gill flukes?

[fleshwound]

Hey I just bought 8 juvenile discus and ive noticed after a few days one of the more healthy ones started to hide, eyes go cloudy, he stopped using one side of his gills and fin, and his fin has gone opaque. Ive got rid ich + which has formalin and a few other things. I just wanted to know should I just treat the group or make another quarantine tank? I just dont want to stress him out by taking him out to treat him, and at the same time dont want to stress healthy fish with meds... Is it safe to use on all my fish?

[flyman767]

fleshwound,

Welcome!..Please fill out the questionaire to accurately diagnose your problem.

http://forum.simplydiscus.com/showthread.php?38545-Disease-Questionnaire-please-complete

[jpdevol]

Pics helpful too.

[Eddie]

Definitely fill out the questionnaire and as mentioned, pictures are worth 1000 words.

[fleshwound]

DISEASE QUESTIONNAIRE


Problem

1. Please explain the problems with your fish/when and how they started


Hiding, slighty milkey eyes, not using one sides fin or gill sometimes. Its very slight, and hard to see but hes definatly favoring one side of his fin and gills. I tried posting photos but apparenty I cant yet

2. Symptoms (i.e. turning dark, excess slime, not eating, clamped fins, flashing, darting, clamped gills, white/yellow/green poop, hiding, headstanding or tailstanding, white on tips of fins, rotting or fungus, blisters/ white zits on fish, bloated, cloudy eyes, wounds)



darker in color, clamped gills, headstanding, opaque fin


3. What medications/ treatments that you have already tried and results. Include dosages and duration of treatment.


30% Water Changes


Tank/Water

4. Tank size and age, number and size of fish


33g quarentine tank, 8 juveniles, 1 to 3.5"


5. Water change regime/ how long has tank been running/ bare bottom or gravel/ do you age your water?


WC, 5-6 times a week, 30%, playsand suvstrate, not againg water


6 Parameters and water source;

- temp 83F

- ph 7.6

- ammonia reading 0

- nitrite reading 0

- nitrate reading 0

- well water No

- municipal water Yes

7. Any new fish/plants added recently

No other fish, had hairgrass in, but took it out

[Melissa]

Your Nitrate should not be 0... Is your tank cycled?
Also, since you do not age your water I was wondering- do you use water conditioner? If so, what kind?

[Eddie]

My suggestion, make your tank barebottom, age your water and increase water changes to >75% every day.

[fleshwound]

Pardon me I didnt mean to say 0 nitrate, i dont have the test for that any more ran out of solution...

[fleshwound]

how long do you have to let the water sit before you can use it?

[flyman767]

I see your on city water..do you use any type of dechlorinator? If so, what kind and how much? Also, since you don't aerate your water, you could be adding significant amounts of stress by the way of a PH swing...

[flyman767]

how long do you have to let the water sit before you can use it?

That depends..usually 24 hours. You need to test your ph in a storage container several times until the ph stabilizes. Also, depends on the size of your airpump.

[fleshwound]

I see your on city water..do you use any type of dechlorinator? If so, what kind and how much? Also, since you don't aerate your water, you could be adding significant amounts of stress by the way of a PH swing...

I forgot to mention i am aerating...

[fleshwound]

That depends..usually 24 hours. You need to test your ph in a storage container several times until the ph stabilizes. Also, depends on the size of your airpump.

So basically fill a tub up with water let it sit, and aerate it?

[flyman767]

So basically fill a tub up with water let it sit, and aerate it?

Yes..with an airstone(s). Take several ph readings..one at 12 hours, 24, 36. With my setup, my ph is usually stablized at 12 hours. However, the only way you will know is when your ph is no longer increasing or decreasing. Also, make sure all your hoses and storage containers are potable safe!

[Discus Origins]

The clamped gills are a sign of flukes but with cloudy eyes, black color and head standing there is more going on than that. Could be hex could be fungal. I would do a 75% water change, kick the temp up to 86 and add a tablespoon aquarium salt per 10g to start a treatment tonic. Maintain the same concentration with water changes until the cloudy fins clear up.

Metronidazole should be started soon for the hex. The flukes is the last thing I would worry about and they are easily controlled. Live bearer anti-fluke is great and safe to use even on fry. Follow directions and treat twice. Good luck.

Mark

[fleshwound]

Thank you for all the help... So should I set up a hospital tank or can I treat the group? as soon as i get to 10 posts I will send pictures... It could be the lighting making him look dark i dunno, but hes fer sure cloudy a little...

[Eddie]

I wouldn't be using any meds/chemicals until you get your water worked out. They will never respond to meds if there is constant stress from the water differences.

[Eddie]

Thank you for all the help... So should I set up a hospital tank or can I treat the group? as soon as i get to 10 posts I will send pictures... It could be the lighting making him look dark i dunno, but hes fer sure cloudy a little...

If you set up a hospital tank, make sure the water has been aerated for 24 hours, to stabilize the parameters. Then you can move the fish to the hospital and effectively treat them IF need be. For the time being, you can simply add salt at about 2 tbsp/10 gallons and keep things clean. Young fish are very delicate to water parameter differences.

[fleshwound]

Would it be ok to do 2 x 30% water changes a day?

[fleshwound]

He's not looking too good, I hope he survives, hes the best looking discus I have, and the funny thing is he was healthy and fine for the first few days

[fleshwound]

1 more post! before I can show you my video... wow

[fleshwound]

here check it out please let me know http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=orAo5hBHbl4

[Eddie]

Would it be ok to do 2 x 30% water changes a day?

Why can't you do more? Conserving water?

[fleshwound]

I can do more I just thought because I wasnt declorinating or aging my water (people apparently do it where I live in canada all the time) it would be less for them to have to adjust to, and its easier for me. Im still not sure whats wrong with him, did anyone see the video?

[Eddie]

I can do more I just thought because I wasnt declorinating or aging my water (people apparently do it where I live in canada all the time) it would be less for them to have to adjust to, and its easier for me. Im still not sure whats wrong with him, did anyone see the video?

Well, I would age the water if you have the means to, to match water parameters. Is there a reason you don't want to age?

[Eddie]

Just checked the video, looks like external parasite/protozoa. If he has it, they are all exposed to it. Let me do some more reviewing of your tank set-up and tank mates so that I could offer you better advice.

[fleshwound]

I plan on aging the water now. I just need a stand for my 75g and they are all going into that, bare bottom, as per everyones advice...

[fleshwound]

And what should I do if they are all exposed to it? Ive got rid ich plus should I dose the whole tank then?

[Eddie]

And what should I do if they are all exposed to it? Ive got rid ich plus should I dose the whole tank then?


I would but I would get your water changing routine down, to make things easier. Also, if you dose RI+, if there is a adverse reaction to the chemical, you will need to bust a huge water change. Just be prepared for whatever may occur. Having HUGE amounts of replacement water is always a plus!

Eddie

[flyman767]

Just checked the video, looks like external parasite/protozoa. If he has it, they are all exposed to it. Let me do some more reviewing of your tank set-up and tank mates so that I could offer you better advice.
Eddie..The fact that the op does not use a dechlorinator and after watching the video...does this not have the appearance of toxic poisoning(etc..rapid breathing, erratic swimming)?

[Altum Nut]

And what should I do if they are all exposed to it? Ive got rid ich plus should I dose the whole tank then?

Hey fieshwound,

By some chance...is this your video...http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5PD_o1g9AJo&NR=1
And if so, is it the same tank you put the new fish in.
Just trying to narrow down possible causes.

...Ralph

[Eddie]

Eddie..The fact that the op does not use a dechlorinator and after watching the video...does this not have the appearance of toxic poisoning(etc..rapid breathing, erratic swimming)?

It would but all the fish would show symptoms. It may be that the lack of dechlor is bringing them down one by one.

Not using a dechlor is like throwing fish in the garbage disposal.

[mikel]

When a fish has clamped gills, it means either it has fluke infestation, or its gills are very stressed by something bothering them in the water. If you do not use any sort of water conditioner like prime, then that is the source of stress. It doesnt look very encouraging for your fish, but you may still save the rest. You need to get Prime or something similar for them.