Here are some pics I took from a local aquarium shop of their discus. Definitely a good example of what NOT to buy. Hope this helps - just keep in mind that it's very important to start off with good, healthy fish.
Walter
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Here are some pics I took from a local aquarium shop of their discus. Definitely a good example of what NOT to buy. Hope this helps - just keep in mind that it's very important to start off with good, healthy fish.
Walter
another photo.
this poor fish was actually even darker, but when I approached the tank, it lightened up just enough so you could see the striations.
I was trying to get a straight 'head on' photo to show the pinched forehead on these fish.
This fish has really bad shape and large eyes
large eyes and bad shape.
great pics to learn by Walter. thanks. The owner didnt mind you taking pics?
Need to point out that it's not the fault of the LFS - the domesticated discus they get in just aren't good (the wilds are okay). I've noticed that many shops get fancy pl*cos in bad shape too - sunken eyes and sunken stomaches. One store in the area actually told me to wait a month for cardinal tetras - they said they were holding several aside and whatever ones survived, I could get some from that bunch.
Walter
I think I know which store these fish came from. It's very sad to see them looking like that everytime I go to the store.
Great pix to learn from* for us beginners but those poor fish look so poorly, I just want to give them a good home and a decent feed. :( :(Quote:
Originally Posted by April
*Just a shame that a fish has to get into that state for us to take pix to learn what NOT to buy (if you get my drift) :( :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :(
Good pictures of what not to buy. Its sad to see discus in bad shape like
that.
Sean
Thanks for the pics. They are very good example of what not to buy.:(
Chris
Walter~
Thank you~ As sad as that is...very good to share! We have a lfs here, that has a few like that as well~but the ones here, are obviously not well, those didnt look sick? Just poor quality?
We should have a section named: What Not To Consider....
Marie~http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/36/36_7_9.gif
I'm surprised the store still display those fish. Fish like that will only scare the customers away.
GoheelHere is how I see it................Quote:
Fish like that will only scare the customers away.
I agree with what you said from your perspective.......but..............
More than likely the fish store owner knows he can still sell them or he wouldn't keep buying them selling them.
The lack of care comes down to money. Consumer isn't educated so why spend the time caring for them when they buy anyways is a lot of corporate attitudes.
Or...........
They don't have a clue what one is to look like in the first place. Not talking about the fish in this thread with short gill plate.
Wouldn't it be cool if the hobbyist around these stores which are in every city in the US start selling them decent stock instead of dropping off their culls?
At least then it would definetly be the Owners fault for lack of training for his employees.
The fish displayed would have a chance.
You see on the news people getting busted for dogs or horses starving to death or body in terrible shape yet these LFS get away with it with Discus all the time.
I know I'm not buying any discus from that store. I think they just have bad water or something, because I saw the pigeon blood when it's first arrived. It looked pretty good, but 2 weeks later, it looked a whole lot worse. The discus price at that store was ridiculous too. Small 2.5 inch fish for $50-60.
thats sad, really
if that was local to me, i'd speak to the owner and see if maybe he would let me make "a project" of them, they arent long for the world otherwise i dont think. they may be too far gone, dunno. sad
that's a good idea, too bad I don't have any tank space. I wonder if they're saveable though.Quote:
Originally Posted by Timbo
for the most part..id say they are too far gone. im sure they arent eating..and have hex..and possibly even capillaria . if someone does buy them..then they made a sale and it goes on and on.
kinda like the puppies in the lps.. people buy them to give them a home..and they are quickly replaced.
awhile back.Brew and others printed out a care sheet on simply that could be photocopied and given to the local fish stores.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greg Richardson
People do that? They drop off their culls? Why would they do that? How do you know they do that, Greg? I'm guessing cuz there are so many less than desirable fish in lfs...... Arent culls suppose to be culled? Or am i just an idiot here?? http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/36/36_11_7.gif
Marie~
Poor little guys:cry: It's so sad to see them like that.
From my experience, fish stores ask for the culls at a reduced price because (they say) the buyer doesn't know any better and pays top dollar for them. I have been asked to supply certain stores with 'culls' -- which, I won't even send my culls there.
I have told some fish store managers exactly how to treat some of their sick fish, they say they can't be bothered. D...n.... one local store WON'T EVEN FEED THEM!!!! The employees are not allowed to feed the discus! Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr
Barb
I bought some fancy goldfish from this store, but I don't think I'll ever buy discus from there.
Something I've wondered about...a lot of fish stores seem to be on centralized filtration. Do pet shops have a separate water circuit for discus tanks so they can be kept at higher temp, or do the discus just have to deal with cold water on top of everything else? Also, does anyone know whether shops typically use UV or other sterilizers, or do the fish all share the same bacteria, parasites, etc.?
Marie.Quote:
People do that? They drop off their culls? Why would they do that? How do you know they do that, Greg? I'm guessing cuz there are so many less than desirable fish in lfs
I've read about it. I myself have traded some fish for food that didn't grow out as well as I thought they would at one place. Heck those two fish were better than 95% of their stock.
That statement really can't be a general statement because some LFS actually try to get good stock.
I just think it would really help the hobby if hobbyist started supplying the stores with some good stock.
Up the bar.
When I breed, I may do that. At least maybe get them to purchase some high quality and make sure they understand taking care of them. I already know the fish managers at 2 petcos in my area. They have put alot of money into their aquarium and fish area and they are ready to purchase some when I get some. Some lfs's that are decent will also get a few. I will only start out with a few and see how they work out in their tanks. Yes I believe they have cental filtration which isnt good for discus. Maybe I can get them to set up just discus tanks as their displays. Right now they have just some gold fish and rainbows in their front 4 tanks as display that arent on central.
well..one lfs here..showed my his pricelist. different lfs get from different sources. some self import..but be sure they arent paying high price for grade A. and lets face it..why would a big hatchery send their best fish to lfs? their very best fish go to japan etc..and people who will be good customers etc.
some..get from brokers. brokers collect grade B fish from breeders..and have holding tanks and distribute. most breeders sell their best fry from each batch to people on forums etc..or hand picking..and shipping. grade B go to wholesalers. then they sell to lfs. anyhow..i was suggesting this one lfs got from some breeder in united states. so he showed me the price list. 90 cents for a cobalt. etc etc.
wilds..8.00 each .
my lfs had separate filters for their discus..of course..there are some lfs im sure who know discus and do good by them.
we;ve had lots of discus enthusiasts try to help lfs save sick discus. they know tropical fish..and find it hard to listen to someone coming in the door and telling them how to do their job. resentment.. which can be understood.
if someone came in and told me how to groom a dog..im sure i would have a bit of a hard time swallowing it..as i feel i know my job. : )
.
that would depend on what the dog looked like after the grooming i'd think. if you messed it up and the dog looked gross, you wouldnt expect a paying customer to say something? and what they are doing to those fish isnt just a bad haircut either, really..its life-threatening.Quote:
Originally Posted by April
I wouldnt hesitate to do what Barb did either if I saw discus being treated like the ones in this thread. Morally, i couldnt, i'd just have to say something, try to help anyway...and i wouldnt care if they found it "hard to listen to" :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Barb Newell
Quote:
if someone came in and told me how to groom a dog..im sure i would have a bit of a hard time swallowing it..as i feel i know my job. : )
Your dogs look great.
Their Fish suck.
I agree some resentment, but the FACTS are right there in front of their face.
Maybe they get mad, whatever, but I bet it makes them think.
And just maybe some of them do something about it.
BTW. How in the heck after shipping, food, labor can ya sell a discus for .90 I'll never understand.
I know labor cheap, food bought bulk, quanity shipped, but still.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greg Richardson
I would like to ask them how they justify that ? How do they come up with such an amount?
wow~http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/36/36_11_1.gif
Marie~
Hi Walter,
How have you been? Great photos and just the kind of stuff we hope to address in the upcoming new section. The section on educational grading of fish will be on line shortly. We'll move this to that section once its set up.
thanks,
-al
Nice article Walter!
Sorry if this is a dumb question... but, what does the pinched forhead mean? That they might have flagelettes and aren't eating? I have seen alot of little guys with pinched forheads. Is there anyway, or any treatment to help get rid of that?
What gets me is that when you say you go online and are using the advice found there, they always say that you can't trust what you find online!!! EEESH!! I would take your guys advice any day, especially over theirs!!!
Candy
When I see fish like that, I stear clear of any and all fish from the place, even the healthy looking ones since they may carry the bug (from nets, filtration system, peoples hands going from tank to tank, etc.). The LFS in my area told me they only feed their juvie discus 1x a day (and then I see them feeding live brine shrimp)! No wonder they don't grow :(.
I've also seen really healthy looking babies arrive at a LFS and then slowly deteriorate to what those pictures look like when in quarantine at the store :(.
Tina
It makes me so sad to see them like that and that's what I see in the lfs near me, with one exception where they do a good job with their discus.
I'm with Timbo...it makes me want to bring them home and try to save them. They must be suffering like that! I actually did buy a sick discus from an lfs about 6 months ago (he was the last discus they had and was $30). I kept him by himself in my kitchen for almost two months. He's definitely stunted and not very round, but adorable and an incredible amount of personality. Not something I'll make a habit of, but I'm glad I saved him.
Kristen
.90 each?,,,blahh, what a rip off, especially because they will turn around and sell it for $30-$40. No wonder they are in business and they get the culls. I wouldnt sell my good ones for .90 a piece and then see them treated horribly. I wouldnt do it to any for that matter. I would do some reasearch first before i sold any to them.
Brings tears to my eyes to see those poor un-happy fish :cry:
Jim
Thanks for the pics Walter. I stickied this thread so it can be referenced in the future.
thanks again:)
-Ryan
Unfortunately it gos on here in the UK too, some lfs's really try hard and some don't care.
Very sad.
Paul.
Pinched behind the forehead means they've lost weight and aren't eating - probably have flagellates. . .