Funny but true - German Blue Rams

[GrayLadyPat]

I thought I would share this with y'all and see if any of you have had anything similar happen...

In my tank, I have 7 rams. Out of those 7, I have one permanent pair and two pairs that change mates occasionally.

I know that at least 2 out of 3 pairs lay eggs every few days. I get wigglers, but as soon as they're free-swimming, my cardinals are there waiting for them. I know ful well that I will never have a clutch make it to adulthood in my tank, so that's not a big deal.

Here's the funny part:

This week, I noticed that my permapair and one of the others had spawned at the same time, roughly 12" from one another (lots of plants, so they didn't see each other much.) So, as I often do, I check on the eggs to see if they've hatched, and my temp pair's eggs were mostly gone. I figured they had eaten them, so went to look at the permapair's eggs...which seemed to have almost doubled in number. I had my suspicions about what was going on, but I thought I would watch and see...

Well, I watched them for about 10 minutes, and sure enough, the little female from my permanent pair slowly swam through the plants to where the other pair had nested and proceeded to pick up a few more eggs and add them to her own.

Has anyone ever had egg thieves before with Rams? I have never seen this behavior before with this bunch.

Oh... by the way, they are tankmates to my Discus, who pretty much ignore them.

[Rudustin]

Cool story!

[Larry Bugg]

Hadn't seen that but you mentioned discus ignoring rams which made me think of this video for about 4 years ago. Discus and rams don't always ignore each other. Notice the swarm of fry around the angel pair. Needless to say, ram fry in this tank didn't make it either.

[Pardal]

That is a lot of maternal instinct in your permanent female.
That is true for my experience the fry won't last . I did scooped with a clear two gallon plastic jar most of the fry and parents and put them in a 10gallon to my surprise they did not eat their fry after this and I had the majority of the them. a few straggler got devour by the discus.

Julian.

[strawberryblonde]

Hadn't seen that but you mentioned discus ignoring rams which made me think of this video for about 4 years ago. Discus and rams don't always ignore each other. Notice the swarm of fry around the angel pair. Needless to say, ram fry in this tank didn't make it either.

You made my night Larry! I took pics and video a few years ago of my german rams and the flachen I named Fred. Fred was always an odd ball (his favorite sport was knocking my glass thermometer off of it's suction cup and then chasing it around the top of the water - and every night he uprooted EVERY single plant in the tank).

Welp, his odd ball, overly curious nature got the best of him when my first pair of rams made a nest and laid eggs in the crook of my driftwood stump. Fred the Flachen would swim on over with his usual swagger and try to eyeball the eggs, only to get head butted by the male ram. It got so bad that poor Fred would turn sideways before heading down to have a look see - knowing FULL WELL that he was gonna get that head butt! But it never stopped him by golly.

The pair did eventually have a successful group of fry and by then my discus were so scared of them that they never even tried to eat the wee little things. The rams ruled the tank from their perch on the driftwood. LOL

(I did take pity on the discus and move the pair to a breeding tank once the fry were big enough to net out of the tank)

Thanks for the memories. =)

[GrayLadyPat]

Thanks for the stories... those are great. Love the video.

I think the main reason my discus ignore the rams is that they're stupid...in a lovable bug lug dog kind of way (Especially Beethoven, who likes to watch TV.) They just haven't figured out that ram fry could be dinner if they so choose.

[warblad79]

The more, The merrier.

[GrayLadyPat]

Day two after hatching... there's a lot of the little wigglers in there... turns out that my permapair are better parents this time than they have been in the past. I still don't look for the fry to survive, but they're bouncing around like little fleas so they must be healthy. Thinking about catching them into a small tank as soon as they are free swimming...if I can catch them, and if the cardinals save me any

If I do, I'll post pics and keep you all up to date with my first attempt at raising rams. Wish me luck!

[GrayLadyPat]

ok...so... here we are two days later, and I thought I would give you an update.

There are so many fry... I had fully expected to get up this morning to see maybe a half dozen or so left, as I have enough cardinals that none have ever made it this far before. Instead, it looks like I have somewhere around 100 or so... all their little eyes glow in the morning sunlight and then mom comes up and displays her disapproval at the glass. I guess I was too close

There are two hollows in my driftwood. Every morning, like clockwork, the parents move the fry to the lower hollow and try to keep the now free-swimming fry together. The top of my driftwood has a little notch in it, and every evening, the parents scoop up the fry and "put them to bed" in the upper notch (thought they were eating them at first.)

Truthfully, I thought they would all be gone by now... I am almost giddy watching these little fish rule the tank and take care of their kids. I have never had a brood of rams this old before and I'm like a little kid. Literally, every time they've spawned before, I never got to see any free-swimming fry. They have always been eaten or died, but this time, they're absolutely the most fun I've had with my tank in the last couple months.

Anyway, thanks for listening to an old lady rattle on about some animals that are barely the size of a need's eye right now...

[Second Hand Pat]

Pat, I totally understand that old lady rattle...same here. I have a pair of apistos with a brood of about 50. I am thoroughly enjoying watching the mom with her brood. She keeps dad at bay but does allow him to do guard duty. There's a thread with vids in my homesteader if interested.
Pat

[GrayLadyPat]

Final update:
As expected, once they all became free-swimming, the tiny bit of current in my tank swept them out into the water column, and the cardinals made short work of them. One or two may have escaped, but I kind of doubt it.

Meanwhile, there's another ill-fated brood on the way. Yep, one of the transient pairs' turn.

In any case, it was fun watching them take care of the babies up until they all disappeared. Thanks for coming on the (short) ride with me. If I ever get to the point where I can breed them purposefully, I'll let you all know

[DISCUS STU]

Great story. My Rams keep on cleaning for a nest but never get down to laying eggs. I've had this happen with various pairs in the same tank.

As in the video, sometimes the Rams get a little aggressive with my Discus, who really don't do much in return. I had once had a pair of Kribensis commandeer half of 55 gal. for breeding purposes while my five full grown Discus were shunted into the other half of the tank, 27.5 gallons for five fish.

[GrayLadyPat]

I know I've necro'd my own thread, but had to let you know, Stu, that they will lay...

It has become so bad in my tank that I have removed all my rams except the two perma-pairs. (No, I didn't cull them, I traded them to a friend for a couple of cories.)

I get eggs about every two days now, so it's kind of become "old hat" and not as interesting. One of these days I'll get a 10gal or a 20L and maybe try raising them in earnest.

On another note, I seem to have an extra cardinal or two that are much smaller than my school. Not trying to breed them, but evidently, they did at least once. Cheers!

[DJW]

I get a kick out of the way female rams go get the male and seem to say, "get over there and guard the eggs!"

[strawberryblonde]

I know I've necro'd my own thread, but had to let you know, Stu, that they will lay...

It has become so bad in my tank that I have removed all my rams except the two perma-pairs. (No, I didn't cull them, I traded them to a friend for a couple of cories.)

I get eggs about every two days now, so it's kind of become "old hat" and not as interesting. One of these days I'll get a 10gal or a 20L and maybe try raising them in earnest.

On another note, I seem to have an extra cardinal or two that are much smaller than my school. Not trying to breed them, but evidently, they did at least once. Cheers!

Awesome that you have a few new wee cards in the tank!

I was doing my Super Sunday tank scrub yesterday and as I was shaking my big sword plant to knock off any food particles I saw about a dozen itsy bitsy fry dash out, then back into it. I spent the next 20 minutes trying to see what type of fry they were and eventually realized that they are cards. Needless to say, I didn't lower the water column as far as I usually do. I left it just high enough for the new babies to remain hidden in the bottom most leaves of the sword plant.

I'm assuming that they are eating any teensy bits of flake food that land on the leaves.

Good luck with your rams, they're a fun fish to breed should you decide to go that way. =)