Ideal sump design for Disucs - low maintenance, optimum performance

[joobie]

Hi Guys,

I've finished off my Herbie overflow from my DT to Sump. Now it's the fun time in setting up the Sump!

I've done a lot of reading about this and can see various methods of setting up the sump. I am wondering what the ideal way to do the sump is, which involves minimum maintenance and is at the same time ideal for Discus?

To get the discussion rolling, this is what I was initially looking at doing - hirtc.com/HIRTC/sump.jpg - but there just seems to be too many components to this sump (on average) and not sure if it's all necessary.


Cheers, joo

[joanstone]

I just use Poret foam for dividers (2) making it 3 chambers. Overflows drain down each end and the return is in the center. One end compartment with Kaldnes media and heaters and the other one with plants and ceramic media on the bottom (I have kribensis fry growing out in it, it makes a nice little breeding area). This is a 55 gallon sump on a 220 gallon tank. Very simple.

[Chicago Discus]

I just use Poret foam for dividers (2) making it 3 chambers. Overflows drain down each end and the return is in the center. One end compartment with Kaldnes media and heaters and the other one with plants and ceramic media on the bottom (I have kribensis fry growing out in it, it makes a nice little breeding area). This is a 55 gallon sump on a 220 gallon tank. Very simple.

This is what do .......Josie

[joobie]

Interesting.. Why have the input come into the tank at both sides?

I've never really understood the idea behind a refugium.. It's a small space for fish to live in the sump yea? What are the benefits of this? Isn't it too small to keep fish in a space like that??


Cheers, joo

[Lenin]

I have two things to say on sumps, always have a micron bag, you would probably change this every 3 days.

Do not place anything in the refugium that is not biomedia that's all you need.

and like everyone said poret foam or matala mats either one will do, I just keep my heaters on the refugium side.

I have a wet/dry with matala to trickedown into the sump.

[SMB2]

Lenin,
Do you consider the mat part of the biologic filtration? Or just a mechanical barrier over the bioballs. My W-> D filter has been a great biologic filter but my planted 90 gal tank has a lot of suspended material from the wood/plants/etc that does not readily skim off into the overflow. I am thinking of adding a canister filter to "polish" the water.
My sump is just bioballs, I have a sponge pre-filter covering the stand pipe in the overflow.

[Lenin]

Ok, so this my sump, the only thing I added is the micron bags right on the pipes that go into the wet/dry part, these bags are what keeps the water and the mats clean, the way I make sure I place as much debry or waste into the water column is that I have tunze's powerheads, two run all the time and are made for nano tanks, so they don't make much water movement, the last one is big and makes everything move that turns on 3 times a day and gets make everything go into the sumps, then the micron bags takes care of it, the mats is biological and also helps place oxigen back in the water, the bioballs and the sponges are biological along with the ceramic rings.

[joobie]

Thanks for the feedback guys.

After more research and based on your feedback - this is what i'm thinking..

Chamber 1 - Filter Bags (semi-large, to reduce having to change every 3 days)
Chamber 2 (from top to bottom) - Peat (1/4). Activated Carbon (1/4). Ceramic Rings (2/4). Airstone (to try to increase the oxygen for the Ceramic Rings above)
Chamber 3 - BioBalls
Chamber 4 - Heater, Return Pump


My goals are (a) low maintenance (b) not excessive in cost. Do you think I can better meet these goals with a variation of the above? For example, replacing the Filter Bags with Poret or Matala Mats to reduce the frequency of changing these out?

Also I am integrating an automatic water change system to the sump. The way I envisage it integrating is by having a waste pump in Chamber 4, which pulls out water to a certain water level, then another pump to pump in the water into Chamber 4 after the waste water has been removed.

1. Any idea how I can design this so that the water level in Chamber 4 sits very high? I need this so that I can run the waste pump as well as the return pump at the same time, until the water level of Chamber 4 gets down to a lower level in which the RO water pump kicks in. I ideally don't want to shut off the return pump, as it will stop the flow into the sump (using a Herbie style overflow). Ideally want to keep the sump flow going so the BioBalls don't start to degrade their bacteria.
2. Is Chamber 4 the best to be pulling waste water and adding day old heated RO water to? My thought behind this was that the waste water has already had a chance to go through the sump filter and feed the bacteria, so it's done it's job and OK to take out. Likewise the new RO water will not have the regular ammonia / nitrite in the water, so figured pumping it in past the filter would keep the flow over the bacteria just as dirty water.

[SMB2]

Any reason for the activated carbon?

[cjr8420]

u got 3 main sumps k1 fluidbed,trickle bioballs,and submerged ceramic rings.all versions work well.i got submerged ceramic rings and filter socks. my maintainence is swaping the filter socks out weekly not bad but if u slack on changing the filter socks out they over flow and dirty up the rest of the sump that can be a pain with 30 lbs of C ring media bags that need to be cleaned now to.i have heard nothing but good things with with the poret/k1 setups but havent used myself.i would do some more research into the KISS method.with all ur different media chambers and what u have in them sounds more like a canister filter than a sump.my ideas ditch the peat the carbon and choose either bio balls or ceramic no point to have both they do the same thing and if price is an issue go with the pot scubbies instead of either hth

[joanstone]

[QUOTE=joobie;955455]Interesting.. Why have the input come into the tank at both sides?

I've never really understood the idea behind a refugium.. It's a small space for fish to live in the sump yea? What are the benefits of this? Isn't it too small to keep fish in a space like that??

I have overflows on each end of my 220, therefore it's easier to have them piped to the end of the sump they are closest to. I have done it the other way as well, both going to one side, but this works out better/easier plumbing-wise for me. A refugium is usually a place for plants/nutrient export. My refugium/breeding area just kind of developed. I needed a place to put some plants temporarily and then I wanted to let my kribs breed so I threw them in. Turned out to be a perfect breeding set up, it's plenty big for growing the babies out for quite a while. At some point, those babies will come out and some apisto agassizii will go in. I'm not really using it for nutrient export, I don't worry about that much with my water changes. With the Poret, you can make your sections however big or small you want. The middle section with the return pumps is only big enough to hold them (sometimes I keep a reactor with Purigen running in it) and the biggest section holds enough Poret to sustain many tanks I'm sure. This way I always have seasoned Poret if I need it for new projects.