Fish Not Eating, Hiding

[kalare]

1. Please explain the problems with your fish. When did you notice the problems and did anything unusual happen that you think started them?

Purchased 5 juvenile stendker Tefe from a local store, all seemingly healthy and eating. Floated them and dropped them in the tank without dumping water.

They all started eating a couple hours after being in the tank, flakes at first, then spectrum, then they all started taking tetra color bits. Every couple of days I fed frozen blood worms and recently (one week ago) I started feeding my own mix of frozen pork heart (couldn't find beef), shrimp with shell, spinach, small piece of cod and flake binder. Around 3-4 days ago, the largest of the group seemed to be hiding and not eating. Darker in coloration when hiding under a large piece of driftwood and lighter in coloration with out and about. 2 days later another started doing the same thing. I came home today and now another is doing the same. I have not noticed any white poop, though it may be hard to see on my tank bottom (faux sand bed, epoxy and sand). The one that is not eating today seems to have normal brown poop color.


2. Symptoms (i.e. turning dark, excess slime, not eating, clamped fins, flashing, darting, clamped gills, white/yellow/green poop, hiding, headstanding or tailstanding, white on tips of fins, rotting or fungus, blisters/white zits on fish, bloated, cloudy eyes, wounds).

Not eating, sometimes dark, sometimes clamped fins. They will swim in a group, but when fed, the ones that eat go after the food, the ones that don't retreat and hide. They don't look bloated and I don't see unusual poop (white).


3. What medications/ treatments have you already tried and what were the results. Include dosage and duration of treatment.

None

Tank/Water

4. Tank size and ages, numbers and sizes of fish.

50g, (5) 3-4" discus. They were have grown approx. .5" since I got them two weeks ago. (1) 1" angelfish, (2) bolivian rams. The other fish were from a different store and not Q'd...yeah I know (please no lectures, I won't do it again...kept fish (including discus) in the past for the last 15 years and never had a problem...well, sooner or later...and for me it happened to be later). These non discus fish eat and seem healthy.

5. Water change regime (What percentage and how often).

50%/day

6. How long has tank been running? Is it bare bottom? If you have substrate, what type and how deep is it?

2.5 months running, 2 weeks with fish. Fake bare bottom, sand and epoxy.

7. Do you age your water? If you do for how long and what is the ph swing.

NO aging, straight tap. No Ph swing as far as I can tell, 8.0 going in, 7.8-7.9 in the tank.

8. Parameters and water source;

Tap, Los Angeles super hard water (same water store uses)

Note: Water Parameters are important in diagnosing problems within a tank. If you don't own test kits for the following information, you can purchase them, test your parameters and post this info as soon as possible.

- temp 84

- ph 7.8-7.9

- ammonia reading 0

- nitrite reading 0

- nitrate reading 5-10

What type of water or combinations of water sources do you use? If it is an RO/tap/well water mix, please list percentages in the mix.

Tap

9. Any new fish, plants or inverts added recently.

None

10. Include any pictures or videos you have which shows the symptoms. If you can't add them to this post, please provide a link to them.

I'll try and ad some later.


Any ideas. I have a bunch of metro on hand, and put in an order for Levamisole...but I don't really want to ad meds without knowing. Hard thing is the only symptom I can see is not eating and sometimes hiding/clamped fins. I'm quite familiar with normal fish diseases and have seem most of them (worked an LFS for 2 years as a kid) and I don't see anything on the exterior of the fish. I think they may be breathing heavily though, I'm not familiar with juvi discus breathing. I've recently added a new pump to agitate the surface more.

Thanks in advance.

[Madaboutdiscus]

Dont add meds yet. Wait for the experts. Meds can be more harm than good sometimes.

-Victoria

[OC Discus]

Pick a food they love, like blood worms, and feed enough so they get in front of all the fish. You could feed their favorite food exclusively for a few days until they start eating better. Not over feeding is important. But feed enough so shy fish can get some without being chased by more aggressive fish. Feed at least 3 and up to 5 times a day.

I would also consider removing the angel and rams. Bolivian Rams don't have much color, so They will not contribute to the beauty of a discus tank, but could contribute to problems.

You might also remove the hiding places until they are more established. You don't want any to hide until all the food is gone. You can always add it back later. Nasty stuff can hide under drift wood and decorations. Water changes are easier without it.

[OC Discus]

Can you post some pictures of the whole tank and the individual fish. Do you have gravel? Plants?

Some hiding and not eating is normal for new fish. You might better entice them by removing obstacles and feeding favorite food- brine shrimp is another that they love. Mine ignore some foods and devour others. May not like the home made mix.

[OC Discus]

To entice mine, I fed blood worms about one hour after lights on in the morning. Brine shrimp around lunch time. A good flake or pellet with vitamins in the afternoon/evening. To really fatten them up, add beef heart a couple of hours before lights out. Blood worms is a daily staple. You can vary the order, but the variety is good for them.

[Chicago Discus]

Hello,
What concerns me is that they were eating and looking fine two weeks ago and now they have clamped fins and are turning dark. Sounds like they cought something from just being put in the tank without proper quarantine. Do any if them look like they are loosing any slim coat or are they just turning dark?

[kalare]

Hello,
What concerns me is that they were eating and looking fine two weeks ago and now they have clamped fins and are turning dark. Sounds like they cought something from just being put in the tank without proper quarantine. Do any if them look like they are loosing any slim coat or are they just turning dark?

Thanks OC Discus, but the above post is correct. They were eating and looking great 5 days ago, and now three aren't eating and don't look so good. Dark coloration. I'm not sure about slime coat, I'm not exactly sure how to tell it's not there...

I don't want to throw meds at them, but I also don't want to wait too long and let them go too far. I'm sure they did pick up something from being in take with quarantine, it's just what, I don't know.

[Chicago Discus]

Thanks OC Discus, but the above post is correct. They were eating and looking great 5 days ago, and now three aren't eating and don't look so good. Dark coloration. I'm not sure about slime coat, I'm not exactly sure how to tell it's not there...

I don't want to throw meds at them, but I also don't want to wait too long and let them go too far. I'm sure they did pick up something from being in take with quarantine, it's just what, I don't know.

Mmmm....I think I would do a very large water change like 80% or 90% and clean the filters and wipe the tank down very good and if you have gravel give that a good vacuuming and see what affect that has on them. give it a day or two and observe them with the larger water changes and if they don't start turning around then I would set up a hospital tank and we can try to narrow the best course of action at that point
Hope this helps........Josie


I would also call the pet store that you purchased the fish from and keep them in the loop on whats going on.

[rickmiles]

ChicagoDiscus

Re: Fish Not Eating, Hiding
Hello,
What concerns me is that they were eating and looking fine two weeks ago and now they have clamped fins and are turning dark. Sounds like they cought something from just being put in the tank without proper quarantine. Do any if them look like they are loosing any slim coat or are they just turning dark?

Mmmm....I think I would do a very large water change like 80% or 90% and clean the filters and wipe the tank down very good and if you have gravel give that a good vacuuming and see what affect that has on them. give it a day or two and observe them with the larger water changes and if they don't start turning around then I would set up a hospital tank and we can try to narrow the best course of action at that point
Hope this helps........Josie


I would also call the pet store that you purchased the fish from and keep them in the loop on whats going on.

+1000

[kalare]

+1000

Thanks guys for the advice. Hoping we can nail this down soon, or they start recovering. Took out the large piece of driftwood last night, leaving only several rocks for them to hide around and making siphoning much easier. There is no gravel, so just siphoned off the surface of the fake gravel bed (as I do every day). Cleaned the prefilter, cleaned the bottom most sponge in the canister, took out carbon (in case I do start meds), raised the temp to 88, lowered lighting levels from 45% to 20% (leds) and did a 85-90% WC. We'll see how they're doing when I get back from work.

In the meantime, is there anything else that I should be looking for symptom wise?

Thanks

[Skip]

you have received good advice.. it will take a little bit of time for the fish to recover or show signs of improvement.. hopefully in a few days you will see improvement..

ps.. you are leaving the SHELL on the Shrimp in your food mix!? i am interested to know if anybody else does this.. i always de shell my shrimp.. .. .. but i am thinking more about it as i am typing.. my fish would eat frozen mysis shrimp.. and they have shell.. so maybe its not to bad..
never mind.. carry on

[kalare]

you have received good advice.. it will take a little bit of time for the fish to recover or show signs of improvement.. hopefully in a few days you will see improvement..

ps.. you are leaving the SHELL on the Shrimp in your food mix!? i am interested to know if anybody else does this.. i always de shell my shrimp.. .. .. but i am thinking more about it as i am typing.. my fish would eat frozen mysis shrimp.. and they have shell.. so maybe its not to bad..
never mind.. carry on

I left the shell on as per many recipes in the seafood mix thread. They seem to not mind and ate like little pigs from my fingers not 5 days ago...

I'm hoping to see improvement as well however knowing that beforehand I was doing 50% water changes and keeping everything clean (prefilter, sides, bottom) I'm not sure what 80% changes will do? Maybe the increased temp will help?

I'm thinking that because one of the fish started not eating and it has now spread to 2 other fish, that they have something internal that I cannot see, and that I should treat soon or they will go too far.

[Skip]

hope it the wc help

[kalare]

Ok, came home today and say white poop coming out of one of them, chunky and segmentedish. I have several photos:











I'll try to get some better photos but this is what I have right now. Several of the fish are hanging out near the top (maybe cause the 88 degree temp? Lack of O2?), so I set the controller back to 83...but I can reverse if you all don't think it's a good idea. Maybe add some airstones?

What do you think this is? Hexamita, worms?

Thanks!

[kalare]

Thanks for all the help, I have some photos and I tried to post them but apparently I need a minimum post count to do it? I'm going to bump this up a couple times to get to 11 posts.