Re: Flubendazole shelf life
Any other good de-wormers that are easier to get in the USA? I have some new discus in QT and the consensus seems to be that that you always de-worm new discus.
Re: Flubendazole shelf life
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Originally Posted by
Vanman
Any other good de-wormers that are easier to get in the USA? I have some new discus in QT and the consensus seems to be that that you always de-worm new discus.
It makes sense to. Reason being by the time you notice a worm problem the fish is losing weight and is in decline. If you deworm all new fish when received its a one and done deal unless you reintroduce worms.
I think alot of hobbyists under estimate the damage worms do. They can literally burrow through tissue leaving tunnels called tracks and they can attack internal organs.
Levamisole is the most accessible dewormer we have here in the USA right now thats effective both in the food or as a bath. Its generally well tolerated and very effective against many worms.
For tapeworms Praziquantel is king.
Another easy to obtain medication is fenbendazole. Some may know it by the trade name Panacur(dog and cat dewormer) its very effective and broadspectrum when dosed in food. It should not be added to the water as Discus do not tolerate it like that.. some fish do..particularly marine fish I believe...but in discus adding it to the water can kill your fish worst case scenario or if lucky cause bad tail standing/head standing and burns.. its really odd how flubendazole only rarely does this to discus when used in the water. I found out fenbendazoles bad side the hardway along while ago.
Re: Flubendazole shelf life
Al- I have absolute wormer plus from cloverleaf and it says must use within 3 months of opening. I find it hard to believe that it will lose activity after 3 months...
Re: Flubendazole shelf life
I thought so too Mike but its possible. When I used to work.in pharma/biotech some of the compounds he used had very short active dates. There has to be a reason for absolute wormer plus to list 3 months.. my guess is one or more of the ingredients does react with oxygen or moisture and it loses efficacy.
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Re: Flubendazole shelf life
Attachment 138351
https://www.vmd.defra.gov.uk/product...SPC_436885.PDF
https://www.koiforum.uk/archive/index.php/t-17281.html
Discussion where member contacted mfg for shelf life confirmation..
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Ok ... received confirmation back from the manufacturer's technical department.
It confirms that Flubenol (flubendazole) is definitely intended to be used in a single shot manner ... :(
But with very careful storage (airtight, completely dry, air removed if possible and stored in a dark and cold location) they say it "should be" fine for "a" repeat dose .... I am taking that to mean a single repeat dose but they were not going to be held to anything "Unfortunately, not all products have an established broached shelf-life."
Looking at the packaging for dose intervals .... almost all of them are 2 months or less .... so that confirms what Feline said above that the 3 month broached (opened packet) shelf-life expiry for this product is probably even optimistic! ... :(
There is also the WARNING in the documentation:
"Care should be taken to avoid the following practices because they increase the risk of development of resistance and could ultimately result in ineffective therapy:"
1) Too frequent and repeated use over an extended period of time.
2) Underdosing (which is what will be happening if the product has lost some of it's potency after 3 months).
With this in mind now IMO it should only be relied upon for a one off treatment or course of treatments and the minute it's ineffective immediately stop using it and swap to an alternative treatment.
Reading up more on this it seems that all these treatments are similar in this manner and will eventually lead to them being ineffective which is borne out by loads of cases on different forums. So it would seem to be best practice to maybe alternate quality treatments (with different active ingredients) annually ... you maybe lucky and have prolonged success with a single brand of treatment but a lot of evidence seems to point to it
Attachment 138352
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Re: Flubendazole shelf life
Re: Flubendazole shelf life
If you work at a laboratory setting, they usually have a copy of the Merck Index on a shelf somewhere. That's always been my most definitive source for shelf stability, toxicity, solubility, etc.
Re: Flubendazole shelf life
So I’m a bit confused….
The “raw” Flubendazole powders stock solution (I.e. once mixed up with solvent) is listed, but I can’t see anything on the actual unused powder.
Also, when this raw powder is used in a product, like the wormer plus powder, the use by could be just to encourage people to keep buying more, making the manufacturer more money…
Didn’t other companies put similar use by dates in their test kits, which was proven to be a load of nonsense, and was really just about encouraging people to throw out and spend more money?
I’d say it’s most likely money making, just my gut feel.
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Re: Flubendazole shelf life
Quote:
Originally Posted by
bobfloyd
So I’m a bit confused….
The “raw” Flubendazole powders stock solution (I.e. once mixed up with solvent) is listed, but I can’t see anything on the actual unused powder.
Also, when this raw powder is used in a product, like the wormer plus powder, the use by could be just to encourage people to keep buying more, making the manufacturer more money…
Didn’t other companies put similar use by dates in their test kits, which was proven to be a load of nonsense, and was really just about encouraging people to throw out and spend more money?
I’d say it’s most likely money making, just my gut feel.
All chemical.mfgs I check say similar things...to believe it or not is your call. I have read up on alot of medications. And worked for 8 years At a pharmaceutical. Biotech .. I have seen alot of chemicals that truly do have short shelf lives...flubendazole may be one..
Attachment 140095
Attachment 140096
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after first opening of the container: 7 days. Residuals of the pharmaceutical remaining in the container after the period to be used up is terminated are to be wasted.
Re: Flubendazole shelf life
Interesting.
Is this powder (raw Flubendazole) hygroscopic (I think that’s the right word - I.e. attracting moisture)?
I guess somebody would have to chime in with details of a batch they had lying around for a few years that they used and it worked fine…
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Re: Flubendazole shelf life
Quote:
Originally Posted by
bobfloyd
Interesting.
Is this powder (raw Flubendazole) hygroscopic (I think that’s the right word - I.e. attracting moisture)?
I guess somebody would have to chime in with details of a batch they had lying around for a few years that they used and it worked fine…
If people were to do that it would help but there's also quite a few cases where it didn't work.. Lets be honest very few hobbyists buy a fish med and use it all up. Most are stockers...they want some on hand . And many Are trying to get it cheap and buy in bulk. I know that describes many here.
What I would like to hear from is a chemist that look at flibendazoles structure and .."oh yeah..that area there can be subject to oxidization and isn't protected. That structure is known to be weak. " or something like that.
Here's another one...
Attachment 140097
This one says shelf life is 2 months when first open.
What's interesting on this one is it says to store it cool, dry, and protected from direct sunlight. That could indicate its really not all that stable.
Re: Flubendazole shelf life
In thinking more on this its also possible that the problem isn't the Flubendazole itself here but the carrier used. In a 100 grams product 5 grams is Flubendazole (5%). That leaves 95 % pixy dust. (Carrier)...
