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Thread: Buying Used Photo gear

  1. #1
    Administrator brewmaster15's Avatar
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    Default Buying Used Photo gear

    A Beginner's Guide to Buying Used Photo Gear Al Sabetta 2/2014


    Everyone likes to have the best and newest photo gear. Its like Christmas when you open that brand new Digital SLR or maybe its a Lens. But before you know it, its all old technology. If you can afford to buy the newest this or that, great for you, but don't think that you need to in order to take great pictures. Don't believe the hype. Last years model was the cutting edge last year, The same for 5 years ago,etc, were there no good pictures taken then? My favorite cameras go back to the film age and still take great pics. For digital you can easily find used DSLRs in the 6-12 megapixal range that can take amazingly good photos.


    There is a saying I have seen around a few times.. "If you buy a brand new top of the line DSLR it does not make you a photographer. It makes you the owner of a brand new top of the line DSLR!" Some many people spend a small fortune on high end gear and only use the minimal function of green mode to take an autofocused picture...in effect, using it as a point and shoot. If you have money to waste like that on a top of the line brand new PENTAX, NIKON, CANNON, Sony, etc DSLR that you really don't need and won't use to its potential, a better use would be to donate it here...http://forum.simplydiscus.com/misc.php?do=donate and buy some well cared for used gear to have fun with!

    Because technology evolves so fast and the newest camera is old by the time it hits the market, you can pick up last years models for alot less. I bought my K20d pentax when they were new for $900.They sell used for $250-300 now and its still an awesome camera with its 14.6 megapixels. Its years old , so what? Do you really need to keep up with the Jones and spend thousands on brand new gear. If you aren't aspiring to be a Pro or even a semi Pro, do you really need more? Most people probably don't.

    The key to being a successful used gear purchaser is to be informed. Start by researching the gear you are interested in. I like to go to the camera forums for that or sites like..www.dpreview.com. Even Amazon can be useful for some info on reviews. You should do the same research if looking to buy that hot new camera or lens as well.


    If you have come to your senses or are just on a tight budget, and decide to buy used here are a few suggestions. This article's focus is on Digital SLRs, though alot is relevant to other camera systems.

    1) Ebay is a great place to buy gear but if you do, do your homework and learn about the gear. Some sellers market gear outrageously high. Understand that Feedback is relatively worthless on ebay if the seller has 1000's of sales. The negatives do not get represented well in the seller's feedback scores. Read the sellers negatives, often they can tell you what to expect. Also look at what the seller is selling besides the camera gear. Many sellers there run thrift shops and while you can get some great bargains, you can also get garbage. Few of these sellers know cameras and lens. They don't know what to look for. You'll see them all use the same or similar wording.. "shutters work, lens aperture works, blades smooth and buttery, and free of oil, lens is clear, with a few specs of dust inside which wont be a problem, no sign of fungus, Minty".etc.. You really need to look closely at the pics. My advice is buy from people with good track records that sell photographic equipment.

    2) Camera stores are a great option.There are good and bad of these. I have bought many cameras and lens over the years this route and its generally a safe way to go and the gear though maybe slightly higher than at EBAY, It has been rated for its condition and checked over by the shop ifvthe shop is good. My favorite places for used gear from a camera shop are
    ***KEH*** https://www.keh.com/
    ***Adorama*** http://www.adorama.com/
    ***BHphoto*** http://www.bhphotovideo.com/

    3) Craigslist. Most know, you can buy and sell most things on craigslist. The benefit is the cost is reasonable and you usually are dealing locally, so you can see the gear first hand and pick the seller!s brains. I haven't bought much photography gear on it, but I have sold much there!

    4)Amazon is a great place for many things. But really not great for used camera gear in my experience, often over priced, but you never know.

    5) Camera related forums. You come to a discus Forum to buy discus right? Well same goes for a camera forum. They are populated by people that generally are photographers or photography nuts.They know their gear and tend to take really good care of it. Though some may try to sell it for higher than its worth today because they have valued it as a user, many are very reasonable. Definetly look there for gear.


    Aside from that, lets mention what to look for in your gear. Of course it should all be functioning per manufacturer specs, meaning the things like shutters, flash all work well. Cosmetics matter! A beat up looking camera wasn't taken well care of, the sensor may be impaired or other functions. A few scuffs is no big deal...these happen with use. With Digital SLRs you should inquire and check on the shutter count. Since its electronic, theres a record of the number of shutter depressions made. This number tells you roughly how much use the camera got. A camera may be rated for 200000 shutter actuations so if it has a only a few thousand, its hasn't seen much use. You can check this information on line from a photo sent to you taken by the camera. Many sites offer this. Some you can even check from a link. Heres one I have used http://www.myshuttercount.com/

    Lenses require close scrutiny as they really are key to a good image. They can be very very expensive.Several times more expensive than a new camera depending on the optics,build, and technology that goes into. They can also be simply an old lens that still capture great images decades after they were made. Lenses are made up of several components. The following lens break down is simplified, but gives the basics as to what you need to look for

    You have the mount that fits on a particular camera make.Each camera maker has a specific mounting mechanism. You can't take a pentax lens and pop it on a nikon or vise a versa. There are some 3rd party manufacturers though that make their lens in different mounts. Tamron and Sigma are good examples. So when buying a Lens first make sure it will work on your camera.

    The lens also has an aperture. The hole that light passes thru to reach the camera. Without going into detail on this and its importance.The basics are this hole can be made bigger or smaller by turning the aperture ring on older lens, newer lens may lack aperture ring. The aperture consists of blades of metal that slide along a plane. You can see them moving if you take the lens off the camera and hold it to the light, turn the aperature ring, and as the numbers on the ring get bigger, the aperture hole gets smaller. These blades should slide across each other smoothly and when you look you should see no oil on them. The aperture ring should turn smoothly as well. If the lens has electronic contacts, they should all function well. These are found on the mount but interact with the aperture mechanism in lens that have "A" functions or in "AF" autofocus lens.

    The heart and soul of the lens is the series of glass elements inside. There are several elements that together allow the lens to function as intended...ex..macro lens,telephoto, wide angel, etc. These are precise engineered glass elements. They are often coated with special coatings to improve optical performance,reduce light flare etc . In short, they make the lens function better.They are meant to be as clean and free of defects as possible. You need to look carefully at the optics. The front and rear elements should have caps that prevent the lens from being scratched. The lens coatings, if present should be intact. If the lens in question is being sold without caps, be wary, it may be scratched from poor storage. It should also have a lens filter screwed on it, something like a UV filter or sky filter. Theses serves 2 purposes ,they are cheap protectors of the glass elements of the camera lens. They filter out undesirable light qualities. If they get scratched you are out $10-20. If your lens gets scratched, goodby lens. Make sure the front of the lens thats threaded to receive the filter is not bend or dinged. It must be able to have a filter screwed on.

    A further note on the lens elements.. They do need to be clear and free of marks and abrasions to make a great picture.. tiny specs of dust and dirt will have limited affect on the image, lots of these may. A small superficial scratch on the periphery of the optics may be acceptable.. towards the center, I would pass on it. Watch out for moisture beads, fogging and fungus. These things indicate moisture got into the lens. Maybe it was used in the rain and got wet, maybe it was stored improperly, or was exposed to humid situations. A few days of humidity is enough to get a fungus growing on the lens. Its not so much a problem on new lens that weather sealed., but on older lenses it can be. In some cases the lens can be taken apart and cleaned. Usually people use a solution of 50% hydrogen peroxide and 50% ammonia. But if the fungus is well established, it actually etches the glass, effectively ruining it or creating the need to send out out for costly repairs and replacement. Lens fungus is the area many non-photography sellers on ebay mess up on. They don't know what to look for or just hope you dont.

    Because the fungus is very thin and there are multiple elements in a lens that can be affected you need to angle the lens when looking for it and try and check out the different elements. The Fungus isn't something on the outside of the lens you can just wipe off, its inside the assembly on the innner elements. Taking apart a lens is not for the weak of heart! Often a quick look straight at a light source will miss the fungus growing, best is to angle the lens and use the incident light. Its very tough to get a picture of this but here a few macro shots to show you what you are looking for. This is from an ebay lens that was not as described. The optics are badly compromised.

    Fungus 1 by al_sabetta, on Flickr

    fungus 2 by al_sabetta, on Flickr

    I hope this article helps someone. I have tried to minimize the tech aspects so that novices could benefit from the info.
    If you happen to have suggestions on what else people should look out for or where is a good source for used equipment. Please add them to this. I am leaving this open as an evolving thread.
    Last edited by brewmaster15; 02-14-2015 at 12:55 AM. Reason: added details
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  2. #2
    Registered Member Discus-n00b's Avatar
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    Default Re: Buying Used Photo gear

    Good article Al! Used gear really can be the ticket as there's ALWAYS someone out there willing to dump their perfectly good equipment just to have the latest and greatest. One thing I would add is all of the companies usually have their own refurbished stores where you can get refurbished gear at a cheaper price. Sometimes these are even the store display models that get sent back, put through a rigorous check where they clean and replace any broken parts and they get the full once over like any warranty or other repair would if the consumer sent their camera in, and then sell them. Great place to go for gear if you don't want to chance a private auction but don't want to buy new. You can find everything refurbished from camera bodies, to lenses, to flashes. Gear on these go fast though as they don't always keep a steady stock of this stuff. Can't tell you how many times I've almost pulled the trigger on a new lens from Canon Refurb only to refresh the page and see it out of stock. And sometimes they even have discounts ontop of the markdown already.

    Refurb products (at least from Canon) come with selected accessories like you would find in a new camera, something that might be missing from a private seller, as well as a 1 year Canon warranty. Here are links to Canon's and Nikon's. I'm sure Sony, Pentax, etc all have similar.
    http://shop.usa.canon.com/shop/en/ca...al-slr-cameras
    http://shop.usa.canon.com/shop/en/ca...rbished-lenses
    http://www.nikonusa.com/en/Nikon-Sto...d-Cameras.page

    Just something else to think about, but I agree theres no harm checking into used gear!!
    -Matt


  3. #3
    Administrator brewmaster15's Avatar
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    Default Re: Buying Used Photo gear

    Quote Originally Posted by Discus-n00b View Post
    Good article Al! Used gear really can be the ticket as there's ALWAYS someone out there willing to dump their perfectly good equipment just to have the latest and greatest. One thing I would add is all of the companies usually have their own refurbished stores where you can get refurbished gear at a cheaper price. Sometimes these are even the store display models that get sent back, put through a rigorous check where they clean and replace any broken parts and they get the full once over like any warranty or other repair would if the consumer sent their camera in, and then sell them. Great place to go for gear if you don't want to chance a private auction but don't want to buy new. You can find everything refurbished from camera bodies, to lenses, to flashes. Gear on these go fast though as they don't always keep a steady stock of this stuff. Can't tell you how many times I've almost pulled the trigger on a new lens from Canon Refurb only to refresh the page and see it out of stock. And sometimes they even have discounts ontop of the markdown already.

    Refurb products (at least from Canon) come with selected accessories like you would find in a new camera, something that might be missing from a private seller, as well as a 1 year Canon warranty. Here are links to Canon's and Nikon's. I'm sure Sony, Pentax, etc all have similar.
    http://shop.usa.canon.com/shop/en/ca...al-slr-cameras
    http://shop.usa.canon.com/shop/en/ca...rbished-lenses
    http://www.nikonusa.com/en/Nikon-Sto...d-Cameras.page

    Just something else to think about, but I agree theres no harm checking into used gear!!
    Great Add on Matt! Factory Refurbs are a great alternative! I looked for a pentax refurb store but alas, I did not find one. I have seen them sold thru BHphoto and Adorama though.

    al
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    Registered Member pcsb23's Avatar
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    Default Re: Buying Used Photo gear

    Just to add to Al's post there are some excellent and reputable places in the UK that are worth checking out for used and new gear, many offer 6 or 12 month warranties too, which is always re-assuring.
    http://www.mpbphotographic.co.uk/used-equipment/ - for all makes really
    http://www.graysofwestminster.co.uk/...secondhand.php - Nikon only (probably the premier Nikon dealer out there! - the shop is mind blowing)
    http://mifsuds.com/acatalog/Cameras.html - all makes and accessories
    http://www.ffordes.com/ - Leica specialist but also other brands
    http://www.wexphotographic.com/used/s1008 - most brands and accessories
    Paul

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    Administrator brewmaster15's Avatar
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    Default Re: Buying Used Photo gear

    Perfect Paul !! Thanks!
    al
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    Default Re: Buying Used Photo gear

    I would also suggest buying last years camera when the new models come out. I purchased a nikon 1 package from bandh for sixty percent off of retail simply because nikon released a new version. Camera takes the best pictures of any camera I've owned and I can honestly say I have never wished it would do something beyond its capabilities.

  7. #7
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    Default Re: Buying Used Photo gear

    Quote Originally Posted by Andy27012 View Post
    I would also suggest buying last years camera when the new models come out. I purchased a nikon 1 package from bandh for sixty percent off of retail simply because nikon released a new version. Camera takes the best pictures of any camera I've owned and I can honestly say I have never wished it would do something beyond its capabilities.
    Good Point Andy.. And for those looking, right now is when alot of New cameras get announced. Mfgs use shows like CP+ to show off the new stuff and make announcements.. http://www.cpplus.jp/en/exhibition/target.shtml This shows going on right now until Sunday. Another big one is Photokina, that was this past Sept.

    I know this past week pentax announced alot of New Stuff, Many of my fellow pentaxians are already chomping at the bit to sell their gear and get some new stuff.

    al
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    Registered Member rickztahone's Avatar
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    Default Re: Buying Used Photo gear

    Great thread Al and very well said. I have purchased used more than not over the years.

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    Registered Member rickztahone's Avatar
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    Default Re: Buying Used Photo gear

    Also, just as a side note to Al's fungus explanation. If you happen to get a lens with fungus in it, make sure that you keep it seperate from the rest of your lenses. Fungus is known to be able to jump from one lens to the other. I have personally known of a photographer that loved collecting old lenses that were past their prime to fix, and he happened to get one that was very far gone on fungus. Many times you can get rid of the beginning signs of fungus by setting the lens out and getting some UV rays from the sun. However, this fellow photographer ended up losing over $7k worth of better lenses because he didn't know how to store his lenses and the infected one. Many photographers I know keep their gear in dry boxes and it is very effective against the elements, especially dust.

    If you happen to get a lens with fungus, again, keep it away from your other gear. You can try treating it with UV rays, stores carry specific lamps that emit the certain UV light intensity that you need to possibly get rid of the fungus. A cool thing you can do to a lens with fungus is open the lens, clean half of the element and reassmble. Use it for a few weeks and check if the clean side has grown any new fungus since the UV treatment. If so, then it may be a lost cause. The sun rays do help a lot though, just be mindful of leaving your lens out too long in the elements.

    I know this thread is about buying used gear, but you have to prepare for the worst if you do not do your homework. Roughly, I have bought about 80% of my gear on a photography forum. As Al mentioned, they tend to take good care of their gear. Always analyze photos provided by seller with utmost scrutiny. There are certain key words to look for as a buyer from sellers that would know what they are selling. Words like "awesome lens' and "rare lens" or "best lens all around" are just broad and ambiguous. Look for key words such as "clean front element", "no wobble", "clean blades" and so on. These are descriptive words that deal with the actual lens. If you get a lens that has something wrong with the things this seller claimed were good, then you can open some kind of case through ebay for example. Always look for sellers that accept returns, and avoid "as is" auctions at all costs.

    If a seller is a good seller, he will know a good deal about photography and will stand by his product. The feedback will reflect this. Always ask if there is any warranty left on a lens, body, flash, etc.

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  10. #10
    Photo Guru SMB2's Avatar
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    Default Re: Buying Used Photo gear

    I would certainly second looking at manufacturers refurbished sites. The cameras and lenses will be more expensive compared to what you find on the used market, but the refurbished items have been brought up to factory standards and come with at least a short term warranty. (Speaking of which, check your credit card. If you look at the fine print benefits, some cards will add at no cost, double the length of the warranty. You simply have to register the item with the CC company.) The Nikon refurbished site will from time to time have a 10% discount on their items.

    When I sell some of my gear, I often get asked is the camera/lens grey market? This distinction is important to understand when buying used gear. Speaking just for Nikon camera gear, grey market items can make a difference in your purchase, used and new.
    Nikon distributes gear via certain buyers in the USA for sale. Any item that comes into the US via other countries (import, direct import, grey market) are considered grey market. When new these grey market cameras and lenses will be sold at a discount (sometimes substantial). What you DON'T get is a Nikon USA warranty with a grey market item. Even if you purchase a third part warranty, Nikon USA will never repair that item. You can get repairs at other places just not at a factory site (in NY and Calif.) Nikon has made repair parts less and less available to shops, funneling repairs to their certified repair centers, of which there are 22, I think. You still can get grey market items repaired in certain stores (like B&H) but even the Certified centers are turning down some grey market items. At some point the rest of the repair shops will run out of certain parts...
    Any used Nikon lens or camera automatically has any residual warranty voided once it passes from the original buyer. So any future repairs on a camera etc you will have to pay for. (Some stores and Nikon offer a 90 day +/- used gear warranty.) It is just that grey market items are getting harder to repair.

    So how do you tell a grey market item if you are buying a used (Nikon) lens or camera? All USA nikon lens serial numbers start with US. I am however not sure when this started as I have some lenses that are 20+ years old that have just a number and were repaired by Nikon USA.
    DSLR bodies are another story. There is really no reliable way to know if a used camera body is grey market or USA. Buying a used camera, you may have to rely on the word of the seller. I have heard that if the camera was registered by the owner at Nikon USA then it is not grey market.

    So grey market gear costs less but probably has lower resale value. In Nikon's case it may be harder to get it repaired. For a standard lens, this should not be a big issue, but for a high end expensive DSLR body it may be a huge problem.

    Another explanation: http://www.dslrbodies.com/nikon/abou...arranties.html
    Stan

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    Photo Guru SMB2's Avatar
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    Default Re: Buying Used Photo gear

    This is a recent follow up for Nikon:
    http://www.dslrbodies.com/newsviews/...e-visible.html
    Stan

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    Administrator brewmaster15's Avatar
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    Default Re: Buying Used Photo gear

    I mentioned Craiglist as possible resource for your used needs... Its definitely something to be careful with, but sometimes, you can really score something great. I had one of those moments today. A guy was selling an old Pentax Spotmatic film camera with 3 lenses for $50.00 . These cameras go back... like made back in the 1960's to early 70s. All manual operation with a very simple light meter on some.. The lens screws on via whats called M42 mount (42 MM) ..Still used alot by die hard film hobbyists, but a royal pain with its special battery. Anyway.. who would be crazy enough to pay money for that archaic paper weight?

    Who? ME!!!!!! Not so much for the camera as I have a few of them and they aren't worth $50 .. but 3 lens... and not just any lenses.. but Super Takumars... I just scored 3 absolutely Mint , like not used M42 Taks...

    Super-takumar 1:2.8 /105mm
    Super-takumar 1:1.8 /55mm
    Super-takumar 1:3.5 /35mm

    I collect these lenses and still shoot with them. They are easy to adapt to most digital cameras...not just Pentax and they are becoming harder and Harder to find. Takumars have a huge following because even now, 35-45 years latter they still have awesome Glass. They are manual..but so what, thats half the fun.

    So, again... theres definitely bargains to be had... Just got to take some time to read up and learn,

    al
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    Administrator brewmaster15's Avatar
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    Default Re: Buying Used Photo gear

    A Quick Tip for those of you that made the switch to Digital and still have Those Film SLRs, in your closet. Theres still a market for these, particularly on Craiglist. You might ask who would buy them? Students still use them in high school and college photography classes. Good working manual SLRs with lens are easy to move for that reason and tend to bring more than 30% more in revenue than ebay listing. (thats not scientific, just what I have seen) .

    I've recently sold several older film cameras and lens on Craigslist and every one of them has been to Photography students.

    So dig out your old cameras and lens, dust them off and sell them for some money towards new digital gear!

    Ps...

    Ifs its pentax, drop me a Pm first, especially if they are Lens... I suffer from LBA... Lens Buying Addiction, and theres no cure!

    thanks,
    al
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  14. #14
    Registered Member rickztahone's Avatar
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    Default Re: Buying Used Photo gear

    Quote Originally Posted by brewmaster15 View Post
    A Quick Tip for those of you that made the switch to Digital and still have Those Film SLRs, in your closet. Theres still a market for these, particularly on Craiglist. You might ask who would buy them? Students still use them in high school and college photography classes. Good working manual SLRs with lens are easy to move for that reason and tend to bring more than 30% more in revenue than ebay listing. (thats not scientific, just what I have seen) .

    I've recently sold several older film cameras and lens on Craigslist and every one of them has been to Photography students.

    So dig out your old cameras and lens, dust them off and sell them for some money towards new digital gear!

    Ps...

    Ifs its pentax, drop me a Pm first, especially if they are Lens... I suffer from LBA... Lens Buying Addiction, and theres no cure!

    thanks,
    al
    What a coincidence, I have medically diagnosed G.A.S. (Gear Acquisition Syndrome). Diagnosed by my wife, mind you, lol.

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    Administrator brewmaster15's Avatar
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    Default Re: Buying Used Photo gear

    Quote Originally Posted by rickztahone View Post
    What a coincidence, I have medically diagnosed G.A.S. (Gear Acquisition Syndrome). Diagnosed by my wife, mind you, lol.
    Hmmm... That is a coincidence...my LBA was diagnosed by mine!
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