frogbit

[zchauvin]

Will it grow under marineland double led lights? Been wanting to put some in my 75g but don't want bright lights. Any suggestions/ideas?

[zchauvin]

Anyone?

[lizziotti]

Its growing fine in mine and I have the same lights.

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[zchauvin]

Awesome thanks

[farebox]

Awesome thanks

Just put some in my 125GA tank/low lights, so far so good.
farebox

[Darrell Ward]

I have found out recently that there are several varieties of frogbit that originated in different places. Some seem to do fine under lower lighting, but some will start to yellow and slowly melt away. It's a crap shoot, because they all look the same, and generally only go by the name frogbit, or amazon frogbit.

[zchauvin]

ehh, and im not experienced enough to know. I dont want to buy a bunch and then they die in a week...

[Darrell Ward]

You could use duckweed instead. Much smaller leaves, but looks natural, and is practically indestructible. I've had it spread in tanks with only a single florescent bulb.

[zchauvin]

Put a whole bag in there last week, its all gone... idk where but its just gone. Also the roots of frogbit is so appealing to me.

[Discus-n00b]

I had the same issue with my frogbit, just disappeared. The only 2 conclusions I could come to is either my Festivums had a snack or the current on top of the water was to strong for it. Otherwise I have no idea.

[zchauvin]

I had the same issue with my frogbit, just disappeared. The only 2 conclusions I could come to is either my Festivums had a snack or the current on top of the water was to strong for it. Otherwise I have no idea.

Duckweed or frogbit Matt?

[Darrell Ward]

Perhaps it was sucked up by filtration? LOL! You may find it problematic trying to grow much of anything in a dimly lit tank. Since discus tanks should essentially nutrient poor anyway, it can really compound the problem. Perhaps it would be better to just add lots of wood and roots, stain the water with tannins, and call it a day. You could always get some potted philodendron that could sit outside the tank, and allow the runners to trail into the tank for some "green" effect. That's a genuine "old school" discus tank trick. :D

[zchauvin]

Lol ill have to look into that darrell, afterall the tanks I see with frogbit growing good or only dim because the 150w halogen is well, getting stopped by floating plants...:)

[Darrell Ward]

I think sometimes fish are responsible for floating plant damage. I have caught my wild discus picking at the floating roots on more than one occasion. Perhaps they were picking at tiny pieces of food caught in the roots, I don't know, but damage the roots, the plant goes away.

[m.ingram]

When i first got my frogbit it started to die off quite quickly ,so i started using seachem flourish and its turned the corner . Its now starting to multiply .

[Discus-n00b]

Duckweed or frogbit Matt?

Frogbit

[zchauvin]

Ehh alright, I may end up having to use something else that will grow in 16w light :)

[Darrell Ward]

Personally, I think you should sell that light, and get a 70 watt metal halide to hang over it. You only need one. http://www.hellolights.com/70w-retrofitkithqi.aspx You'll still get shadows and shimmer, plus you'll be able to grow the floating plants you want. Use a 6500K bulb like this: http://www.lightexports.com/servlet/the-662/70W-70-watt-6500K/Detail It's what I use on my 75 gal, 150 gal, and my 240 gal. tank. On the 240 gal, I use 2 because of the extra length of the tank. At only 70 watts, it's not intense at all, allows you to grow low light, or floating plants, and most importantly, allows you to actually see your fish.

[zchauvin]

Only problem with that is the tank is in the living room with a 14 foot cathedral ceiling over top :( Id have to rig up something like what matt has I suppose. Does this one include the "sunrise" effect as well? Lol maybe I should check out link before asking questions. :)

[NeonFlux]

A good steady supply of NPK and trace with a lot of light will help it flourish easily. :)

[zchauvin]

P.S. annndd a deer mount right over tank... Yikes. If I did succesfully hand mh it would be around a foot off top of tank.

[Darrell Ward]

That's about where I run mine, 8" to 12" above the tank. It's pretty easy to hang the light off the stand, or wall with some metal conduit. The reflector is made of aluminum, and very lightweight. The heaviest part of the whole fixture is the protective glass, so it's a breeze to put it where you need it. The ballast can be mounted in the cabinet out of sight.

[zchauvin]

Good deal, do you know of any that don't cost an arm and a leg that could hook onto back of tank?? Would be much easier on me. I saw one on YouTube on a guys altum biotope and it a had a sunrise effect where the blue was on all night and then the white came on slowly getting brighter and brighter. Made for a very very realistic setting.

[Darrell Ward]

No, not really. The fancier they get, the more they cost. A metal halide light first comes on emitting no light at all. As it starts to warm up, it slowly gets brighter until it fully warms up to operating temp. It takes a few minutes, so really it has "sunrise" built in. Add a few LEDs from Ebay or whatever if you want moonlights. The fish don't care either way. Moonlights are only useful if you keep corals, or for the humans. My lights are on timers, and I rarely ever see them turn on anyhow. :D

[zchauvin]

Lol I see, and yeah I found one on Google. It's so perfect, has every little thing. Dimmer, set to rotate with moon has a .5-6 hour sunrise sunset timer. Ridiculous. If I had an extra 1500 I would get it. Deff not any time soon lol I'm 18 and in school part time. Maybe when I have own place but for now the strip and no plants will have to do :)

[zchauvin]

Can't get link but Google " metal halide sunrise effect" fifth choice down its a pdf.... take a look and tell me that's not ridiculous.

[Apistomaster]

My attempts to try growing Frogbit went very similar to what Darrel described.
I use Ceratophyllum demersum(Tropical Hornwort or Najas gualelupensis(Guppy Grass) the most. They both grow with minimal lighting of about the equivalent of what Darrel uses. Both plants grow well just below the surface and do best with more light but both are adaptable enough to grow under many different types and watts of lights.
If you supply a bit more light some Salvinia species grow well and look much neater than Frogbit. Their leaves grow above the water line and their roots are long and produce plenty of cover or hiding places for smaller fishes or shrimp. Salvinia usually grows well under the same lighting as most Frogbit. It looks much nicer in my opinion than Frogbit.

I am at constant war with Duckweed and would not wish it on my worst enemy.

[zchauvin]

Well I'm in process of finding a 150w mh to trade for 36" coralife strip and marineland double led 48". I guess... lol I don't need those and want a mh. If I can find one ill take a look at the species you just mentioned.

[ericatdallas]

The heaviest part of the whole fixture is the protective glass, so it's a breeze to put it where you need it. The ballast can be mounted in the cabinet out of sight.

If you're going to hang it that high, do you even need a protective glass? The fish aren't likely to be able to launch themselves 10" are they? I imagine it's to protect the bulbs from water, but that's probably not likely. If anything did get that high, it would be minimal and have no impact.

[Darrell Ward]

If you're going to hang it that high, do you even need a protective glass? The fish aren't likely to be able to launch themselves 10" are they? I imagine it's to protect the bulbs from water, but that's probably not likely. If anything did get that high, it would be minimal and have no impact.

Well, they say the glass acts as a UV shield for the bare, double ended bulbs. In fact, it's not recommended to run them without it.

[Discus-n00b]

I would run it with shield. If anything, being up that high its going to hit your eyes, some UV protection would be nice. Keep in mind MH's get HOT...not only just the tank (if its hung low enough to effect water temp) its going to heat up your room a lot, be sure you have enough ventilation. Somedays I couldn't even stand to be in the room my 250w halide was in. Really glad thats gone, really glad I went straight LEDs.

[zchauvin]

Well what do you all suggest would be best??

[Darrell Ward]

I would run it with shield. If anything, being up that high its going to hit your eyes, some UV protection would be nice. Keep in mind MH's get HOT...not only just the tank (if its hung low enough to effect water temp) its going to heat up your room a lot, be sure you have enough ventilation. Somedays I couldn't even stand to be in the room my 250w halide was in. Really glad thats gone, really glad I went straight LEDs.

LOL! I'll bet it was hot. A 250 watt lamp of almost any type would put out some serious heat. That's a lot of "juice". Fortunately, the 70 watters I'm using don't really put out any more heat than the compact florescent fixtures I used before. If it did, I'm sure I would have noticed, since one of the tanks is in the bedroom. I think the LEDs are cool on some tanks, but you need whole banks of them to put out any decent light from what I've seen, and they are expensive, unless you spend hours DIY with a soldering iron. MH gives a lot for the buck, easy, and cheap. You do however have to be careful not to overdo it on freshwater. It is intense lighting, and you need far fewer watts with MH than you would with florescent for the same effect. Many people just don't understand this for some reason, use too many watts, the wrong bulbs, and generalize "MH don't work on freshwater".

[zchauvin]

Well I'm gunna go to lfs tomorrow for my male gbr and they have two 150w mh used for 200 I think, ill try and trade for my two strips.