How to properly cycle a tank before buying discus

[laupao]

Hello Everyone,

I want to know how I can properly cycle a 55 gallon tank before I go ahead and buy my discus. I'm already running the HOB filter, sponge filter hooked up to an air pump, heater at 82 degrees. Should I buy some bacteria additives and add it in there and run the tank for 2 weeks?

I just want to hear how you guys in the forum do it. I'm sure there is a few ways to go about it.

Please help and thanks everyone

[ericatdallas]

What are you suing to feed the bacteria?

[Latro]

What I've read on here has pretty much universally debunked the use of the bacterial additives. What seems to work best is to get some straight household ammonia (careful to ensure it doesn't have anything else in it), and add it to the tank until you get a reading of 4 ppm on a test kit. (If my math is correct this takes about 0.16 mL/gallon with 10% ammonia, so only about 9 mL for an entire tank; this is about 2 teaspoons). Then check on it periodically and add ammonia as needed to maintain 4 ppm. Top the water off as it lowers and do some WCs, perhaps one a week or so; this is just because ammonia degradation plunges the pH, which can eventually cripple the bacteria. When the ammonia goes from 4 ppm to 0 ppm in 24 hours you are done.

I have not actually done this, however; I used decaying food as my ammonia source.

[Chunks]

What I've read on here has pretty much universally debunked the use of the bacterial additives. What seems to work best is to get some straight household ammonia (careful to ensure it doesn't have anything else in it), and add it to the tank until you get a reading of 4 ppm on a test kit. (If my math is correct this takes about 0.16 mL/gallon with 10% ammonia, so only about 9 mL for an entire tank; this is about 2 teaspoons). Then check on it periodically and add ammonia as needed to maintain 4 ppm. Top the water off as it lowers and do some WCs, perhaps one a week or so; this is just because ammonia degradation plunges the pH, which can eventually cripple the bacteria. When the ammonia goes from 4 ppm to 0 ppm in 24 hours you are done.

I have not actually done this, however; I used decaying food as my ammonia source.

Thanks Latro I will be following this to the T before I get my discus.

[discuspaul]

Just as a check to be satisfied you're proceeding properly with your fishless cycle, you may wish to refer to the "Cycling your Aquarium" section in my Guide - link:
www.forum.simplydiscus.com/showthread.php?86009-Beginner-s-Guide-to-Getting-Started-wth-Discus

And if you notice your pH reducing below 7.0 during your cycle (which could slow down or even stall your cycle), add a little baking soda in increments to get, and keep, the pH above 7.5 if you can. That could reduce your entire cycle time by a week or more.

[laupao]

I read more about the fishless cycle. I understand it more now. However, I still have have some confusion. You are telling me that by natuere that the beneficial bacteria will just appear in the tank water when I following the steps of adding ammonia to 5ppm?

I was actually thinking of purchasing Seachem Stability for the benefical bateria. But from what I've read so far, no one mentions about using it. Then why is it being sold in a bottle. I just want to understand this a bit more.

any advice would be appreciated

[Sean Buehrle]

I read more about the fishless cycle. I understand it more now. However, I still have have some confusion. You are telling me that by natuere that the beneficial bacteria will just appear in the tank water when I following the steps of adding ammonia to 5ppm?

I was actually thinking of purchasing Seachem Stability for the benefical bateria. But from what I've read so far, no one mentions about using it. Then why is it being sold in a bottle. I just want to understand this a bit more.

any advice would be appreciated

Yes the bacteria is in the air and will grow by itself in your tank. There is really no need to buy bacteria in a bottle.

Its really up in the air about bacteria in a bottle. I think its total bolongna.

I want someone to tell me how a sponge filter or canister filter will go bad and have to be recycled of it goes a couple days without oxygen but they can stick it in a bottle for months on end with no oxygen and its alive, bullcrap I say.

Ive even done multiple tanks some with bacteria in a bottle and some without, there was no difference in the time it took to cycle.

Up to you, I would save my cash, buy a sponge filter instead.
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[jimg]

I do fish less cycles with ace hardware ammonia. ime no need to go as high as 4ppm, I do it with .50 to 1+-.
If you don't want to wait 6 weeks you can try dr timms one and only or tetra safestart. They are the same product and the only ones that do actually work most of the time. But you have to keep it fed too.

[laupao]

thanks everyone for their information. if you have finsished cycling, all of the levels have risen and fallen and you are about to do your water change and the next day you are going to get your fish, how do you keep the good bacteria alive between the water change ( about 70% ) and getting the fish???

[discuspaul]

Most, if not all, of the bacteria should survive without problem on an overnite basis until you introduce your fish. However, just to be on the safe side, you could add a small amount of ammonia after your water change ( say 1/2 of what you would normally use) the evening before you will be getting the fish. It will certainly be consumed in 12 hours if you've completed the entire cycle as necessary.

[laupao]

Thanks for the info. When I do that 70% water change, Can i use prime (water conditioner) or cannot until after the fact I have the fishes?

[discuspaul]

Use the Prime.

[laupao]

Thanks for the info. I went to Food Basics, PathMark, Lowes, KMart and cannot locate pure ammonia. All the ones I saw have surfactants or is colored.

Where can I purchase them? Someone on this post mentioned ACE, but there isn't really around me.

[Skip]

any grocery store

[x2h]

throw a piece of shrimp in there and you get ammonia. :D

[discuspaul]

any grocery store

Yes, even if it's only a 10% concentration with water, as long as it doesn't have anything else in it.

[ericatdallas]

You could also use plant fertilizer at home depot. It has urea and ammonium nitrate.

[ericatdallas]

pee in your fish tank :)

[Melissa]

Just a note even though you have clearly decided to use ammonia... More for anyone else reading this thread trying to decide how to do a fishless cycle.

I would steer clear of using decaying food and other crap to cycle a tank.. It sets the stage for the wrong kind of yuckies to develop and thrive. A dirty tank can grow more than just the type of bacteria used in the nitrogen cycle :P

[Melissa]

Eric- you're so gross LOL

I would be so grossed out to change the water, I'd have to wear gloves if there was urine in my fish tank... *cringe*

[CajunAg]

Ace Hardware Ammonia + Seachem Stability had my tank cycled in 3 weeks, starting from scratch. Try looking for the pure ammonia at a janitor/bar supply store too. And here's a nice calculator for how much to add: http://www.tropicalfishforums.co.uk/files/ammoniaCalculator.php

[ericatdallas]

Eric- you're so gross LOL

I would be so grossed out to change the water, I'd have to wear gloves if there was urine in my fish tank... *cringe*

Darn, I was going to market my urine as the natural way to do a fishless cycle. "Eric's Organic Aquarium Starter" made from all natural ingredients. Guess you're not going to be a customer :(

[Skip]

eric.. if i get a chance.. i will pee in your tank, when your not looking!

[ericatdallas]

eric.. if i get a chance.. i will pee in your tank, when your not looking!

that's so thoughtful skip, but my tank is already cycled. I heard you were looking to setup another one for that group order from Kenny right? I'll give you a free sample ;)

[Chunks]

that's so thoughtful skip, but my tank is already cycled. I heard you were looking to setup another one for that group order from Kenny right? I'll give you a free sample ;)

Haha this is too funny!

[DiscusLoverJeff]

Is it not true that you can cycle a new setup with used water from an established aquarium? I used 30 gallons from my planted 90 gallon tank once during a water change (without debree) and in less than a week all parameters were perfect for fish. Once I introduced the Rams, they were fine.

[Sean Buehrle]

Is it not true that you can cycle a new setup with used water from an established aquarium? I used 30 gallons from my planted 90 gallon tank once during a water change (without debree) and in less than a week all parameters were perfect for fish. Once I introduced the Rams, they were fine.

If your going to do that you might as well just put a filter in the established aquarium and let it seed itself.
But yes the water would most likely be rich in biological organisms that would seed the tank. You could go one step further and scrape a filter and just drop it in the tank.

All this talk of using water or a cycled filter from an existing tank totally blows the idea of quarantine though.

I'm a firm believer in quarantine and would never do it.


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