Why is my tank always such a mess?

[Maria Ashton]

I have a 450L or 117G planted tank with 13 discus of various sizes. I do water changes every couple of days but I am battling cynobacteria and there always seems to be a brown residue on the plants, and small bits floating around. I regularly wipe down the wood and the glass and clean the gravel as best I can but it never seems to stay clean for more than a couple of days. Anyone have any ideas?

[Sean Buehrle]

It's because of all the waste produced by 13 fish.
That's alot of fish poop, even for a tank that size.
Test your water for nitrate before your next water change and you'll get an idea what's adding to all the brown algae. It could be a combination of things, your tap water, your sand, your wood, all of them can feed the brown stuff that's growing so fast.
What amount of water are you changing in the tank?

[pcsb23]

BGA or cyanobacteria is always found in tanks with low nitrates and high organics. The brown stuff is usually an indication of too high phosphates or more usually ime silicates and is often a symptom of new tanks. Brown algae is relatively easy to deal with and often goes on it's own, oto's love the stuff.

BGA on the other hand is a nightmare. It can be treated with antibiotics (it is a bacterium) such as erythromycin, but usually a better wya is to reduce the organics (more water changes or better gunk removal) and believe it or not add nitrates, usually up to 30ppm for a week or two will knock it back. BGA can fix nitrogen from the environment. I am not sure why adding nates works, but it does. If it is any consolation I have BGA in my altums tank and am adding nates now.

[Maria Ashton]

It's because of all the waste produced by 13 fish.
That's alot of fish poop, even for a tank that size.
Test your water for nitrate before your next water change and you'll get an idea what's adding to all the brown algae. It could be a combination of things, your tap water, your sand, your wood, all of them can feed the brown stuff that's growing so fast.
What amount of water are you changing in the tank?

Thanks I thought it might be the number of fish, I also have 10 corydora, three small plecos, 10 neons and 2 baby angelfish. Five of the discus are adults and the rest are catching up fast. I guess its time to move some.
What should I be looking for re the water? I test the source and the tank before and after a change. Readings on the tank are normally as follows:
Nitrates 25
Nitrites 0
GH below 7
KH 6d
ph 7
CL2 0

Today the nitrates shot up to 50 and I have no idea why, I did a 45% WC and they are down, am withholding food until this evening also.

I normally do wc every 3 or 4 days around 30%, but sometimes its more frequent and greater volume of water.

[Maria Ashton]

@ Paul
Thanks, bit reluctant to put an antibiotic in, just got the bio filter back after a series of disasters.

I do feed beef-heart and mysis, the discus wont touch flake or granules

[walt3]

sounds like you need bigger and more frequent wc.

[Maria Ashton]

sounds like you need bigger and more frequent wc.

yeah am afraid of that, I have three under fives too, one of whom needs extra attention. I think I will reduce the number of fish to see if it helps, if not I might have to take a break from the hobby for a bit

[pcsb23]

Thanks I thought it might be the number of fish, I also have 10 corydora, three small plecos, 10 neons and 2 baby angelfish. Five of the discus are adults and the rest are catching up fast. I guess its time to move some.
What should I be looking for re the water? I test the source and the tank before and after a change. Readings on the tank are normally as follows:
Nitrates 25
Nitrites 0
GH below 7
KH 6d
ph 7
CL2 0

Today the nitrates shot up to 50 and I have no idea why, I did a 45% WC and they are down, am withholding food until this evening also.

I normally do wc every 3 or 4 days around 30%, but sometimes its more frequent and greater volume of water.Given your level of Nitrates then it is likely the organic load, either more water changes or less fish (or a combo of both!!). Out of curiosity what lighting do you have over this tank and how long is it on for?

[Maria Ashton]

Given your level of Nitrates then it is likely the organic load, either more water changes or less fish (or a combo of both!!). Out of curiosity what lighting do you have over this tank and how long is it on for?

I am not sure, I am a Brit in Holland, my husband bought this tank and its occupants second hand so I dont know too much about it. I will say there were more fish in it, I have re-homed about 10 plecos and some tetras. Anyway re lighting, there are four fluorescent tubes two pinkish two white and they are on about 16 hours, I want to change the tubes as I think the white is too harsh for the fish. I am guessing you are going to say dont have the lights on for so long each day?

Thanks for your help
Maria

[pcsb23]

... I am guessing you are going to say dont have the lights on for so long each day?

Thanks for your help
Mariahehe, yep you guessed right. I'd consider halving that, but no more than 10 hours.

[jimg]

I have had that. the only way I got rid of it was with erthromycin. Though I never tried raising the nitrate. once the tank got established it never came back

[Maria Ashton]

That is very interesting, given that I have brown algae at the moment - thanks Jim

[jimg]

That is very interesting, given that I have brown algae at the moment - thanks Jim
I am not meaning the normal brown diatom algae. I am relating what I had to the cyanocbacter you mentioned. the stuff I had was a mat type greenish color, hard to tell from some algae. I agree with the lights and phospahtes if it is brown diatoms.

[Maria Ashton]

I have both, the cyanobacteria is very dark green, pungent and comes away easily. The brown algae does not simply wipe off.

[jimg]

I have both, the cyanobacteria is very dark green, pungent and comes away easily. The brown algae does not simply wipe off.

I remember the cyanobacter everyone said it slimey and stinks if not it's algae. I tried sae,shrimp otos etc they wouldn't touch it so I tried erythromycin and in one day it was clear, but it will effect the bio. I took filters off, put them on another tank then put them back. i'm sure there is a chance that some is in the filter but it didn't come back for me.

[x2h]

grwo a whole bunch of plants like the easy one such as swords. they should look dense. you will also need bigger and more frequent WC before the plants take hold of the tank. increase the surface agitation by aiming your filter outlet at the surface. Good luck!

[mlw]

I also have a planted tank. What I did to combat the algae problem is use my HOT magnum filter with a power clean siphon. You can make a canister vacuum cleaner so to speak (same concept) attache the hose of your python to your canister and syphon the gravel immediately after you feed your fish to remove any uneaten food and poo droppings that may be expelled while they are eating.

I fill my hot magnum (or your canister) with filter fiber and vacuum the gravel well.

It has helped keep the algae at bay and has reduced the number of water changes I need to make from every other day to once a week). The filter does not stay connected to the tankit is used strictly as a vacuum cleaner then I clean it out and use it the next day.
It seems like alot of work but it keeps my tank clean, the fish seem happy and there is minimal algae.

I have used a squirt or two of peroxide on cyano while I am removing the water. I have gotten good results with this in my small betta tank. Just don't use your de-chlorinator until you have added the water back. My experience was Prime and peroxide is it made a nasty concoction that wiped out my lemon tetras that swam through the area I treated with peroxide.

[Maria Ashton]

grwo a whole bunch of plants like the easy one such as swords. they should look dense. you will also need bigger and more frequent WC before the plants take hold of the tank. increase the surface agitation by aiming your filter outlet at the surface. Good luck!

Thanks, I have a few swords on the go along with some fast growing plants which I will remove once the swords are established. I see so many heavily planted aquariums which I would love to do but I havent quite got the balance right with feeding and population and am considering potting my plants and removing the substrate altogether.

[Maria Ashton]

I also have a planted tank. What I did to combat the algae problem is use my HOT magnum filter with a power clean siphon. You can make a canister vacuum cleaner so to speak (same concept) attache the hose of your python to your canister and syphon the gravel immediately after you feed your fish to remove any uneaten food and poo droppings that may be expelled while they are eating.

I fill my hot magnum (or your canister) with filter fiber and vacuum the gravel well.

It has helped keep the algae at bay and has reduced the number of water changes I need to make from every other day to once a week). The filter does not stay connected to the tankit is used strictly as a vacuum cleaner then I clean it out and use it the next day.
It seems like alot of work but it keeps my tank clean, the fish seem happy and there is minimal algae.

I have used a squirt or two of peroxide on cyano while I am removing the water. I have gotten good results with this in my small betta tank. Just don't use your de-chlorinator until you have added the water back. My experience was Prime and peroxide is it made a nasty concoction that wiped out my lemon tetras that swam through the area I treated with peroxide. Thanks I will look into this. I read about hydrogen peroxide for cyano but have been a bit scared to use it. I love your quote btw, I have a stunted adult and a runt who I am sure will be stunted if I can not resolve the bullying.