ChicagoDiscus.com     Golden State Discus

Page 1 of 12 12311 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 172

Thread: Lets see those sumps

  1. #1
    Registered Member rickztahone's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Pacoima, California
    Posts
    12,908
    Real Name
    Ricardo

    Default Lets see those sumps

    I have been spending so much time in SW forums to research overflow and sump setups that I am getting lost as to which benefits FW more. I see that almost all of them run skimmers. I am not interested in running a skimmer. I want to get ideas from FW setup sumps. I have a 40g acrylic tank that I am yet to set up with baffles. Please show me pictures of your sumps and description on what you used and what you would change if anything.

    Hopefully we have some DIY sump builders in here. My goal was to keep the build simple. I want to have a entry point, baffle, media, bubble trap (needed for fw?) and return pump area with 2x 250w heaters.

    Any help is appreciated.

    Click here to view my 75g Acrylic Tank w/ Bean Animal Overflow with 40g Sump Thread

    Also, click here for my 25 group of discus grow out thread


    http://i3.cpcache.com/product/162117...ht=75&width=75
    Want to look like Al did at his ACA talk with his white Simply Polo shirt?(You can catch Al's awesome Discus talk HERE)
    You can get this and many more items such as T-shirts/Polos/hoodies/cups from our merchandise shop:
    Cafepress.com

  2. #2
    Registered Member Discus-n00b's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Location
    Columbia, SC
    Posts
    5,403
    Real Name
    Matt

    Default Re: Lets see those sumps

    Preface this with I have no real sump experience, though I have looked at many many SW setups thinking about my next project. To me FW sumps seem exceptionally more simple though like all things you can go as complex as you want. All you really need is a section your water dumps into, like SW maybe into a filter sock, some baffles after that where you could even stick some poly filter, dump that into some bioballs or whatever media you want supported ontop of egg crate, some baffles, and then into your return chamber. I've seen some add in a FW "refugium" where they grow plants right after the bioball chamber but then you start talking plant care, lighting, etc.

    Some FW sumps i've seen dump straight into different sheets of polyfilter with media like bioballs under that, through some baffles with other media (carbon, filter floss, etc) and onto the return.

    I wish I had pictures to show but I don't. To me the trickiest part of sumps is figuring out your flow rate on intake and return to balance it.
    -Matt


  3. #3
    Registered Member Trevor W's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Moose Jaw, SK
    Posts
    344

    Default Re: Lets see those sumps

    Here are a couple photos of a sump I used for both a reef tank and a fresh water tank. It is just a simple design consisting of a drain entry then that overflows to 2 filter socks for water polishing (or for freshwater just get some mesh socks and fill them with media) or just skip them altogether, then to the skimmer chamber which was for the reef tank (because skimmers don't work with just freshwater) this chamber I placed sheets of poret foam and other bio media then a set of baffles (bubble traps have the same function in either fresh or salt they are used to just stop or minimize the amount of micro bubbles in the display) then the return chamber. It is also key to remember that when you have a sump all of your tanks evaporation will be noticed in the return pump section, but for frequent water changes you shouldn't see an issue because you won't have large gaps between water changes so your return shouldn't run dry. I have seen tons of sumps both salt and fresh and they really can be as simple or complex as you want them to be. I suggest just using an old tank and thinking about what you want to do with it. you could just have a set up bubble traps before your return and that's it. The drain entry, heater, and all bio media can be all housed together with no real need for separation.







    Also unrelated but I seen you were going to go with a bean animal overflow which is essentially just a herbie with an extra pipe (both can be placed on the bottom or side of an overflow and work off of a full siphon principle) make sure you keep all the lines or atleast the main full siphon drain with the valve seperate and don't join them together or it will not work properly. Also be sure to invest in a good gate valve like a spears and not a ball valve because these full siphon methods require fine adjustments that a ball valve just can not give you.





    Sorry if you already know most of this, but I would just hate to see you make an expensive and frustrating mistake.

  4. #4
    Registered Member rickztahone's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Pacoima, California
    Posts
    12,908
    Real Name
    Ricardo

    Default Re: Lets see those sumps

    Quote Originally Posted by Discus-n00b View Post
    Preface this with I have no real sump experience, though I have looked at many many SW setups thinking about my next project. To me FW sumps seem exceptionally more simple though like all things you can go as complex as you want. All you really need is a section your water dumps into, like SW maybe into a filter sock, some baffles after that where you could even stick some poly filter, dump that into some bioballs or whatever media you want supported ontop of egg crate, some baffles, and then into your return chamber. I've seen some add in a FW "refugium" where they grow plants right after the bioball chamber but then you start talking plant care, lighting, etc.

    Some FW sumps i've seen dump straight into different sheets of polyfilter with media like bioballs under that, through some baffles with other media (carbon, filter floss, etc) and onto the return.

    I wish I had pictures to show but I don't. To me the trickiest part of sumps is figuring out your flow rate on intake and return to balance it.
    I do want simple but I also want to take advantage of the larger footprint sump. However, I've been having a hard time seeing sumps in action. Most show how they made them and how they look, but never really running with media.

    Thanks for the information Mat.

    Quote Originally Posted by Trevor W View Post
    Here are a couple photos of a sump I used for both a reef tank and a fresh water tank. It is just a simple design consisting of a drain entry then that overflows to 2 filter socks for water polishing (or for freshwater just get some mesh socks and fill them with media) or just skip them altogether, then to the skimmer chamber which was for the reef tank (because skimmers don't work with just freshwater) this chamber I placed sheets of poret foam and other bio media then a set of baffles (bubble traps have the same function in either fresh or salt they are used to just stop or minimize the amount of micro bubbles in the display) then the return chamber. It is also key to remember that when you have a sump all of your tanks evaporation will be noticed in the return pump section, but for frequent water changes you shouldn't see an issue because you won't have large gaps between water changes so your return shouldn't run dry. I have seen tons of sumps both salt and fresh and they really can be as simple or complex as you want them to be. I suggest just using an old tank and thinking about what you want to do with it. you could just have a set up bubble traps before your return and that's it. The drain entry, heater, and all bio media can be all housed together with no real need for separation.







    Also unrelated but I seen you were going to go with a bean animal overflow which is essentially just a herbie with an extra pipe (both can be placed on the bottom or side of an overflow and work off of a full siphon principle) make sure you keep all the lines or atleast the main full siphon drain with the valve seperate and don't join them together or it will not work properly. Also be sure to invest in a good gate valve like a spears and not a ball valve because these full siphon methods require fine adjustments that a ball valve just can not give you.





    Sorry if you already know most of this, but I would just hate to see you make an expensive and frustrating mistake.
    I had an almost exact idea of making a sump with a similar design to yours. I kind of wish I had a glass tank vs acrylic now because I have never had to weld acrylic and I'm afraid of messing up the baffles on the sump. I will have to bite the bullet though and give it a shot.

    I had planned on making a drain dump section exactly like yours with an overflow in to a filter sock section as well. Is that second baffle from the left raised? I really can't tell from the pics. I'm assuming it has to be, and it goes by the poret foam. Is the skimmer section where bio media is kept? I really have never researched it at all and I am assuming that is what it is for? If so, I see why I never see media in bags and/or inline within the sump in SW tanks as much.

    As for the BA setup, I did plan on getting a full gate valve as opposed to the ball valve, but I thank you for the reminder just in case . The 1.5" I am looking it is going to be right around $50 which is pricey, but I see the necessity for it.

    I found a cheaper gate valve ($24range) but did not want to skimp out on a vital part of the overall system.

    Do you have any other tips, or maybe things you would change if you had to redo your sump?

    Click here to view my 75g Acrylic Tank w/ Bean Animal Overflow with 40g Sump Thread

    Also, click here for my 25 group of discus grow out thread


    http://i3.cpcache.com/product/162117...ht=75&width=75
    Want to look like Al did at his ACA talk with his white Simply Polo shirt?(You can catch Al's awesome Discus talk HERE)
    You can get this and many more items such as T-shirts/Polos/hoodies/cups from our merchandise shop:
    Cafepress.com

  5. #5
    Registered Member Trevor W's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Moose Jaw, SK
    Posts
    344

    Default Re: Lets see those sumps

    Here is a sump that I had custom built this past summer. You can see just how elaborate and carried away that you can get with them. This sump has a drain entry then overflowing onto two 7" filter socks then to a skimmer chamber then through a set of baffles to the return section. It also has a built in auto top off reservoir.
    This is obviously for a reef tank and I would never go this crazy for a freshwater tank, but the possibilities are endless. I would still just stick to one main area for drain, heaters, bio/mech media then some baffles and the return.






  6. #6
    Registered Member rickztahone's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Pacoima, California
    Posts
    12,908
    Real Name
    Ricardo

    Default Re: Lets see those sumps

    That is a nice looking sump! Thanks for sharing.

    Click here to view my 75g Acrylic Tank w/ Bean Animal Overflow with 40g Sump Thread

    Also, click here for my 25 group of discus grow out thread


    http://i3.cpcache.com/product/162117...ht=75&width=75
    Want to look like Al did at his ACA talk with his white Simply Polo shirt?(You can catch Al's awesome Discus talk HERE)
    You can get this and many more items such as T-shirts/Polos/hoodies/cups from our merchandise shop:
    Cafepress.com

  7. #7
    Registered Member Trevor W's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Moose Jaw, SK
    Posts
    344

    Default Re: Lets see those sumps

    Quote Originally Posted by rickztahone View Post
    I had an almost exact idea of making a sump with a similar design to yours. I kind of wish I had a glass tank vs acrylic now because I have never had to weld acrylic and I'm afraid of messing up the baffles on the sump. I will have to bite the bullet though and give it a shot.

    I had planned on making a drain dump section exactly like yours with an overflow in to a filter sock section as well. Is that second baffle from the left raised? I really can't tell from the pics. I'm assuming it has to be, and it goes by the poret foam. Is the skimmer section where bio media is kept? I really have never researched it at all and I am assuming that is what it is for? If so, I see why I never see media in bags and/or inline within the sump in SW tanks as much.

    As for the BA setup, I did plan on getting a full gate valve as opposed to the ball valve, but I thank you for the reminder just in case . The 1.5" I am looking it is going to be right around $50 which is pricey, but I see the necessity for it.

    I found a cheaper gate valve ($24range) but did not want to skimp out on a vital part of the overall system.

    Do you have any other tips, or maybe things you would change if you had to redo your sump?
    Quote Originally Posted by rickztahone View Post
    That is a nice looking sump! Thanks for sharing.
    Thanks I am pretty happy with how it turned out.

    The second baffle your asking about is the first one after the filter socks I assume your meaning? If so it goes like this, the drain dumps into the first section with the heater then fills up and goes over the filter socks which then pour into a chamber underneath them and fills up till is pours over a baffle just under the lip of the filter sock shelf into the skimmer section( salt water) poret foam, pot scrubbies, K1, ceramics, ect...(freshwater) then it flows over a baffle then under a baffle then over another which is the same height as the water in the return section so it does not create bubbles by splashing down to a lower water level. So the last baffle sets your return water height. This is where I placed my ATO float switch.

    With saltwater you rely on the liverock to house all the bacteria and any addition filtration like carbon,bio-pellets, GFO, ect is all usually housed in reactors or can be also passively run in a hanging media bag.

    The gate valve I posted is a 1.5" and it is huge! I think I paid around $50-$60

    One thing I will suggest is plan out your plumbing so it is easily taken apart in section by using lots of unions, also so it won't be a pain to work around when you need to do something under there, and make sure your return line isn't too low in your display because when the power shuts off it will back siphon and it could be too much volume for your sump. Remember check valves can fail so don't rely on them 100% and if you do put in a check valve on your return line buy one with a union on either end so it can be replaced or cleaned. One way besides having your return line closer to the surface is to drill a siphon break in it just below the surface. Also try not to design your sump so that when running the water level is really high because you will need the extra room when the return shuts off to take any excess waterfrom the plumbing and the display.

    Also I really like using thread/slip bulkheads on the overflow because it allows you to have threads on the top of the bulkhead and a slip (glued) connection on the bottom.

    Sorry for the long winded post I am sure there is something else I will remember

  8. #8
    Registered Member rickztahone's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Pacoima, California
    Posts
    12,908
    Real Name
    Ricardo

    Default Re: Lets see those sumps

    Quote Originally Posted by Trevor W View Post
    Thanks I am pretty happy with how it turned out.

    The second baffle your asking about is the first one after the filter socks I assume your meaning? If so it goes like this, the drain dumps into the first section with the heater then fills up and goes over the filter socks which then pour into a chamber underneath them and fills up till is pours over a baffle just under the lip of the filter sock shelf into the skimmer section( salt water) poret foam, pot scrubbies, K1, ceramics, ect...(freshwater) then it flows over a baffle then under a baffle then over another which is the same height as the water in the return section so it does not create bubbles by splashing down to a lower water level. So the last baffle sets your return water height. This is where I placed my ATO float switch.

    With saltwater you rely on the liverock to house all the bacteria and any addition filtration like carbon,bio-pellets, GFO, ect is all usually housed in reactors or can be also passively run in a hanging media bag.

    The gate valve I posted is a 1.5" and it is huge! I think I paid around $50-$60

    One thing I will suggest is plan out your plumbing so it is easily taken apart in section by using lots of unions, also so it won't be a pain to work around when you need to do something under there, and make sure your return line isn't too low in your display because when the power shuts off it will back siphon and it could be too much volume for your sump. Remember check valves can fail so don't rely on them 100% and if you do put in a check valve on your return line buy one with a union on either end so it can be replaced or cleaned. One way besides having your return line closer to the surface is to drill a siphon break in it just below the surface. Also try not to design your sump so that when running the water level is really high because you will need the extra room when the return shuts off to take any excess waterfrom the plumbing and the display.

    Also I really like using thread/slip bulkheads on the overflow because it allows you to have threads on the top of the bulkhead and a slip (glued) connection on the bottom.

    Sorry for the long winded post I am sure there is something else I will remember
    keep the long winded posts coming! This is gold for me ;-)

    Click here to view my 75g Acrylic Tank w/ Bean Animal Overflow with 40g Sump Thread

    Also, click here for my 25 group of discus grow out thread


    http://i3.cpcache.com/product/162117...ht=75&width=75
    Want to look like Al did at his ACA talk with his white Simply Polo shirt?(You can catch Al's awesome Discus talk HERE)
    You can get this and many more items such as T-shirts/Polos/hoodies/cups from our merchandise shop:
    Cafepress.com

  9. #9
    Registered Member dprais1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    Mt. Prospect, Il
    Posts
    875
    Real Name
    Dan

    Default Re: Lets see those sumps

    Here is a bad pic of my sump when I had it.
    Basically I used flexible tubing for the return and intake and then poret foam for filtration.
    Filter socks or the equiv is really great to have and is a really smart investment. I enjoyed my tank much more with clearer water.
    Baffles are definetly not needed for freshwater. They might have uses but not needed as they are in saltwater.sump.jpg

  10. #10
    Registered Member farebox's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    San Antonio, Texas
    Posts
    932
    Real Name
    Roland E. Wilson

    Default Re: Lets see those sumps

    I have an 125G tank, not drilled, so I wanted to do an sump. DIY an 20G long tank. I use the Lifereef Prefilter Siphon box, with Silencer, 600GPH (Lifereef.com), this drains into an used Filstar XP3 filter basket that contains an old sponge filter cut in half, this baffles the sound of splashing water), Pinky filter media, and a piece of poret foam. This serves as my mechanical filtration. Next drains down into the first chamber, which contains 2 gallons of K-1 Kaldness. An Alita Linerar air pump (AL-6A) runs 8 airstones. Next will be the baffle, I used an 20L gal Mattenfilter Kit, blue 30 PPI (Swiss Tropicals.com). Second chamber holds an plastic tray basket, from the Dollar General store, 4ltrs of Seachem Matrix bio media. I used an Pondmaster Mag 9.5 (950GPH) for the return. Finally water is pumped through an Emperor Aquatics Smart Lite 40W UV sterilizer. This system has been running since 08/29/14, I turn the pump off each time for feeding, and no problem with restarting. This was the main factor that I went with Lifereef, in over 29 yrs. negative failed overflow problems. This system runs quite! I have my tank in my living room with TV. Hope I helped you out a little, please check this: http://youtu.be/4lc7zWrbk38

  11. #11
    Registered Member dprais1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    Mt. Prospect, Il
    Posts
    875
    Real Name
    Dan

    Default Re: Lets see those sumps

    Quote Originally Posted by dprais1 View Post
    Here is a bad pic of my sump when I had it.
    Basically I used flexible tubing for the return and intake and then poret foam for filtration.
    Filter socks or the equiv is really great to have and is a really smart investment. I enjoyed my tank much more with clearer water.
    Baffles are definetly not needed for freshwater. They might have uses but not needed as they are in saltwater.sump.jpg

    ohh! see that big black line/blob that looks like it is on the blue poret foam? It is permanent marker on the outside of the glass. As long as I only fill my tank to thwe point that water does not exceed that line I am safe if the return pump turns off. No flooding allowed.

    Indecently, that sump is a 30 gallon and is now where I am growing out my current discus.

  12. #12
    Registered Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2015
    Location
    Massachusetts
    Posts
    269
    Real Name
    Marc

    Default Re: Lets see those sumps

    I'm in the same boat. I've been reading lots of sump post and watching a. Lot of you tube videos. I have a 20 long that I'm going to turn into a sump my idea so far is to have the water drain onto a tower of bio balls with some foam on to for mechanical filtration. Then a baffle and a planted refugium. I am thinking of going the refugium route where as my tank is planted and I will be doing less water changes. The refugium should help with nitrates. I'd like to see what you end up doing. I'm still in the brain storming stage. The sump will be additional filtration to my two canister filters.

  13. #13
    Registered Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2014
    Posts
    45
    Real Name
    Melissa

    Default Re: Lets see those sumps

    We have a 125gal bare bottom with plants attached to rock and driftwood. We use a refugium with plants and have great success with using it. No nitrates or nitrites. It has bio balls, filter pad and sponge filter as well. We have one on the 125 for our discus and on a 90 for our cichlids. Which is overstocked and it works great. I'd highly recommend one.

  14. #14
    Registered Member rickztahone's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Pacoima, California
    Posts
    12,908
    Real Name
    Ricardo

    Default Re: Lets see those sumps

    Bump for more sump pics

    I am still yet to start putting in the baffles. Not because I don't want to, but because I haven't had much time lately to do anything. I'm thinking of going to buy the acrylic this weekend and maybe starting next week.

    The one thing throwing me off though is the way that the euro bracing for the sump is set up. It makes it almost impossible to drain the lines in to the furthest most area because the euro is so wide. Does anyone know if the top euro brace can be drilled and put a bulkhead in place?

    Click here to view my 75g Acrylic Tank w/ Bean Animal Overflow with 40g Sump Thread

    Also, click here for my 25 group of discus grow out thread


    http://i3.cpcache.com/product/162117...ht=75&width=75
    Want to look like Al did at his ACA talk with his white Simply Polo shirt?(You can catch Al's awesome Discus talk HERE)
    You can get this and many more items such as T-shirts/Polos/hoodies/cups from our merchandise shop:
    Cafepress.com

  15. #15

    Default Re: Lets see those sumps

    I've been researching the same thing and I am completely lost. Please keep the posts coming!

Page 1 of 12 12311 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Cafepress