Hole in the head. Help please

[discus795]

20140728_130410 (385x800).jpg20140728_130339 (309x800).jpg20140728_130605 (262x800).jpgI have been reading about hole in the head disease but it seems to be quite mysterious with no specific cause or treatment. Any advice would be appreciated.

Problem

1. Please explain the problems with your fish. When did you notice the problems and did anything unusual happen that you think started them?
I noticed a hole in the head of my turq discus about a week ago. My other discus is fine. I recently had an ick outbreak when I bought a new pleco(learned the hard way to quarantine new fish). I treated using the heat method and added extra oxygen. The tank has been ick free for two weeks now. I also had a break out of detritus worms at the same time as the ick. The worms have been gone for two weeks as well now. About a month ago I had a zebra danio develope dropsy which I immediately quarantined and it ended up dying. All other danios are fine. This particular danio was being chased relentlessly by the rest of the danios and I believe it became stressed. I have had the danios for 8 months with no problem so I'm unsure as to why this happened.


2. Symptoms (i.e. turning dark, excess slime, not eating, clamped fins, flashing, darting, clamped gills, white/yellow/green poop, hiding, headstanding or tailstanding, white on tips of fins, rotting or fungus, blisters/white zits on fish, bloated, cloudy eyes, wounds).
Fish is asymptomatic besides the whole in his head. Great appetite and has been swimming around normally. Both discus do have kind of white stringy poop.

3. What medications/ treatments have you already tried and what were the results. Include dosage and duration of treatment.
I have not treated yet as I am unfamiliar with this condition. I have been worried my discus might have intestinal worms so I have been feeding angel plus deworming flakes.


Tank/Water

4. Tank size and ages, numbers and sizes of fish.
I have 60 gallon that has been set up since Feb and properly cycled. The turq discus is 4in and the pigeon blood is 3in. I have 5 neon tetras, and 4 danios, and one pleco.


5. Water change regime (What percentage and how often).
I change 40-50% 2-3 times a week.


6. How long has tank been running? Is it bare bottom? If you have substrate, what type and how deep is it?
Tank has been fully cycled since March. It is bare bottom with two bubblers.


7. Do you age your water? If you do for how long and what is the ph swing.
I use tap water. There is no pH swing.


8. Parameters and water source;

Note: Water Parameters are important in diagnosing problems within a tank. If you don't own test kits for the following information, you can purchase them, test your parameters and post this info as soon as possible.


- temp _84 F____

- ph __7.5___

- ammonia reading __0__

- nitrite reading __0__

- nitrate reading _5___

What type of water or combinations of water sources do you use? If it is an RO/tap/well water mix, please list percentages in the mix.

- well water ____

- municipal water __x__

- RO water ____


9. Any new fish, plants or inverts added recently.
Pleco added about 3 weeks ago


10. Include any pictures or videos you have which shows the symptoms. If you can't add them to this post, please provide a link to them
I have been worried my fish might be a little on the skinny side so I have been feeding deworming flakes. I feed them 3-5 times a day depending on my work schedule. I feed frozen beef heart, hikari blood worms, omega super color flakes, and omega super veggie kelp flakes. I have tried pellet foods without success. I am new to keeping discus so can someone please let me know if they look underweight. Sorry for the low picture quality. I was using my phone camera. Attachment 83029Attachment 83030Attachment 83031

[DiscusLoverJeff]

The best cure for Hole in the Head is clean water.

Try and do 75% water changes daily (or 50% twice a day).

Here is a good read.

http://www.simplydiscus.com/library/...nal/hith.shtml

[pcsb23]

I don't see any evidence of hith in those pics, either the pics are not good enough or my eyes aren't!

However I do see the blue based fish as being in poor condition, either they are not being fed enough or there is some issues in the tank with aggression/hierarchy or the fish has an infection of something, most probably a combination.

I'm guessing from your description that you only have two discus? This of itself can be a cause of stress.

Generally discus temps are a little too high for danios, they prefer cooler water, and as such I don't think they make good tank mates for discus, nor do plecs.

[discus795]

There is only one spot in the up close picture of the blue discus. Its centered and higher up. Yes I only have the two. I plan on getting more I just wanted to start with two since I have never kept them before. Hopefully I can add a few more discus soon. Any suggestions on how to help the blue discus gain weight? I have tried deworming flakes and I feed plenty. He eats a ton. Way more than my other discus. He behaves normal. No indication of being sick. I don't understand why he is skinny.

[pcsb23]

More than likely that's just a cut or damaged scale.

No experience of deworming flakes, I never use any shop bought medicated food. The white stringy poop you mention could be symptomatic of stress, worms, flagellates or a bacterial infection ... I don't think their environment is ideal so I'd start by improving that. As for worming, I prefer to use something like levamisole for general worming, prazi for tape worms. If it's a flagellate infection then metro is usually the drug of choice.

Having said that at this stage I wouldn't treat, I'd sort the tank out, I'd get rid of the other fish for a start and organise some more discus of similar size and add these AFTER they have been quarantined (4 to 6 weeks) during that time I'd feed a high quality diet based around either a good seafood or beefheart mix, you can also add in freeze dried blackworm, live brine shrimp and a fresh high quality flake/granular food.

[discus795]

Awesome thanks for all the advice. I'll def work on implementing your suggestions.

[discus795]

I added three new discus today. That makes a total of 5 in my sixty gallon. All are 4 inches or a little smaller. My PB(female) that I have had for months is being extremely aggressive with all the new fish. Constantly chasing and biting the face and body of the new fish. One of the new fish fights back a little but that just seems to make the PB more aggressive. I'm afraid the new fish are going to be injured. I have plenty of plants and drift wood for hiding but its not helping. Any suggestions please. My maze turq(male) is fine and getting along great with the new fish. I don't understand the extreme aggression from my PB.

[pcsb23]

I think you missed a key bit of the advice I offered ...

... and organise some more discus of similar size and add these AFTER they have been quarantined (4 to 6 weeks) ...

Agression is part and parcel of keeping discus (typical cichlid behaviour) Usually it sorts itself out over time, for now keep an eye on it and also for other signs of disease from failing to qt.

[discus795]

ok thanks!