Using Rain Water??

[Scott293]

I am interested in using rain water. In a world going green these days, I have noticed quite a few people with drums under their downspouts collecting rain water from their roof for watering their grass. I have a Spanish tile roof which is like the clay pot material we use for our discus to lay eggs on. I don't see where my roofing material could cause a problem. If I use a solid black drum, the light wouldn't be growing algae in the drum. Then if I run a water line from the bottom of my drum to the basement with a filter and manual valve, it would be all gravity fed. I would also need an overflow for the drum outside going into my storm drain. It doesn't sound so hard to get set up and I could store multiple 55 gallon drums in the basement for winter. Food grade 55 gallon plastic drums are selling for as low as $8 each. Once it is set up, I would think the system would be virtually trouble free.

I'm just kicking ideas and thoughts out there. I don't have the testing equipment nor do I have enough knowledge about the water chemistry to know what I would be getting with rain water. I live in the city of Cincinnati Ohio. I would guess that the pollution in the air comes down with the rain. Maybe I should just take the bull by the horns and just do some testing for us all and see what I can find. I searched the forum and didn't find where anyone else had tried to do this. If you have please let me know what you found.

[Northstr31]

be careful if you or your neighbors have an exterminator that sprays outdoors, it will settle on your roof and get into your rain water...

[William Palumbo]

LOL...the warnings have been put out there people...if you want to try it, then do so. It may work, or we'll just see your next threads/posts in the "Disease?Sickness" forum. I live in Chicago, and I would NEVER use rainwater. Period. If I did, I would need about 100+ gallons a day...that's not going to happen. The volume is just not there. If you get no rain in your area, you don't make water changes? How does that work? Or you only change water when it rains?...Bill

[Scott293]

That's a good point you bring up there Northstr. I would guess the only way to insure that wouldn't happen would be to only collect the rain water after it has rained long enough to wash the roof off first.

[Scott293]

Bill, The rain water would only be an intermediate means for water. If you have none then use the ro water. I am 50 years old. I have relatives that I remember when I was a kid that used cistern water which was filled with the water from their roof. I remember that as a kid, being the best coldest water I have drank. Now the lakes and ponds are filled with rain water, and even the lakes we have around Cincinnati are thriving with healthy fish. Granted much of that water is probably rain runoff which is essentially filtered, but that is the only thing that fills our fresh water lakes rivers and ponds. It can't be all that bad, Scott

[Joker43]

Scott

I live a mile from the Steel Mill where I work and wouldn't think about collecting rain water for fish. You will need to look way outside your neighborhood for pollutants.
Yes I'm sure after a long rain it might be better but what will keep the drum clean and protected until then? Save $5 on water and risk hundreds in fish?
You might live in a good area... Good Luck in whatever you choose. Keep it for the plants and see if they live...

Tito:jester:

[Scott293]

LOL...the warnings have been put out there people...if you want to try it, then do so. It may work, or we'll just see your next threads/posts in the "Disease?Sickness" forum. I live in Chicago, and I would NEVER use rainwater. Period. If I did, I would need about 100+ gallons a day...that's not going to happen. The volume is just not there. If you get no rain in your area, you don't make water changes? How does that work? Or you only change water when it rains?...Bill

Bill, you sound just like someone from Chicago, "only change water when it rains?" Do you think everyone else in this hobby is stupid? "If you don't get rain you don't make water changes?" Again, who do you think you are? I asked to discuss something, not for smart a.. remarks. Or for the record an average size home's roof provides hundreds of gallons PER MINUTE in a good rain. No, this is not a stupid idea.

[William Palumbo]

Thanks for the Chicago comment Scott. I tell it like it is, so I consider it a compliment. Thanks. Pollution in the air gets absorbed by rain water. What are you really going to check? You think TDS and ph are going to tell you everything you need to know? You'll never be able to test for contaminants. I'll disagree with you all day on the volume of water coming off a roof per min....Who I am is not important. But I do have an RO unit, and I get all the "rain" water I need, when I need it. My dozen+ pairs, and my 1000's a fry appreciate it as well...Bill

[Scott293]

I am also thinking about the hobbyist who cannot afford a $300 ro unit. Everything that we go through to keep discus healthy is exactly what scares people away from having discus.

[William Palumbo]

Scott, the price on Ro's have actually come down considerably since they first hit the market. Also WAY user friendly now. I was scared of them myself, as you had to "hard" plumb them into your plumbing, and with me renting at the time...no way.... Trust me, I tried most things in my early days to get the "perfect" Discus water...rainwater as well. IMO, I feel the risk of using it is not worth the risk to your fish. As someone already mentioned, Discus are not cheap! Maybe 20-30 years ago, rainwater was probably a good idea. But now, with all the pollution and toxins in there, not a great idea. And what's really the point if you have to take raw rainwater and filter it thru carbon/resins to make it useable? That's what an RO unit does...Bill

[TURQ64]

RO units are now extremely cheap for even large output units..check good 'ole Ebay, and you'll see...You can get a 100 g a day unit cheaper than you can get a 5" albino from Kenny; small price to pay in my opinion.. And since I'm speaking my opinion here, we bought the first R/O unit in our life for our own consumption; the fish were secondary beneficiaries.....Gary ( and for once I'm shouting 'Go Bill!...all good points..)

[Scott293]

Yes, at this point I am agreeing with Bill. But I also know that the way to raise the best in show guppy, is to put a few good prospects in the 100 gallon garden pond in the back yard in the spring and forget about them for the summer. At the end of summer, in the "rain water", with mosquito larvae and what ever else they have to eat you can net up hundreds of the prettiest guppies you have ever seen. That goes the same with many other fish. Of course I would not just drop a $500 pair of discus in my patio fish pond in back. But lets just not forget where these fish came from. They are much more hardy now than when I last had them in the 1980's. By more hardy I also mean more adapted to tap water.

Bill in my situation, I will not be using nearly as much water as you. Maybe I will in the future, but as for now I'll not use but 100 gallons per week. A trap on the downspout to catch the big stuff and a filter in the water line coming from the sealed drum outside to the drum inside is about as simple as hooking up an RO unit to my plumbing and much less costly. I purchased an RO unit off of craigslist for $50, but when it comes time to replace filters it's going to be $250. If you are using 100 gallons per day then you know what kind of water bills you have. Another breeder told me of his $800 water bill. I am talking about free water here. What I don't know is what kind of chance I would be taking by using it. And at this point all we have done is speculate. I was hoping to find someone who has tested or tried rain water. Our rivers get polluted from factories draining chemicals into them and they also get polluted from run off water from fields and yards that have been treated with chemicals. They may get polluted from rain too? I intend to find out

Who knows, you may see a first place winning discus at the show that was raised in the summer in my pond in the back yard. Then brought in to the house and fattened up where I use rain water (free water) for the winter.

[LizStreithorst]

There are too may contimates these days in rain water for it to be usable for Discus. Rain water picks up stuff when it falls. In a perfect world it would be pristine, but not in this world. Your roof is not the problem. It is what the rain picks up on it's way down

Shame...I would like to use it myself.

[TURQ64]

Well, there's a few mis-stated facts and such coming down 'with the rain'...O.K., I'm 62, tried rainwater when I was a pup, and pollution was lower, and it didn't work out well. I also have relatives and neighbors who used a cistern all their lives..All have some nerve related disorder or another, which eventually put them in the grave. One of my wife's farming uncle's from Parkinson's, and my father-in-law from early onset Alzheimer's...As for the R/O can that's getting kicked around, I have two, and buying my third soon...a zillion filters down the road, I pay around 9 or 10 bucks each for the carbon blocks and small micron prefilters, and for my DI, 34 bucks....that's 52 yankee frogskins by my math, not 250.00, although they get changed at different intervals, so it's really 9 bucks here, 34 bucks there....I use/waste around 4,000 gallons a month right now for my fish, which is an added 40 bucks a month.

[Scott293]

Acid Rain = Rainwater which contains sulphuric acid or nitric acid is called acid rain. It is caused by acidic air pollutants such as sulphur dioxide and nitrogen dioxide which react with rainwater. Sulphur dioxide dissolves readily in water to form sulphurous acid: SO2(g) + H2O(l) ~~~~~~~> H2SO3(aq) In the presence of oxygen in the air, this acid is slowly oxidised to sulphuric acid. Oxides of nitrogen also contribute to acid rain. In the presence of oxygen and water, nitrogen dioxide is converted to nitric acid. 4NO2(g) + 2H2O(l) + O2(g) ~~~~~~> 4HNO3(aq). This is quoted from library.thinkquest.org/C0111401/acid_rain.htm

It also says that the reason that rain is a pollutant to marine life is because the acid rain lowers the pH value of lakes and rivers. In simpler terms, it makes them more acidic. When the water becomes too acidic, the fish begin to die. In addition to that, other plants will also disappear. It is said that when the pH value of the water gets to 4.5, pretty much everything in the lakes and rivers are dead.

Now folks I quoted that from a credible site. If that is the only thing we have to worry about is checking the ph then this is an easy one. I think we have all been told too many scare tactic things about our environment. I will keep looking for more facts.

Bill I also found that the average home has 1,200 square feet of roof space and the average amount of rain water on the average size roof is 35,000 gallons per year in Chicago.

[TURQ64]

Acid rain in New England is a very big deal; I used to erect coal fired powerplants, and those we built without SO2 scrubber's really did in the lakes and rivers....haven't heard much lately, but I think that's because most of the damage is already done....

[Scott293]

Well, there's a few mis-stated facts and such coming down 'with the rain'...O.K., I'm 62, tried rainwater when I was a pup, and pollution was lower, and it didn't work out well. I also have relatives and neighbors who used a cistern all their lives..All have some nerve related disorder or another, which eventually put them in the grave. One of my wife's farming uncle's from Parkinson's, and my father-in-law from early onset Alzheimer's...As for the R/O can that's getting kicked around, I have two, and buying my third soon...a zillion filters down the road, I pay around 9 or 10 bucks each for the carbon blocks and small micron prefilters, and for my DI, 34 bucks....that's 52 yankee frogskins by my math, not 250.00, although they get changed at different intervals, so it's really 9 bucks here, 34 bucks there....I use/waste around 4,000 gallons a month right now for my fish, which is an added 40 bucks a month.

Well Turq64, maybe you can help me find where to get my filters, because the best price I have found on the RO filter is $149 and the two carbon filters at $49 each. The unit that I have is CMRO-3TFC, and it's only a 24 GPD unit. I can get all of the facts you like

[Scott293]

Acid rain in New England is a very big deal; I used to erect coal fired powerplants, and those we built without SO2 scrubber's really did in the lakes and rivers....haven't heard much lately, but I think that's because most of the damage is already done....

Interesting, I have erected coal fired power plants also.

[Scott293]

Scott

I live a mile from the Steel Mill where I work and wouldn't think about collecting rain water for fish. You will need to look way outside your neighborhood for pollutants.
Yes I'm sure after a long rain it might be better but what will keep the drum clean and protected until then? Save $5 on water and risk hundreds in fish?
You might live in a good area... Good Luck in whatever you choose. Keep it for the plants and see if they live...

Tito:jester:

Hi Tito, I would plan on the drum being black food grade. Black to keep out the sun light. Also I would connect the drain spout directly to the top of the drum with a trap above it that could be cleaned out easily. The trap would catch gravel or leaves and such that would come from the gutters. I would probably use a screen count similar to the screens in your windows. After a rain I would drain the barrel. The only oxygen available to the drum would be from the top of the spout which in my case is 2 stories up. I wouldn't use an open topped drum. It would also have an over flow near the top which would go into my storm drain where it is currently connected. Or it could go out onto the ground. That would be another source for oxygen to the drum outside. If I could easily cut off the oxygen to the drum I would but that would be a bit ridiculous running out in the rain to open the valves after I notice that the gutters are over flowing. I could possibly use a trap door type valve that would open with head pressure maybe but I don't know if all of that would be needed if the drum was just emptied after a rain. It would just sit there dry. Still it's not complicated

[TURQ64]

about the filter replacements; most all are fairly interchangeable. I'm not familiar with your unit, but I'd bet a buck that it will take most replacements, and that the membrane is made by the company that makes most of them, and then lets the retailer put their name on them. Other than the DI replacement, I can also find a suitable replacement for the pre-filter and carbon block at Menard's, Home Depot, etc...BTW, if you know this already or not, but you can install a 50 or 90 gal. membrane in yours, as long as you change out the restriction valve in the reject line...

[Elite Aquaria]

Scott I sell RO units and filters.

[brewmaster15]

I think alot has to do with where you live and how you collect it... I did it a few years back...but I filtered it well thru carbon, and collected it from my old worn out roof tiles...I would not use water from new asphalt roofing.....I tried it for several months as being on a well...RO is a risk to your water supply.

I know we have some members in some parts of the world where thats their main source of water...I remember some old posts.

But hey I know this is off track...I was looking for a rain collector I had seen online a few years back and came across this...

http://www.naturalnews.com/029286_rainwater_collection_water.html


(NaturalNews) Many of the freedoms we enjoy here in the U.S. are quickly eroding as the nation transforms from the land of the free into the land of the enslaved, but what I'm about to share with you takes the assault on our freedoms to a whole new level. You may not be aware of this, but many Western states, including Utah, Washington and Colorado, have long outlawed individuals from collecting rainwater on their own properties because, according to officials, that rain belongs to someone else.

As bizarre as it sounds, laws restricting property owners from "diverting" water that falls on their own homes and land have been on the books for quite some time in many Western states. Only recently, as droughts and renewed interest in water conservation methods have become more common, have individuals and business owners started butting heads with law enforcement over the practice of collecting rainwater for personal use.

Check out this YouTube video of a news report out of Salt Lake City, Utah, about the issue. It's illegal in Utah to divert rainwater without a valid water right, and Mark Miller of Mark Miller Toyota, found this out the hard way.

After constructing a large rainwater collection system at his new dealership to use for washing new cars, Miller found out that the project was actually an "unlawful diversion of rainwater." Even though it makes logical conservation sense to collect rainwater for this type of use since rain is scarce in Utah, it's still considered a violation of water rights which apparently belong exclusively to Utah's various government bodies.

"Utah's the second driest state in the nation. Our laws probably ought to catch up with that," explained Miller in response to the state's ridiculous rainwater collection ban.

Salt Lake City officials worked out a compromise with Miller and are now permitting him to use "their" rainwater, but the fact that individuals like Miller don't actually own the rainwater that falls on their property is a true indicator of what little freedom we actually have here in the U.S. (Access to the rainwater that falls on your own property seems to be a basic right, wouldn't you agree?)

Outlawing rainwater collection in other states
Utah isn't the only state with rainwater collection bans, either. Colorado and Washington also have rainwater collection restrictions that limit the free use of rainwater, but these restrictions vary among different areas of the states and legislators have passed some laws to help ease the restrictions.

In Colorado, two new laws were recently passed that exempt certain small-scale rainwater collection systems, like the kind people might install on their homes, from collection restrictions.

Prior to the passage of these laws, Douglas County, Colorado, conducted a study on how rainwater collection affects aquifer and groundwater supplies. The study revealed that letting people collect rainwater on their properties actually reduces demand from water facilities and improves conservation.

Personally, I don't think a study was even necessary to come to this obvious conclusion. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that using rainwater instead of tap water is a smart and useful way to conserve this valuable resource, especially in areas like the West where drought is a major concern.

Additionally, the study revealed that only about three percent of Douglas County's precipitation ended up in the streams and rivers that are supposedly being robbed from by rainwater collectors. The other 97 percent either evaporated or seeped into the ground to be used by plants.

This hints at why bureaucrats can't really use the argument that collecting rainwater prevents that water from getting to where it was intended to go. So little of it actually makes it to the final destination that virtually every household could collect many rain barrels worth of rainwater and it would have practically no effect on the amount that ends up in streams and rivers.

It's all about control, really
As long as people remain unaware and uninformed about important issues, the government will continue to chip away at the freedoms we enjoy. The only reason these water restrictions are finally starting to change for the better is because people started to notice and they worked to do something to reverse the law.

Even though these laws restricting water collection have been on the books for more than 100 years in some cases, they're slowly being reversed thanks to efforts by citizens who have decided that enough is enough.

Because if we can't even freely collect the rain that falls all around us, then what, exactly, can we freely do? The rainwater issue highlights a serious overall problem in America today: diminishing freedom and increased government control.

Today, we've basically been reprogrammed to think that we need permission from the government to exercise our inalienable rights, when in fact the government is supposed to derive its power from us. The American Republic was designed so that government would serve the People to protect and uphold freedom and liberty. But increasingly, our own government is restricting people from their rights to engage in commonsense, fundamental actions such as collecting rainwater or buying raw milk from the farmer next door.

Today, we are living under a government that has slowly siphoned off our freedoms, only to occasionally grant us back a few limited ones under the pretense that they're doing us a benevolent favor.

Fight back against enslavement
As long as people believe their rights stem from the government (and not the other way around), they will always be enslaved. And whatever rights and freedoms we think we still have will be quickly eroded by a system of bureaucratic power that seeks only to expand its control.

Because the same argument that's now being used to restrict rainwater collection could, of course, be used to declare that you have no right to the air you breathe, either. After all, governments could declare that air to be somebody else's air, and then they could charge you an "air tax" or an "air royalty" and demand you pay money for every breath that keeps you alive.

Think it couldn't happen? Just give it time. The government already claims it owns your land and house, effectively. If you really think you own your home, just stop paying property taxes and see how long you still "own" it. Your county or city will seize it and then sell it to pay off your "tax debt." That proves who really owns it in the first place... and it's not you!

How about the question of who owns your body? According to the U.S. Patent & Trademark office, U.S. corporations and universities already own 20% of your genetic code. Your own body, they claim, is partially the property of someone else.

So if they own your land, your water and your body, how long before they claim to own your air, your mind and even your soul?

Unless we stand up against this tyranny, it will creep upon us, day after day, until we find ourselves totally enslaved by a world of corporate-government collusion where everything of value is owned by powerful corporations -- all enforced at gunpoint by local law enforcement.

Learn more: http://www.naturalnews.com/029286_rainwater_collection_water.html#ixzz1HqJS4O pY




Never thought I'd see something like that!

-al

[Scott293]

Well Thanks Al!

Now I want rain water even more. I feel like I'd be getting a tax break or something from the government. But I am sure that in the desert it's a different story. Water/rain is much more scarce there than it is here in Ohio. They may only get enough for a few water changes per year.

By the way, my fish are loving your freeze dried black worms. Thank You
Scott

[Scott293]

Scott I sell RO units and filters.

I see that Dan. Sorry about the talk of hi ro costs. I can see where I will be buying my next RO unit. I may be getting one soon for drinking water. And besides, even if I could use rain water I would still use RO when there is no rain. I don't have room to store thousands of gallons of rain water. Your prices are good. Maybe the unit that I purchased is an older model. How could they stay in business though when they keep their prices so high? I'm thinking baybe there are some after market filter replacements out there for the model that I have. Do you have any filter replacements that would fit a CMRO-3TFC? ...Scott

[brewmaster15]

By the way, my fish are loving your freeze dried black worms. Thank You
Scott My pleasure Scott, Thank you for your Business, I'm glad they are a hit with the fishes! :)

-al

[William Palumbo]

Scott, you mention Guppies raised outside. Some of the best and most colorful Killies I ever had were raised outside. I don't really contribute it to rainwater, as I did to the continuous live food and sunshine...Bill

[Scott293]

Yes Bill I believe that also. I wouldn't think that the rain water contributed much to that. Hey Bill I just spoke with a chemist who graduated from OSU and is now making more money just 2 years out of college than I ever have. He works for Shell oil. He happens to be my daughters boyfriend/fiance'. I just discussed this with him and he says he did a study on rain water in college which showed that high acid water is very uncommon but it does happen. He also said that it's the "only thing" in rain water that would harm fish. He said that all he would do is check the ph. He said rain does not capture pollutants in the air except sulfur and something else which when combined with the correct oxygen produces the acidic water. He said all he would do is check the PH to be safe. Then I told him of capturing it from the roof through the downspout. He said now that would worry me. He said the reason that would worry him is because of the dust and sediment that settles on the roof. So a good half hour rain to wash the roof then turn it to the drum. So there would need to be a way to bypass the drum until the roof is cleaned off which is what my Aunt would do before running the rain water into her cistern. And Gary my Aunt lived to a ripe old age of 89 at which time she passed away with emphasima but she was a life long smoker. ...Scott

[Northwoods Discus]

Hopefully the birds don't crap on your roof. They do on mine. Beside that I think it is a great idea but will require storage and filtering. There was an episode on This New House where they were using rain water for all of their human usage including drinking. They did have a pretty detailed filter setup with large storage tanks. It was some place in Texas if I remember correctly. The host did bring up the question of the birds though thus the filters. I think they even pressurized the system somehow to run it through the filtration system. I also found a website with all the gadgets needed for rain water collection.

[Elite Aquaria]

I see that Dan. Sorry about the talk of hi ro costs. I can see where I will be buying my next RO unit. I may be getting one soon for drinking water. And besides, even if I could use rain water I would still use RO when there is no rain. I don't have room to store thousands of gallons of rain water. Your prices are good. Maybe the unit that I purchased is an older model. How could they stay in business though when they keep their prices so high? I'm thinking baybe there are some after market filter replacements out there for the model that I have. Do you have any filter replacements that would fit a CMRO-3TFC? ...Scott

Not a problem...I have no idea what a CMRO-3TFC is...As long as it has standard 10" canisters then my filters will fit.

[Scott293]

Not a problem...I have no idea what a CMRO-3TFC is...As long as it has standard 10" canisters then my filters will fit.

It's made by Cooler Mate. If you google CMRO-3TFC it's easy to find. The canisters are 12" long by 2" round.

[Elite Aquaria]

Sorry that is not a standard size for a filter. I only carry 10"

[TURQ64]

Scott, I see no need for banter; there are exceptions to everything encountered in life...Good luck on this venture, I'll stick with what has proven to work for me over time, and that's pretty much where we all seem to evolve in Discus keeping. Since we have only had 'running water' in this part of my state for twenty years, it is a precious commodity, and I'm working on reclaiming all that I throw away. Our septic systems can't handle an overly large amount of water without a lot of grief either..cheers, and hopefully we won't see you on the 'what's wrong with my Discus? threads..Gary

[nc0gnet0]

Its a bad idea IMO. Acid rain is the least of your worries. Fuel emissions, pesticides, and bacteria/parasite infested bird/rodent droppings are the real dangers here. Not to mention clay tile is semi porous, so just how long would you have to wait until you start collecting the water? If you wanted to set up a collection point and treat the water with Activated carbon and chlorine it might be doable, but at that point why bother?

[TURQ64]

An update..Reuter's posted this a.m. that low levels of radioactive iodine 131 has been detected in Mass. rainwater...so much for a college degree in rainwater,eh??..Discus with a third eye, coming up!

[Skip]

i would be worried about using rainwater.. no telling what is in this untreated water.. imho

[Northwoods Discus]

In veterinary school a long long time ago we had a class about public health. I remember the prof saying that one foot of sand is enough to filter out all the bacteria etc. That is why we use ground water. On a side note he also said you can eat pus if you boil it long enough.

[LizStreithorst]

I have my doubts, but i would like to see you give it a go. If it works for your fish after a year's time, I'd try it myself. I have an electrostaticly "painted" metal roof.

This type of DIY project would be right up my alley. I need to install gutters anyway. It would be easy eough to divirt the first 1/2 hours worth to the ground, and would only involve getting wet to change it to go into the storage container. Plus, I already have 3 150 gallon water containers sitting in storage.

[DerekFF]

There are too may contimates these days in rain water for it to be usable for Discus. Rain water picks up stuff when it falls. In a perfect world it would be pristine, but not in this world. Your roof is not the problem. It is what the rain picks up on it's way down

Shame...I would like to use it myself.

Yeah theres way to many pollutants in the air that rain picks up now that i think over a term of time could be harmful to your fish. Acid rain=rain that picked up to much doodoo when falling

[DerekFF]

In veterinary school a long long time ago we had a class about public health. I remember the prof saying that one foot of sand is enough to filter out all the bacteria etc. That is why we use ground water. On a side note he also said you can eat pus if you boil it long enough.

HAHA.....that just made me hungry

[Skip]

Yeah theres way to many pollutants in the air that rain picks up now that i think over a term of time could be harmful to your fish. Acid rain=rain that picked up to much doodoo when falling

hydrochloric acid is a CLEAR LIQUID>. but i still would not drink it or put it in my discus tank :)

[Scott293]

OK folks,
I found out more today. There are still lots of people who use cisterns for their drinking water, even people that I work with now have cisterns for their whole house water supply. I just think that there is no need to make it so difficult and expensive to own discus. Sure we are all proud of the fact that yes we can do it and we know how, and to have such gorgeous prestigious fish you must do this exactly. I think there is a much cheaper option here, common sense tells me it will work. In the wild they live in fresh water, which is "rain water". It's as simple as that. If there were no rain there would be nothing but salt water on this planet. So I guess you are all forcing me to be the guinea pig. It's only right I guess, I am the ONE who is believing it will work, so I guess I'll have to try it. I think it would be a far less chance for you who have thousands of fry to take a few to raise on rain water, but that's ok I will give it a shot. ...Scott

[Scott293]

An update..Reuter's posted this a.m. that low levels of radioactive iodine 131 has been detected in Mass. rainwater...so much for a college degree in rainwater,eh??..Discus with a third eye, coming up!

Scott's three eyed blue diamonds are flooding the market like rainwater. No need for tank lights because they are glowing so bright. Eat your heart out. lol ...Scott

[Rex82]

http://www.enviro-friendly.com/first-flush-diverter.shtml

People use rainwater here in aus for thier discus and cant say there are alot of problems. This device will help you with the crap on your roof mate. HTH

[roclement]

Hey Scott,

I manage a Golf Club and have a USGA Agronomist on staff, we survey rainwater regularly since we are in such a densely populated area for National Statistics, I would not use my rainwater to raise discus, or to raise any other animal...keep in mind that a rainstorm can travel hundreds of miles so you never know for sure where that water falling from the sky originated...I would protect my fish investment with safe water, if the cost is to high, then I honestly don't thik this is the hobby for you.

When it somes to providing for a pet, we need to take into consideration what's best for it, not what is most economical but that is just how I see it. Best of luck with whatever you decide to do.

Rodrigo

[Scott293]

Hey Scott,

I manage a Golf Club and have a USGA Agronomist on staff, we survey rainwater regularly since we are in such a densely populated area for National Statistics, I would not use my rainwater to raise discus, or to raise any other animal...keep in mind that a rainstorm can travel hundreds of miles so you never know for sure where that water falling from the sky originated...I would protect my fish investment with safe water, if the cost is to high, then I honestly don't thik this is the hobby for you.

When it somes to providing for a pet, we need to take into consideration what's best for it, not what is most economical but that is just how I see it. Best of luck with whatever you decide to do.

Rodrigo

Well Hot dog! Rodrigo! Thank you for joining in. It sounds as if you might have some legitimate data for us? Tell us why you wouldn't use rain water. Not only is it cost but like I said these fish live in rain water in the wild. Through our domesticating them we are giving them artificial rain, are we not? Rain is evaporated water, it has nothing in it. Yes it can pick up sulfur which will cause low ph (easily detected). Do you have data or proof that shows it picks up anything else? Sure it can pick up sediment or even poisons as someone stated on your roof. Other than that, do you have proof of anything else? Someone even said trace amounts of radio active iodine. But a 3 eyed glowing fish might be the hottest fish on the market. You said to take consideration in what is best for our pets, they live in rain water, we are trying to domesticate them with chemically treated tap water are we not? ...Scott

[TURQ64]

These fish live in tanks; they're domestic....Wilds live in Amazon rainwater, filtered thru millions of years worth of peat. How long are we gonna flog this horse???

[Scott293]

http://www.enviro-friendly.com/first-flush-diverter.shtml

People use rainwater here in aus for thier discus and cant say there are alot of problems. This device will help you with the crap on your roof mate. HTH

Thank you HTH! It looks like a first flush diverter will be nice for my rain water capturing system. This was one of the things discussed earlier about letting the rain wash off the roof before capturing it. Just goes to show that we are not the first ones to think of these things. I am sure that someone has done this and has some good information for us to learn. Do you have colleagues in Australia who can tell us how their discus do in rain water? Thanks Again ...Scott

[TURQ64]

Hmm, more interesting than the rain, is the disappearance of most of the posts I made yesterday....Not very fair, says I....

[Scott293]

These fish live in tanks; they're domestic....Wilds live in Amazon rainwater, filtered thru millions of years worth of peat. How long are we gonna flog this horse???

Actually, the run off water going into our streams and rivers are where the harmful river pollution comes from. Hopefully the peat can filter it out before it gets there or the fish will all be dead from run off fertilizers and poisons. This horse is still running to beat the band. Are you not hearing that in Aus they use rain water for their discus? Come on Turq, think out of the box here. What about the rainy season in the amazon when they are getting heavy rains. It is not filtered, it is simply runoff and direct rain on top of the river. And according to HTH's Agronomist that rain can be generated from anywhere and traveled for miles. ...Scott

[Scott293]

Hmm, more interesting than the rain, is the disappearance of most of the posts I made yesterday....Not very fair, says I....

It doesn't look to me like anything is missing. I see all 3 pages

[Rex82]

I live in suburbia. I breed discus on RO water because i rent and dont have Rainwater tanks. I have a friend not 500m from my house breeding as well but he breeds on rainwater, to be honest there is no noticeable differences between our fish healthwise, he just does it more economical than i can for obvious reasons. I have used rainwater previously and do notice it alot easier to induce a pair to spawn on a rainwater mix. The water does have to be mixed with some tap though just as you would with RO. At a guess i would say 50% of people that breed for hobby in australia would use rainwater, but thats just a guess.
I say go for it, at risk of being in the minority here but i dont really care. Everyone has thier own ways of doing things.

Cheers Ross

[Joker43]

Scott,

What would you do in the winter months? Discus fish can live in different water parameters but they need to be constant.
Proven already swings in ph, hardness and tempature can make discus weak or sick. Eggs need to be in soft water to hatch, Fry and Juvies thrive in harder water to grow and adults can live in fairly high ph with decent hardness. The key is constant clean water. If by chance you collect enough water for half the year would you go back to city water the other half.
I'm all for saving money that's why I do my best to raise my fish to live long healthy lives.

You posted for thoughts and I think you received plenty. Good luck.

Tito:jester:

[TURQ64]

Actually, the run off water going into our streams and rivers are where the harmful river pollution comes from. Hopefully the peat can filter it out before it gets there or the fish will all be dead from run off fertilizers and poisons. This horse is still running to beat the band. Are you not hearing that in Aus they use rain water for their discus? Come on Turq, think out of the box here. What about the rainy season in the amazon when they are getting heavy rains. It is not filtered, it is simply runoff and direct rain on top of the river. And according to HTH's Agronomist that rain can be generated from anywhere and traveled for miles. ...Scott
Scott, I hear very well, thank you. I also have over 50 years raising and breeding Discus,and am not going to jump at what works for someone in AUS....I factually know what works FOR ME with fish in the U.S. I have bred Discus in Nebraska, south Dakota, California, and Arizona...Methods proven to me that work. period. As for posts, I mentioned waay back in the beginning that rainwater never worked for me. I use large amounts of water, year in, year out..I also will not compromise my fishkeeping by the word of your daughter's boyfriend, as I have grandchildren that old, and I don't even listen to them!....Later, friend..best of luck, as I also mentioned earlier.

[Scott293]

I live in suburbia. I breed discus on RO water because i rent and dont have Rainwater tanks. I have a friend not 500m from my house breeding as well but he breeds on rainwater, to be honest there is no noticeable differences between our fish healthwise, he just does it more economical than i can for obvious reasons. I have used rainwater previously and do notice it alot easier to induce a pair to spawn on a rainwater mix. The water does have to be mixed with some tap though just as you would with RO. At a guess i would say 50% of people that breed for hobby in australia would use rainwater, but thats just a guess.
I say go for it, at risk of being in the minority here but i dont really care. Everyone has thier own ways of doing things.

Cheers Ross

Thank You Ross. Do you remember or having experienced any problems with rain water yourself or know of anyone having problems with rain water? Possible sudden changes in the rain water? Did you or do they filter it in any way before using it? Thanks again ...Scott

[Scott293]

Scott, I hear very well, thank you. I also have over 50 years raising and breeding Discus,and am not going to jump at what works for someone in AUS....I factually know what works FOR ME with fish in the U.S. I have bred Discus in Nebraska, south Dakota, California, and Arizona...Methods proven to me that work. period. As for posts, I mentioned waay back in the beginning that rainwater never worked for me. I use large amounts of water, year in, year out..I also will not compromise my fishkeeping by the word of your daughter's boyfriend, as I have grandchildren that old, and I don't even listen to them!....Later, friend..best of luck, as I also mentioned earlier.

Aww come on TURQ, I have taken your comments into consideration just the same as everyone else's. This discussion has brought up some good points and some experience as well. Don't leave us now. If it didn't work for you, what happened? Do you know why it didn't work? I have lost discus using RO water before. The reason I lost them actually had nothing to do with the water. And Turq, you had asked a question about reusing waste water from tanks. I would think that all you need it a pump to create the pressure needed for the ro filtering process again. That would put the water right back where it was when you first put it in the tank wouldn't it? Which brings up a whole new subject and I am not going there except for this. Why not just run your tank water through a pump into an ro unit and right back into the tank? Just add 10% tap water once per day.

[Scott293]

Scott,

What would you do in the winter months? Discus fish can live in different water parameters but they need to be constant.
Proven already swings in ph, hardness and tempature can make discus weak or sick. Eggs need to be in soft water to hatch, Fry and Juvies thrive in harder water to grow and adults can live in fairly high ph with decent hardness. The key is constant clean water. If you by chance you collect enough water for half the year would you go back to city water the other half.
I'm all for saving money that's why I do my best to raise my fish to live long healthy lives.

You posted for thoughts and I think you received plenty. Good luck.

Tito:jester:

Yes Tito we have received a lot of good stuff. This is an awesome forum with some really good people. I was recommended to come here for advice or help and this place is great. I can't imagine anything better.
As far as winter months I would think that the water supply would run dry. I don't have the room to store that much water. Well I probably do but my wife would put me out. What you say about consistency is where I would see a problem. I would have to use ro in the winter and maybe even some summers. If I couldn't match one to the the other then I believe there would be problems. Or maybe they should always be alternating rain/ro/rain/ro so they are used to the difference? But what you are saying is that may very well make them weak. aahhh yeah that may be a problem ...Scott

[Rex82]

Only prob with rain water is that it has no hardness so it needs to be reconstituted with some minerals to keep the ph from crashing, also need to be careful storing it as bacteria can attack it as there is no chlorine etc in the water to prevent it, can always treat with Potassium Permanganate to strip the water.
Ro water can be reused but isn't really viable as the filter will clog easily and the nitrates will still be a problem. Better to use a hydroponic style setup but usually outside temps prevent this from being viable as well, It can be done inside a greenhouse type deal if you have space and means i guess.

[roclement]

Scott,

Please don't compare our fish or tanks with the Amazon ecosystem...please! I agrre that you can raise fish in any water, what my concern is that you have no way of knowing when an issue may happen, when someone may spray the neighborhood, etc.

Our water samples from rain (NYC area) have traces of many things, I am no chemist so I am not going down that road, but the people that I pay to know, don't recomend for drinking so it can't be good for my fish.

Australia may be another animal, and where you are in the country as well... I don't know, like I said before, best of luck, I hope it works for you.

Rodrigo

[Scott293]

Only prob with rain water is that it has no hardness so it needs to be reconstituted with some minerals to keep the ph from crashing, also need to be careful storing it as bacteria can attack it as there is no chlorine etc in the water to prevent it, can always treat with Potassium Permanganate to strip the water.
Ro water can be reused but isn't really viable as the filter will clog easily and the nitrates will still be a problem. Better to use a hydroponic style setup but usually outside temps prevent this from being viable as well, It can be done inside a greenhouse type deal if you have space and means i guess.

Thanks Rex, do you think that rain plus 10% tap water would be enough? Now I am referring to a breeding pair laying eggs. For the rest, here in Cincinnati we can keep our juveniles and adults in straight tap water then acclimate them to ro when they are laying.

That hydroponic setup would be interesting. So I guess you would use the plants to remove nitrates and filter the water which would replenish it.

[Rex82]

The mix will depend on how hard your tap water is in your area. treat it the same as you would RO. Yeah plants will chew through the nitrates, will still need to replenish with new water every so often though as plants and fish will be drawing upon the mineral content.

[brewmaster15]

I think sometimes the only way to know what you can and can not do is try it and get the answer for yourself....Its how I have always done things in this Hobby...At worst you fail and something does not work. But theres much to be learned in the process, whether you fail or succeed, and sometimes you learn more by failing several times before getting it correct.

So if you feel you can do it Scott, my advice is try it, keep good notes, test the water regularly and post your experiences with....positive or negative.

Good luck,
al

[TURQ64]

Hmm, more interesting than the rain, is the disappearance of most of the posts I made yesterday....Not very fair, says I....

Although I have no further interest in this topic, I feel compelled to clear this post up. The 'missing' post is actually one I followed up on by Scott in an identical thread he posted in. I appologise for any mixup, but that's the nature of redundant threads..g'day, HTH, Gary

[LizStreithorst]

I think sometimes the only way to know what you can and can not do is try it and get the answer for yourself....Its how I have always done it.

That's the way I do things with my fish too. I may be the only one in the world who feeds newly free swimming fry vermicompost.

If things continue to go well for me I hope to build a fish house in 2 years. Although my water is cheap, I think that this would be a great way to use a natural resource. I would have to divert the water from the roof to a container inside the fish room for use during the winter months, but that is doable.

Please go ahead with this Scott and post your results whether positive or negative.

[Scott293]

So if you feel you can do it Scott, my advice is try it, keep good notes, test the water regularly and post your experiences with....positive or negative.
al

That's what I will do Al. I didn't mean to bore anyone or argue with anyone I was just thinking surely someone else has tried this. I wouldn't even want to try it after hearing that others had tried and it didn't work. At this point I'm not quite set up to do it yet. But I will get set up and absolutely I will keep you posted. I think if done properly it could benefit everyone, including the fish. And I thank everyone for your input and ideas.

...Scott

[Rex82]

That's what I will do Al. I didn't mean to bore anyone or argue with anyone I was just thinking surely someone else has tried this. I wouldn't even want to try it after hearing that others had tried and it didn't work. At this point I'm not quite set up to do it yet. But I will get set up and absolutely I will keep you posted. I think if done properly it could benefit everyone, including the fish. And I thank everyone for your input and ideas.

...Scott

No worries Scott,
this has been a quite civil thread considering the direction these types of threads sometimes take. The water out of the sky here measures around 6.8 ph but can quickly fall. If you start with a mix around 50/50 rain/tap and let it age then it will give you an idea where you're at with the ph buffering. I know fish will always respond to rainwater really well in regards to spawning, I have no doubt you will notice similar findings IMO. If i had the choice between rain and Ro for breeding here in oz i would go for rain myself..
Regards Ross

[Sean Buehrle]

I wouldnt use it. especially off a roof or any other fixed thing that could collect pollution before it rained. just too many ifs.

[stanrocks]

i use a trap to do rain water its ph is 6.0 works for me

[TheDrake]

I use rain water for my house, including keeping amphibians and non-discus fish (because I don't have them, yet). I have a 'roof washer' (a T line w/ manual drain on the main line in) to catch the largest debris, a filter sock down to 50 microns, and a 20 micron filter inline for general house supply. For drinking, the water goes through an RO and all the necessary prefilters that precede it. Never any problems with anything ever. Sure, it can and surely does pick up some pollutants from the sky. But what do you think is coming up out of the ground nowadays? Do you think your municipality removes (or even tests for) anything other than sediment and maybe bacteria? I guarantee that there are more pharmaceuticals coming out of your tap than from the sky. Prozac has been shown to buildup downstream from sewage plants in high enough concentrations to build up in fish tissues and affect their growth and behavior. Fake hormones from birth control pills too. Both are now found in trace amounts in common municipal tapwater. Along with pesticides like atrazine. Nothing's perfect, and rain is no worse than anything else. Better for many, because it is naturally so soft. My problem, and the key limiting factor as was mentioned already, is quantity. Unless you have a monster cistern, you just won't have enough water to meet your needs and a sensitive fish like discus too. When I figure a way around that, I'll let you know.

[dpete9]

There are a lot of dirty birds that sit on the rooftops here (pigeons and sparrows) and well you know what birds do.. poo poo poo. I wonder if birds can transmit organisms to fish?

[LizStreithorst]

You seem to have it figured out well, Drake.

[DerekFF]

I tested my rain water last storm. My reef club decided to do it. Results
Tds-145
Ammonia-.5ppm
Nitrite-0
Nitrate-0
Ph-6.8

And along with these basic readings who knows what chemicals or smog/toxins it picked up coming down through the atmosphere.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Skip]

.5ppm in rain water.. WOW!

[ausuriello2nd]

Hi William, you bring up allot of good points, ones that make very good sense! Rain water has its good points too, like being used to water the garden, etc. But its practical application for being used with discus fish to help either save money or use water to help supplement water for discus..Forget it one is only asking for trouble in long run which eventually cause its own set of probelms I therefore will stick with using tap water and ro water for my discus and not subject those discus to any further unseen or unseen future problems....Again, William very good advice..Thanks for sharing your point of view......Al...Al from Omaha

[DerekFF]

.5ppm in rain water.. WOW!

Good old California valley rain water!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[mee]

I use rain water for my house, including keeping amphibians and non-discus fish (because I don't have them, yet). I have a 'roof washer' (a T line w/ manual drain on the main line in) to catch the largest debris, a filter sock down to 50 microns, and a 20 micron filter inline for general house supply. For drinking, the water goes through an RO and all the necessary prefilters that precede it. Never any problems with anything ever. Sure, it can and surely does pick up some pollutants from the sky. But what do you think is coming up out of the ground nowadays? Do you think your municipality removes (or even tests for) anything other than sediment and maybe bacteria? I guarantee that there are more pharmaceuticals coming out of your tap than from the sky. Prozac has been shown to buildup downstream from sewage plants in high enough concentrations to build up in fish tissues and affect their growth and behavior. Fake hormones from birth control pills too. Both are now found in trace amounts in common municipal tapwater. Along with pesticides like atrazine. Nothing's perfect, and rain is no worse than anything else. Better for many, because it is naturally so soft. My problem, and the key limiting factor as was mentioned already, is quantity. Unless you have a monster cistern, you just won't have enough water to meet your needs and a sensitive fish like discus too. When I figure a way around that, I'll let you know.

+1 If you live somewhere where it doesn't rain often, then clearly you don't want to use the first rain of the year from your roof. But being from seattle, I can safely say that it rains often enough that most roof water is extremely clean. Here in Japan during typhoon season the roofs get a wonderful cleaning, and I am definitely considering trying to use some this season. Different strokes for different folks, but many here need to realize, just cause you live in a dirty city, doesn't mean we all do. But more, remember that many lose whole tanks of fish from "water supply problems", so though there are things we can't control in rain water, they are in general more predictable because we can readily observe our roof and local weather. Few of us are able to observe what happens or mishappens at our local water companies facilities.

[mee]

I just tested the PH and TDS on some rain water that came from a typhoon that just missed us. PH 6.0 TDS 9 ! With my tap water coming out around PH 7.4-7.6 and a TDS of 88, which raises to about 120- 140 in the tank, just a little rain water would probably give me some very nice breeding conditions.

[DiscusLoverJeff]

I just tested the PH and TDS on some rain water that came from typhoon that just missed us. PH 6.0 TDS 9 !

Wow thats low. You would want to test it after aeration and 24 hours later. If you think it can be consistant, then you have good rain water. Hope it works out for you.

I think when people test rain water who live in big cities or dirty areas, they might be thinking about the pollutants in the air as opposed to a roof or downspout.

[mee]

Wow thats low.


Yeah, I did a double take when I first saw it. I was expecting maybe 30 or 40, 9 was a nice surprise.

I use wind tracker, and if I do this I would be very careful. Though the majority of the heavy rains come in from the south pacific there are rains from China which I would not trust at all, as well as dust from china which is not good stuff. I would definitely have to be mindful and on top of things.

[dr.cichla]

I've been collecting rain from my roof in anticipation of using it on discus soon, though at the moment its just used on the garden. I live in Houston, but on the far west side (the petroleum refineries are all on the east side, and most storm systems come in from the west as well), and it rains often enough throughout the year (don't talk to me about humidity...) that the roof stays pretty clean. Water is getting to be a big deal here in Texas these days, and a lot more people are beginning to collect rain for gardens, aquariums, heck even to drink, so there's a lot of literature out there about it.

That being said, I have a first flush diverter on my system and it does collect a lot of junk, and some still escapes and makes it into the barrels, but this is mostly just plant debris which I don't really worry about for the fish. I still intend to filter the water coming from the barrels through 20, 5, and 0.5 micron sediment filters and a carbon block before it enters my aging/adjusting barrels inside, though. A 0.5 micron filter will take care of most parasites from things like bird droppings. I considered hooking up a UV system as well, but the constraint here was that most UV filters (aside from flow rate restrictions for effective use) require the water to be a minimum temperature, and as my intermediate storage barrels are outside, I can't guarantee this throughout several months of the year. I looked at inline heaters, but buying both this and the UV was a little expensive not knowing if they would be reliable.

Just my two cents. Stu

[mee]

@dr.cichla, sounds like a sound approach.

[mee]

Just a little update. Had some monsoon type rain last night and filled 2 buckets 3 times each in just a couple of hours! TDS was 3 !!!! I added one bucket at a time and the female immediately became more frisky with the male and exhibited spawning behavior following the first bucket. I opted to just add them and let the overflow drain into an unused bucket below rather than taking out tank water because I didn't want to have a sudden drop in PH. I went from 119, to 84TDS by the end of the rain.. no spawn yet, but this is just the beginning of the rainy season here. I think I will be investing in a few more buckets very soon, in anticipation of the next downpour :)

FYI there was 4 inches of standing water in my back yard, so with a well placed pump and fine filter I could get a few hundred gallons of extremely clean low tds water next time.

[dirtyplants]

OK, I can't bring myself to use RO units for water, the waste eats away at me. My friend has been using rain water for 30 years and lives in Milwaukee. I think Milwaukee has more pollutants, in the air and in fertilizers in the tap then Chicago. I am not so sure if RO filters remove nitrates, phosphates, and other tiny contaminates. My friend has been doing discus for 30 years. If you have enough rain then you can accumulate enough rain water over a year from your gutter. It is acid rain and is soft, added to tap water to lower the pH of Milwaukee tap. Not to be used as THE only water source. He filters it, then it goes from one tank in his basement to another and another and then mixes it with tap. His fish do well, are happy and healthy, but he has only a few tanks. I have been considering using some rain water also, but for mixing with tap water. Is there a real right answer in this? I am also looking into how to be a lot more environmentally conscious in water use. Not so sure about the mentality of someone who wants to live in the desert and then demands he does not have the water for a lawn and pine trees to grow so imports it.:) Usually the more water used the more you pay, coming in and then going out. I am very interested if there is a way to recycle waste water back into the aquarium. Rain water may be be helpful in reducing some water usage, but clearly not the solution.

[William Palumbo]

If you are in Chicago, you will not need RO for your Discus unless you are going to be breeding them. The city tap is fine for that once you treat it with Prime/Safe. Sounds like a lot of trouble to go around using RO. If using rain, hope your roof, gutters, and barrel are super clean and fish safe...when and if you get enough rain. Want to be environmentally conscious, probably best to stay away from Discus, as the need/use a LOT of water, and in most if not all cases a LOT of electricity. Tho I have heard of people using waste RO to raise up other fish...and some run the line outside to water the lawn with the waste water. Unless you have a meter on your house in Chicago...you will be charged a flat rate for water, whether you use it or not...Bill

[dirtyplants]

That is something I have heard, a flat use would be nice. In WI you get charged for water coming in and then going out. (Sewer use) Milwaukee claims to have a tap of 7.5 but I have asked many to measure their water and all have found 8. plus coming from the tap.
Back to topic, yesterday it rained really hard I collected about 100 gallons from the roof of my garage gutter. I used a bucket to bring inside - what a pain. After filling my barrel with rain water I decided to measure the pH, being acid rain.:)
The pH measured 7.4 at 58 degrees - so much for acid rain. Hmmm... I will have to test after it reaches room temp. I am curious to see if it drops in pH.

[William Palumbo]

I figured the rain would be lower ph. I know about the water in Wisconsin. I relocated up here and just starting up a handful of tanks. Water not as cheap as in Chicago!...Bill

[mee]

The rain water here has a PH of about 5. I would think if you are lucky like me with extremely low TDS rain you could run it through an RO unit and it would be very little wear on the membrane, and very little reject water would be created if any... but it would help kick out any potential nasties (parasites, fungus, etc..)

[musicmarn1]

I got my four stage portable RO on eBay for $60 for that cost to be safe it's just so sensible. I live in a blooming Forrest in a tiny village up in a ski resort but although I'd love to collect rain water, it's just not worth the risk since Discus thrive on stability and it seems to me the water would always have variables in it.

[mee]

Variables depending on seasons and where you live, but RO water mixed with tap will have variables too since tap water can have fairly wide swings in ph as well as known and unknown chemicals. There is a little used RO unit at my local shop for about $20 and I keep passing on it, but if it is there next time I may just go for it and see what I can do with it.

[dirtyplants]

It has been raining for two days here if I had been set up for rain water I would have a lot of barrels. We use rain barrels here provided by the city for a nominal fee. City encourages the use of rain barrels, I have no holding tanks in the basement.
I am checking pH from each batch of rain I get, wondering if their is a difference in rain water. If the world pollutants effect the quality of the rain. One thing I can say is that I added 12 gallons of rain water to my 55 gallon aging tank after filtering for 8 hours with charcoal and additional 8 hour with micron filters. Then did a water change of a fourth of the tank. That evening my adolescent pigeon, Gizzy, spawned on the heater. The eggs were eaten by the remaining barbs I can't catch.

[mee]

I definitely saw some spawny looking activity during my one man bucket brigade during the last typhoon. No spawn, but I think a few days in a row would trigger something. We have had a bunch of near miss typhoons this last week and short but extreme dumps of rain. Unfortunately it has been while I am working, or exhausted / sleeping.

As for PH my rain does vary, in march it was upper 5's, but lately it has been 5 even. Because of this I am only adding a bucket at a time, and keeping a close eye on the PH while I do it, and a closer eye when I go back to straight tap water.

It is only because the TDS is so low (3ppm last time) that I feel comfortable using this water. I monitor it every time before adding it. At 3ppm I feel that even if all 3 parts per million were radioactive idodine (very well could be) it is not going to harm the fish any more than the unknown 80-100ppm I get from my tap.

[timmy82]

Well I have no other choice but rain water soon as I'm moving so I would like to kick this old thread off.

[timmy82]

Where we are moving to is in a rainforrest and we have got an 80,000 ltr underground tank. The whole roof of the house collects into that with an annual rain fall averaging 2,000mm. I was planning on running it still trough 3 10" filters still determining the combination at the minute. I was also planning on including a ozone machine to be sure to purify the water form bacteria and other nasties. I was also thinking about some mechanical filtration like crushed coral to slightly buffer the ph for the young and the additional calcium as well as possibly a pool sand filter. I currently have 8 pairs and looking to expand out to around 20. Any thoughts or opinions on what has worked well?