anyone a dripper

[Bud]

does anyone drip ro and waste water straight into their main tank with an overflow?I want to test water perameters in a barrel to find the sweet spot tds ratio and to keep ph stable.Or is it better to just drill my tank(I do have an overflow,and always thought drilling weakens)?My water also gasses off more than 1 ph,do I really need to age or will the constant drip be stable enough?I will have sponge filters,but if it affects this Ill exclude them.Some experience would greatly be appreciated.
Thanx,Buddy

[Discoholic]

I have a have drip system with both the ro and the waste water. I run both of them straight in to the separate sumps. I have used overflows, but much prefer a drilled set up because you don't have to worry about the risk of overflowing (I've done that way too many times). You will want to use your sponge filters for sure, they will help stabilize the water by harboring the nitrobacter spp. and other organisms that break down the ammonia to nitrites and the nitrites to nitrates. There is a thread somewhere here on SD about using pure ro water and other peoples experience with it.

[Bud]

Thanx,I know your water perams are diff than mine but does your ph rise upon aging and whats your waste to pure water ratio?(curious)I do have a couple hob ac 110s,and was thinking of using subsrate(should I still use the sponges if I go that route).My 125 is only a yr old and Im afraid to drill but I see its the only safe choice.Anyone think it would weaken a 125 tank?I read the threads untill my eyes and head ache....then I just start askin :).Thank the lord for the intelligent,helpful members on here!!!!!!!!!!

[Darrell Ward]

I've done drip systems in the past, and it's not a very efficient way at all to exchange water. The water is constantaly being mixed, so in the end, only a small percentage of water has actually been changed. Over time, water quality will slowly degrade without additional large scale water changes, so why bother?

[Moon]

I have a drip system for my 20 tanks in the fish room. All the tanks are drilled for the overflow. The drip is set to turn over every tank 100% in a 24 hour period. Yes, there will be some mixing. But most of the water will be removed and replaced with fresh water. I am on a well. So don't have to pay for water

[ericatdallas]

I think the drip system makes a lot of sense if you have RO and you're using the reject/waste water as the 'freshwater' input to a tank. Not sure which fish will best utilize this though and I can't remember which SD member (recently) mentioned they use this water for their blackworm keeper (great idea I think!) since the water goes to waste anyway and keeps their worms fresh. Or a growout tank.

[Bud]

Yes Darrel Ive read that also,so I could drip and just change large volumes less frequently?(just looking for a little less constant changes).I dont pay for my water either moon so Im looking into a smarter not harder method.How fast does your water degrade?

[Darrell Ward]

When people say they exchange 100% of their water every day doing drip, they are not doing that at all. That would only be true if all the water were drained and then the tank refilled. Otherwise, only a percentage is constantly being mixed and exchanged with each equal amount of water. In reality, only a partial water change occurs each day, no matter the gpm of drip. Long term, this will mean water quality slowly degrades over time unless regular water changes are also performed. With drip, dissolved organics are never removed wholesale as with a large water change, only diluted, so they can build up. Kinda of defeats the purpose of having drip in the first place. This is why I gave up on it years ago. It should be noted that the math would change if water flowed freely into the tank from an open pipe, with an open drain in the tank, but that's really not practical.

[ericatdallas]

+1 to what Darrell said. Your turnover 'rate' would have to be much greater than just 100% to make it worthwhile and then you're just wasting a ton of water. The plumbing requirements to make such a system would be better invested in making 'easy' large water changes each day.

Also, unlike large water changes, you can't do it and remove large pieces of junk at the same time via siphon.

For a while I was doing 3 daily water changes a day of 25-33%, then did two 50% WC, and some of the experienced members pointed out I was better doing on big 100% WC once per day. I ran the numbers and they were spot on about it. This is one scenario where the math and the experience agree completely.

I think a drip system can still be a good thing if you have a 'display' tank and you have to travel a lot or something but still want to enjoy the hobby. Just make sure to include a 'flush' option to do large WC and maybe consider doing 200-300% daily turnover (if not more) depending on your bio-load.

I'm not at the computer with the info right now, but I've done the spreadsheet and posted it on here before for drip systems and small PWC and how it wasn't as good as one big large WC per day.

[Bud]

Ya I think Ive ran across your info Eric.I accually run 90 gals of aged water daily through my 75 in my bedroom,but im looking to relocate to living room to a 125,these fish I now believe are adults and shouldnt need massive changes and Ill be gettting RO also.Guesss it is seeming inpractical for drip like you guys are sayin.Guess Im gonna have to further automate my aging barrel.

[Darrell Ward]

With good filtration, 2, 50% water changes per week is fine on most larger discus tanks not overstocked containing adults. I've been doing this on larger tanks for years without problems. You could even get away with once per week for adults if it were understocked, although I would suggest 2 for safety. Not a difficult job on a 125 gal. if you pump the water out, and into the tank. Only 30 minutes of your time at most.

[Moon]

Yes Darrel Ive read that also,so I could drip and just change large volumes less frequently?(just looking for a little less constant changes).I dont pay for my water either moon so Im looking into a smarter not harder method.How fast does your water degrade?

My system is about 2 years in operation and I've had no water quality issues. As I mentioned in my earlier post every tank turns over 100% every 24 hours.
I got fed up of changing water in 20 tanks every day. When WC becomes a chore and no longer enjoyable it is not a hobby. That's the reason I went to the drip system.

[Bud]

Yep,guess Im there bro.Just need to automate my storage tank and aquarium so either of my pumps dont run dry and turns my water on to my storage barrel.(sometimes multitask turns into singletask)haha

[Chicago Discus]

I don't save the water from my RO waste I'm wondering if it would good for grow out tanks....

[Bud]

Amen to that moon.I love these fish but I have many,many hobbies and a full time mason job,a young family,cars,motorcycles,other animals,take care of my mother,mother in-law,grandmother,seriously I could write a page on it!Im not whinin(well a little now)but I can see myself tryin the drip REAL soon!!!Just worrried about the health of fish.

[Bud]

I believe members on here claim to.Its filtrated more than tap,guess youd have to watch your tds.

[Chicago Discus]

I believe members on here claim to.Its filtrated more than tap,guess youd have to watch your tds.
Yea that's kinda what I'm afraid off I hate changing things that work........Josie

[JamesP]

I have used a drip system in the past and much prefer automating the water changes instead. I installed a 250 holding tank and plumbed fill lines over each 65 Gallon with individual valves. I installed bulk heads for overflow drains in the back of each tank with 2" drains. I also ran a separate drain line around the front of each tank with uprights between each tank for quick draining/vacuuming of each tank. I only need two hoses for vacuuming upper and lower set of tanks at the same time. The fill lines are run off of a 1090 gallon per hour pump. So I drain my first tank down and start filling while I move to the next tank. If I don't pay attention the overflow takes care of the overfilling. I can change 12 65's in less than 40 minutes with roughly a 35% water change. The drip couldn't keep up with the grow outs and the crowding that comes with that and the water never seemed to get clean enough. Not to mention the vacuuming requires replacing some water and using hoses anyways. I use large diameter siphon hoses to clean and drain very quickly. On smaller fish I drop the hose size to prevent the dreaded siphon suck. Lost a few small angels before changing that. The added benefit to this system is when I travel I just have my wife turn valves and push clean water in at a rapid rate to flush the tanks. The bulk head drains drain the excess. Not as good as a completed water change but better than nothing.
Next part of the system will be to plumb a thermostatic mixing valve to control inbound tap to correct temperature. That will allow the filling to be much more autmated.

[Moon]

I agree a drip system is not as good as a 100% WC. It's a compromise.The dissolved solids and nitrates are diluted. I'm happy with it and my fish are doing well. That's all that matters.

[Bud]

I here that,Im about to change my whole setup and its got me freakin out

[Moon]

Next part of the system will be to plumb a thermostatic mixing valve to control inbound tap to correct temperature. That will allow the filling to be much more autmated

You might try a shower control valve. Much cheaper.

[Chicago Discus]

Next part of the system will be to plumb a thermostatic mixing valve to control inbound tap to correct temperature. That will allow the filling to be much more autmated

You might try a shower control valve. Much cheaper.
Ok moon I'm flying you to Chicago that's perfect you can design my new fish room

[Bud]

Think Im goin to tear up a washer to make this thing more automated(and I just took a spare to the junkyard last month...figures)! :) nice setup too James(jealous)

[Bud]

wish I could my ph is 7 outta tap,8.3 after degassing:(

[Discoholic]

I don't have a set ratio for ro/wastewater. I shoot for the 50ppm to 80ppm tds range. I have a tds pen and I check it once or so a day. If the tds is below 50 or so, I just open a valve to allow some waste water into the sump. I let it run for an hour or two, let it circulate through the tanks and mix with the tank water and then check again after a couple hours or the next day. If you want to design a worry free drip system, I would recommend getting your hands on Timmons et al. "Recirculating aquaculture systems." The book is a little pricey, but very good information. I also have a bunch of pdf files that are publicated info on RAS systems. If you're interested send me a PM.

[Discoholic]

I don't save the water from my RO waste I'm wondering if it would good for grow out tanks....

It works well for me even with a TDS of ~500 and a pH of 8.2.


I agree a drip system is not as good as a 100% WC. It's a compromise.The dissolved solids and nitrates are diluted. I'm happy with it and my fish are doing well. That's all that matters.

+1. I work in a hatchery that has a recirculating system with just over 50,000 gallons. Changing 100% of that water at a time would be nearly impossible. Its a semi-closed system meaning that its identical in idea to a drip system. We exchange nearly 100% of it every 24 hours and the fish are happy and healthy and thats with a few over 150,000 4 inch fish in 50,000 gallons! The most important thing is a very efficient biofilter.

[Chicago Discus]

It works well for me even with a TDS of ~500 and a pH of 8.2.

I don't Gary that kinda scares me LOL

[Discoholic]

I don't Gary that kinda scares me LOL

of course i'm not keeping wilds, but the key is consistant water parameters.

[ericatdallas]

Think Im goin to tear up a washer to make this thing more automated(and I just took a spare to the junkyard last month...figures)! :) nice setup too James(jealous)

What else are you going to use? I bought a washer solenoid off eBay for like $8 -- I had to buy two, so it was more like $16 or around there. I'm not saying don't tear it up, just wondering what other useful parts I can repurpose if there are any...

It seems like you might be able to modify one to mix RO water or mix salt mix for a reef tank too but that seems like overkill.

It's on my long list of to-do's that I haven't gotten around to yet. But I'm thinking it might be possible to pulse the solenoid to control the temperature. I do like the mixing valve idea though, but I have a 'crude' method using a 'Y-splitter'. Basically, it's preset, so if I change my water heat settings or the temperature gets cold outside, I have to reset it. I hand test my water each time, but it does allow a certain level of consistency if things don't go too out of whack.

From the fall to winter temp change, I had to change it last week, and the temperature only drifted about 5 degrees out the tap, so nothing too crazy that would provide too much of a shock to the discus (for up to 70% or less WC - IMO). Although we hit another cold spell and I noticed last night the water was colder again --- so not a perfect system I admit but slightly better than adjusting the valves each WC.

[JamesP]

Thanks I will.

[Moon]

Ok moon I'm flying you to Chicago that's perfect you can design my new fish room
Happy to oblige Josie. You just have to hop across the border.

[Bud]

I think Ill take you up on that Gary thanx.And Eric do those solenoids sense water levels?Im gonna have to do some experiments when my other meter gets here cuz I dont know if my ph will still degas in the tank as much being diluted with ro water or if Im gonna be forced to age anyways...

[ericatdallas]

No they don't... you need a float switch for that. How do washing machines do it? I think they have overflows too, but I'm not too sure, never took apart of washer before.

[Bud]

Me neither,but you can select water level so I believe theres water level sensors in there.Either way Ill let ya know.

[Bud]

I do remember being on my old african site,and someone broke down the parts for members

[Bud]

Well there is a water level switch on them that has a pressure sensitive diaphram and a water inlet-thermistor assem. which has solenoids that open or close according to disired temp OR amount of water needed.But i dont know if theyre made with cemicals toxic to discus.

[JamesHe]

In theory,

If you change 20% by dripping, you only waster ~2% of new water

If you inject 100%, only 63% new water remains. if you inject 200%, 86% new water remains. if you inject 300%, 95% new water remains.

I did 20% RO WC daily with my P. Altum. waste of 2% is not big deal, and I get the benefit of no pH swing, no temp shock, no water level change. my Altum seems more happier.

I also use RO unit waste water for my black worm culture, but failed. so I change to use aged waste water.