. :o

Just trying to help. Take care!

Eddie

[henward]

yeah, its hard to find non stunted specimens here!
darn!

the two white ones are actually quite big! black eye white one does look weird but is definatley huge lol

yeah, i thought that was a stunted one. very odd looking.

can you tell from a small size if they are stunted?
how do you choose?

[henward]

or is it better to buy them big? so you know what your getting?
or medium?

what size is a "good size"
to know if they are stunted or not?

[henward]

http://www.trademe.co.nz/Home-living/Pets-animals/Fish/Fish/auction-289281540.htm

is this stunted?

[MGKelly]

Pictures 2, 3, 4 in the back ground looked stunted.
Pictures 6 and 7 look a bit stunted.

Just my opinion.

[April]

one thing to go by..is if full colour..they could be way older than you think.
the best way to learn is by looking at alot of pictures on photogallery and sellers pics in sponsor section.
go to university also..and read the posts..theres a sticky there on measuring eye to body ratio. great tool with pictures.
where are you buying them? alot of the ones in lfs are already behind in growth or their window or opportunity is gone.
where do you live? i bet theres someone near you if your in usa that either breeds or sells from home. maybe someone knows someone in your area.
its a learning process what you see . takes awhile till your eyes recognize. try not to concentrate on the colour or pattern...and look past it to the shape.

[henward]

yeah
problem is that in nz, its limited. we have importers/breeders.
but you can never really trust some of how old the discus is.
some will say a few months, but could be longer!

i will looka t the body to eye ratio, that is key i think.
so most of my fish are stunted lol
but its ok, the 2 white ones are large.

i may in the future just get large discus
too risky buying small ones.
proble is that a breeder here, will have hunderds from a batch, and cos New zealand only has 4 million people, there is a tiny market.
problem with this is that they cant sell the fish fast enough.
so some gets stunted.
i purchased those smaller ones in the picture from a 'reputable' breeder.
he said they were not stunted.
but they were.

the colour i will keep in mind, makes sense, if colour is full when small, it probably means its been like that for awhile.

[henward]

wow
the eye size esplained sticky is good reading!

but i cant post there, can someone help me be able to post there?

or is that a special room?

so, here is the question.
on the modern breeds of discus, if your eye count is 4 to 5 - does that mean your fish is stunted?
if your eye count is 7 to 8, does that mean its not?
or is it just MOSTLIKELY it will be or it wont be.

[mmorris]

http://www.trademe.co.nz/Home-living/Pets-animals/Fish/Fish/auction-289281540.htm

is this stunted?

I think so. The dorsal fin, as well, looks like the fish has suffered some issues.

[April]

yes mmorris is right the fins are straggly on the ends. so parasite or nutrition issuese. dont buy the ones in the pics..thats for sure. too bad your in nz and not oz..theres a great sponsor on here rod who has excellent fish.
another way to tell is the length of their long skinny fins that hang down..long...they are older than you think. youngsters have short ones. still growing.
if you can find a youngster with the right amount of eye spaces..even if only 5 or 6..better. then its all up to you to keep it that way. lots of wcs..clean water, good food. id go easy on the substrate and having other fish in the same tank to stress them out . better if you could find a breeder or importer who recently got stock in and just finished their quarantine and you can see them feed them . they all rush up to the front for food and devour it. if you could get a group of 6..and grow them out togeather you might get a nice group.
if your getting older fish at least 3.5 to 4 inch..then they already have a good start and their eye to body ratio is already good.
you cant post on that thread as its locked and stickied. just an information thread.

[henward]

my problem i guess are the breeders here.
i just got recommended one, he has some good strains and reputation.

but you see i encountered some that lie about the age!
i feel angry!

once its in my house, my tank, no problems, i have an automatic water changer system and can programme it to do how much turn over of water i want per day, per week - its the breeders side i have to worry about

ill keep in mind to get larger fish.
but if its a reputable breeder, i can have a look at the fish first.

the breeder that has a good rep, he is selling babies at 5cms.
just recently become available.

can i use the eye test on that size?