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Second Hand Pat
09-16-2010, 01:43 PM
Hey guys,

This is my first post and I am enjoying reading this forum. Been lurking for a couple of weeks. Lots of good info and great and some sad stories.

I am currently looking for a larger tank (75/90 gallons) for a discus tank and yes, I'm a discus newbie. Quite a few of the larger used tanks are drilled for a sump. Do you guys recommend a sump on a discus tank. If you do what do you use it for? Extra bio-media, filtration etc. Also if you recommend a sump would you consider a tank with a existing overflow chamber?

Thanks,
Pat

Skip
09-16-2010, 02:00 PM
idk anything about sump filters..

but WELCOME PAT!

ZX10R
09-16-2010, 02:12 PM
You will get a million different answers on if sumps are good or not. Depends on what a person uses and they are most familar with. I personally have a 92 gallon corner tank running on two canister filters. And to be honest I think they are a pain in the butt to take out and clean every couple of months. I am building a stand right now for a 120 gallon tank I just bought and I am building my own sump out of a old aquarium. My brother has a sump on his 200 gallon tank and it seems so much easier then the canister filters. I see a lot of people just use hydro sponges also which I have never used so not sure how well they work. I have heard if you can get a tank with holes in it for bulk heads to run a sump that is the way to go. My tank is glass and new so I am doing a overflow box which won't do as good but don't really have a choice.

Good Luck and welcome Pat

Sean

2wheelsx2
09-16-2010, 02:28 PM
You can use a sump for anything you want (bio, mechanical, chemical), but the main thing is the increased water volume. It will also allow you to move everything outside of the tank like heaters, probes, etc. You can even do water changes out of the sump without disturbing the fish. As long as you are comfortable putting it together and don't mind the noise (they're never going to be as quiet as a good canister), then sump is the way to go.

Second Hand Pat
09-16-2010, 03:31 PM
Thanks warlock.

thanks Sean, totally agree that canisters are a pain. I had one on a 180 fresh once upon a time. I would be interested in you DIY plan for your sump. I do have a sump on my reef tank. I have a 75 gallon reef with a 15 gallon sump. It is a 3 chamber sump used as a fuge. Input chamber has the protein skimmer, middle chamber is the refugium‎ with a light and macro algae and third is the return pump. Nice simple design.

thanks 2wheelsx2, I do like the increased water volume and the noise is no problem. Not sure how to do water changes out of a sump unless you pump your new water to the sump and use the sump pump to return the water to the tank.

2wheelsx2
09-16-2010, 03:47 PM
thanks 2wheelsx2, I do like the increased water volume and the noise is no problem. Not sure how to do water changes out of a sump unless you pump your new water to the sump and use the sump pump to return the water to the tank.

There are several ways to do it. I have a Jehmco Super Safety siphon so I would use that myself, to pump out of the sump and then refill into the sump with a hose. But several guys I know with freshwater sumps just T off the return and let the sump pump do the water and then as you said, refill the sump and let the sump pump refill the tank.

ZX10R
09-16-2010, 04:16 PM
Thanks warlock.

thanks Sean, totally agree that canisters are a pain. I had one on a 180 fresh once upon a time. I would be interested in you DIY plan for your sump. I do have a sump on my reef tank. I have a 75 gallon reef with a 15 gallon sump. It is a 3 chamber sump used as a fuge. Input chamber has the protein skimmer, middle chamber is the refugium‎ with a light and macro algae and third is the return pump. Nice simple design.

thanks 2wheelsx2, I do like the increased water volume and the noise is no problem. Not sure how to do water changes out of a sump unless you pump your new water to the sump and use the sump pump to return the water to the tank.

Pretty much what I am doing a three chamber sump. I age my water in a 55 gallon barrel so my plans are to put a T in my drain from my overflow box with ball valves. I will close the valve to my sump turn that pump off then open the drain to outside then put the hose from my aged water in and flush the tank.

First Section: 100 micron filter bags (2)
Second Section: Bio Media (AKA pot scubbies)
Third Section: Return pump 1000 gph

Second Hand Pat
09-16-2010, 05:27 PM
Pot scubbies for bio-media, really??? which ones?

saltydog
09-16-2010, 05:38 PM
I have a sump on my 180 being it was previously my reef tank and it works great, I had to do some adjustments with the PVC pipes so they were more submerged though. it is also planted with CO2 injection. although there is some gas off of it still works good I just have to replace my canister a couple of times a year.

By the way I use pot scrubbers too :) They have a great surface area for biologics. Cheap too. I think I paid like $1.00 for 2 packs of 8 or 12 I think. it has been a while back though.

Here is a link to pot scrubbers here on simply
http://forum.simplydiscus.com/showthread.php?t=62944

Second Hand Pat
09-16-2010, 09:43 PM
Here is a link to pot scrubbers here on simply
http://forum.simplydiscus.com/showthread.php?t=62944

Thanks saltydog, I needed that link. I'm thinking the metal copper pot scrubbers and I know that can not be right. I would not mind a 180 again. I still have the stand and hood for it. Left the tank in the wall of the old house. What an awesome discus tank that would make. :grin:

Thanks again for all the ideas. Now to find a tank. Back to craigslist.

ZX10R
09-16-2010, 11:08 PM
Pot scubbies for bio-media, really??? which ones?

Yep they wrok great. I buy the ones from Dollar Store you can get a pack of 6 or 8 for around a dollar.

DerekFF
09-17-2010, 04:01 AM
I use both, a canister on my 75 and a home made 20g sump on my 110. The sump is the easiest to customize, modify and clean for maintenance and it also increases the amount of overall water that you can have. My tank also has an overflow built in though. After experiencing both styles of filters, im gonna have to go with the sump for its ease of maintenance, setup and cost and just overall great job at doing what it does.

jannie
09-20-2010, 06:44 AM
To make your sump as quiet as possable check link below
http://www.dursostandpipes.com/
Can hardly hear mine now since i done the mod



You can use a sump for anything you want (bio, mechanical, chemical), but the main thing is the increased water volume. It will also allow you to move everything outside of the tank like heaters, probes, etc. You can even do water changes out of the sump without disturbing the fish. As long as you are comfortable putting it together and don't mind the noise (they're never going to be as quiet as a good canister), then sump is the way to go.

2wheelsx2
09-20-2010, 06:16 PM
You can use a Durso mod or a stockman mod, but neither is going to be completely silent like a good canister. That was my criteria for a tank in my bedroom.

csarkar001
09-20-2010, 06:54 PM
You can use a Durso mod or a stockman mod, but neither is going to be completely silent like a good canister. That was my criteria for a tank in my bedroom.

you can get a professionally made stockman for $20. its sold under the name: maggie muffler (http://www.aquacave.com/maggie-muffler-quiet-broverflow-box-standpipe-brcap-fits-any-1-standpipe-2901.html).

csarkar001
09-20-2010, 06:56 PM
if you do end up buying a drilled tank, consider using the holes/bulkheads for an automated water change system instead of a sump.

just my opinion, but the key thing with discus is ease of water changes. filtration becomes secondary.

if the tank is already drilled, you're half way home on the automated water changes!

07rx8gt
09-25-2010, 12:25 PM
If you run a sump you can in fact have a completely silent overflow, look up the "Herbie Method" and you will find a ton of threads out there. I have a 300 gallon Reef tank and it is flowing 5800 GPH, at night I only hear the skimmer running. Hope it helps


On a side not I am looking at setting up another 300 as a planted discus tank, I think it would be awesome sitting next to my reef tank.

ChrisNif
09-25-2010, 03:11 PM
I have two reefs, a 20 gallon which I run a 20 gallon sump (don't forget they don't fill to the top, so you dont get as much extra water as you'd guess) whats nice is it looks like a 20 to most ppl, but the sump is set up as a frag tank to grow out new corals, so I get extra space.

My second tank is a 180, I have an interesting sump arrangement for it, two 55 gallon tanks plumbed together with a 3" pipe so the flow is from right to left in the rear tank, and left to right in the front tank. I also have an automatic top off (which is another bonus of a sump btw, makes life so easy, it dribbles in water as needed, normally about a pint at a time a few times a day, so no shock to the fish) which is in a custom made tank.

One recommendation I will make to anyone setting up a sump, plumb your water return pump into a manifold and put extra valves in case you need to add extra equipment (i.e. CO2 reactor), and add one with lots of hose and a valve at the manifold and one on the end, so you can use your return pump to expel water into the yard or into the sink etc. I also use that line on mine to blow off the gunk on the rocks and re-suspend fish waste so the filter has another chance to catch it :)

Apistomaster
09-25-2010, 08:50 PM
I like using wet/dry filters on large Discus tanks because wet/dry are the best of keeping the dissolved oxygen level very close to the saturation point for a given temperature, adds volume to the system and surface area.
I run mine with enough pump capacity to equal at least 10 tank volumes per hour.
I also run a canister filter because they are better water polishers and support a large wet area of biological filtration which compliments the wet/dry but It is possible to keep Discus just as well with only a wet/dry w/sump, canister filter(s) only or both.

Doc_Polit
02-28-2011, 11:53 PM
Overflows and standpipes have advanced since the Durso.

Google the "Herbie" or "Beananimal" overflow. No more noise!

Apistomaster
03-01-2011, 02:32 AM
If a tank comes with a built in over flow or is pre-drilled and equipped with bulk heads I would use them. In my own display tanks which are not so equipped I use after market add on over flow siphons but i never quite use them exactly the way they are designed. I use a 1200 gph CPR over flow on the 125 gal tank but I do not use the drain screen. CPR over flows are equipped with a nipple on the high point of the "C" siphon. On my 75 gal tank I use a Marineland Tide pool over flow siphon and these do not come with the nipple at the top of the "C" siphon so I add one. I use an aquaLifter vacuum pump attached by a length of flexinle air line tubing to the vacuum intake port of the aqualifter suction pump and run the return water line back to the intake side of the over flow siphon. If you don't maintain a continuous vacuum on over flow siphons they tend to collect enough air to slow down or even break the siphon flow. This results in a flood. There is no way I would ever use an over flow siphon without also using a vacuum pump like the aqua lifter.
When I change water I leave the aqua lifter suction pump running, I siphon as much detritus from the bottom of the sumps as possible and drain the sumps completely. The return water pump and heaters in the sump must be unplugged. I drain the tank.
Then I refill the tank and continue until the sump is at it's operating level or actually, I have made a mark with a permanent marker to record the sump's water level when the return pump isn't operating. As soon as the water level reaches the over flow siphon the siphon begins immediately working. Once enough water has filled the sump to the maximum water line mark when the water pump is off I just plug the return pump in and the system is back up an running. Don't forget to plug the heater back on.

TURQ64
03-01-2011, 09:01 AM
I run the majority of my tanks on a central wet/ dry sump..I presently use overflow boxes that don't have a prefilter or skimmer box...I've used this setup off and on since 1989, but am slowly changing over to bottom-drilled and doing away with the overflows...At present, when I want to do a WC, I just turn a valve in my drain line, and the water goes bye-bye instead of into the sump. Close the valve, and add water.

Second Hand Pat
03-01-2011, 09:29 AM
I started this thread a while back and currently both discus tanks I have are running on a sump and both tanks are predrilled. I love the versatility of a sump.

TURQ64
03-01-2011, 09:52 AM
me too...among other things, mine's a 'sponge farm'..keep extras running in there...

Second Hand Pat
03-01-2011, 10:04 AM
I am making part of my sump into a freshwater fuge using Java moss and sump lamp. Who says you need the plants in the tank.

TURQ64
03-01-2011, 11:22 AM
I've alays had a few, (small swords right now) but once some duckweed escaped from a tank, and.....

ericatdallas
03-01-2011, 02:04 PM
Hey guys,

This is my first post and I am enjoying reading this forum. Been lurking for a couple of weeks. Lots of good info and great and some sad stories.

I am currently looking for a larger tank (75/90 gallons) for a discus tank and yes, I'm a discus newbie. Quite a few of the larger used tanks are drilled for a sump. Do you guys recommend a sump on a discus tank. If you do what do you use it for? Extra bio-media, filtration etc. Also if you recommend a sump would you consider a tank with a existing overflow chamber?

Thanks,
Pat

Pat, that's a lot of posts you've racked up since Sep 2010!!! That's like 5-6 months ago or 200+ posts a month! Where are you posting all these messages? I was happy when I hit the 200 mark LOL.

Second Hand Pat
03-01-2011, 02:39 PM
Eric, easy to rack up a lot of one liners. I'm just chatting with the ladies, mainly Vera and Jennie...but Vera is the one liner queen. Not sure I can tell you where...LOL...everywhere.