Why so many water changes with Discus?

[Deaner]

Hey guys,

I'm new to keeping discus but not to aquariums in general. Over the years I have kept multiple freshwater aquariums and more recently been into saltwater/reef aquariums. At this time i'm in the process of setting up a 70 gallon aquarium with 30 gallon sump for some discus.

After doing some reading on general maintenance patterns with these fish, it seems water changes are done much more frequently than many species. I realize these fish require high quality water conditions in order to grow and strive but it just seems overkill for someone to be doing 50% WC every day.

The general norm when keeping reef tanks is 10-15% WC once a week, this seems much more feasible to me. I dont see why this isn't possible with discus as keeping healthy SPS coral is among the toughest tasks in the aquatic hobby. Alot of people seem to look past the importance of having intricate filter systems that help maintain the water quality without having to change out 100% of the water every week. I have read many posts where a simple sponge filter is used and the person is changing out 50% of the water everyday. To me this seems like a case where the filter used is not adequate and you are not even letting the waste in the aquarium go through the nitrogen process.

Once my aquarium is up and running I plan on trying out Nitra-Guard bio cubes in the freshwater world to control phosphates and nitrates. For those of you who aren't familiar here is a write up on them.

http://reefbuilders.com/2012/09/27/n...#ixzz27mymtyeP

I'd like to get some input/discussion on this, I feel myself that alot of people don't focus enough on their filter systems and water quality going into the tank at water changes in the first place. Im not saying doing large water changes everyday will not keep your fish happy but why would you do so much work if you don't have to.

[Skip]

Ur right... its ur tank. You can do it as you please. .

[Second Hand Pat]

Hi Deaner, first welcome to simply and with discus it is more then just about the nitrates. Didn't you add calcium etc to your reef tank between water changes?

[Chicago Discus]

There are many factors as to why you should change your water every day. Growing discus from fry to sub-adult is very difficult without changing large amounts of water it can be done but to get a large big body discus it’s almost impossible. The reason I change so much water is to clean the waste from the tank from over feeding. In the wild during the rainy season the Amazon is full of life (small aquatic animals) and vegetation which is why discus spawns during this time. It gives there fry a chance to gorge themselves for rapid growth as to not fall victim to predatory fish. It impossible to feed enough and create a natural run-off like a river without water changes. If you want to change less water than purchase adults their demands are much less and you can get away with less feeding and longer durations between water changes........Josie


PS welcome to simply

[lipadj46]

Once my aquarium is up and running

Not really much a discussion to be had until you show us how your ways are better. Remember it takes over a year to grow out juvies so get going.

[Deaner]

Hi Deaner, first welcome to simply and with discus it is more then just about the nitrates. Didn't you add calcium etc to your reef tank between water changes?

calcium alkalinity and magnesium are added daily through a doser, what else is trying to be replaced with water changes other than removing nitrates with discus?

[Deaner]

Not really much a discussion to be had until you show us how your ways are better. Remember it takes over a year to grow out juvies so get going.

Im not saying my ways are better as im just starting out with discus but im suprised as to how much water gets changed. I will start a tank journal and keep you updated. sorry, not trying to be a "know it all" just trying to understand the dynamics. Being involved in reef forums for many years, you never really hear of this. I could understand if you are rasing fry, but im talking about growing discus from sub adults to adults in a proper amount of water per fish.

[JERRYKEVIN]

Welcome to water change central

[Second Hand Pat]

Deaner, with a reef tank the focus is on various types of corals with a very low density of fish. Fish produce waste and corals do not. A discus is a large fish and even as sub-adults they eat a lot, grow fast (with proper care) and need lots of clean, fresh warm water to make that happen. Once they are adults you may be able to cut back on the WCs depending on the density of fish in the tank. With a 70 cube (and you mentioned a planted tank) you are most likely looking at daily WCs for a group of six adults to keep them healthy. I had a reef before discus. A reef tank is less time consuming then a discus tank.

[Deaner]

I plan on starting out with 4 discus for now and seeing how that goes. People with reefs still have a large fish load and seem to do fine, one big difference would be the use of a protein skimmer. I also feel that people not using RO water may be adding nitrates to their tanks with water changes. Do you agree?

[lipadj46]

I would start with 5 minimum. Not sure why not using RO would mean you are adding nitrates. That would only happen if your tap has nitrates in it.

sent from an undisclosed location using morse code

[Second Hand Pat]

Actually I didn't. You are drawing analogies between a reef tank and discus. Two different animals. On the nitrate question it depends on the water source. I have no nitrates in my well water and suggested it is more then a nitrate issue. As Skip mentioned in the second post you are free to do this your way...your tank, your fish...and your money.

There are a lot of people new to discus who ask about frequent WCs so this question gets asked a lot. The members here answer the question time after time. Using the search function or going back through the beginner forum might be helpful for you.

[nc0gnet0]

I'd like to get some input/discussion on this, I feel myself that alot of people don't focus enough on their filter systems and water quality going into the tank at water changes in the first place. Im not saying doing large water changes everyday will not keep your fish happy but why would you do so much work if you don't have to.

Welcome to Simply. And congratulations on being the 100,000 person to haved joined Simply with the same idea in mind. Try if you must, but I suggest doing yourself a favor and spend a little time on doing some research on all the others that came before you, and failed miserably. I have no workinig knowledge of the product you plan on using, but I bet that you will be replacing it at an alarming rate to maintain water quality that can even come close to that of a tank that recieves regular water changes.

Yes you can tinker around with some pretty complex filtrations systems that will indeed cut down on the need for water changes, but normally they are cost and size preventive, and the finished product will require constant upkeep as well. I have a good suggestion for you.......Rather than spend all this time and energy on reducing the need for water changes, why not just spend as much time and energy figuring out how to make doing your water changes faster and easier? You will find the results to be much much better for your fish.

Rick

[Deaner]

thanks guys, obviously this is a question asked over and over. Im sure i will find out soon enough.

[a volar]

Deaner, welcome to simply.

I just to have 3 reef tanks running in my house for years, one 200 gal, one 120 gal and one 55 gal, all connected to a 120 gal sump, I had all kinds of corals and all kinds of reactors and filters, resins even vodka dosing.......... And believe me its not the same as keeping discus, I’m not a big fan of a big writings here but my advice right now will be READ all the great information this site has then get some discus preferable 6 or more, take care of them and then we'll talk about it in a few months.


But please (and no offense here) don’t tell us that there is no need of frequent water changes if you have never keep discus before.

One last thing, you can not compare reef keeping to discus keeping side by side, they are two different things.

Welcome again