A few questions from a first time discus keeper

[S10blazin]

Ill start by saying I have been pouring through as much of the beginner stickies as I can but still have a few questions. And would like to verify I'm setting everything up right. I have been keeping fish for many years but am new to discus and am trying to make sure I'm going in the right direction.

First ill start with my setup I have a 125 gallon aquarium
2 Eheim 2217 canister filters
2 long aerator tubes at the back of the aquarium
I will be running 2 Hydor external 300 watt heaters with a Ranco controller
I have a minimal gravel cover (you can still see glass in some spots so it should be easy to keep clean)
I also plan on using a few peices of driftwood and fake plants and river rock for decoration and to cover filter intakes etc (these and the gravel are a wife requirement)

My stocking Plan is going to be:

6 Discus (from discus Hans 2.5 or 3+")
15 harlequins
10 panda cories
4? blue rams
I'm currently doing a fish less cycle I will then add all the fish from the local fish store wait 6 weeks then order the discus

My questions are
Is my stocking ok?
Should I or can I add or remove to what I have in the stock list? I would rather maintain a lower stock rather than hurting a bunch of fish and wasting a bunch of money especially on a first attempt.
I know everyone says frequent water changes and and quality foods are key
how is everyone determining how much water to change and how often?
Am I looking for nitrates to stay low? Every other type of fish I have kept have been fine with weekly water changes (this maintains low nitrates and what would be considered a clean tank).
I'm kind of looking for why water is changed so frequently so i can check for it and maintain the tank properly.
Also when doing water changes everyone seems to be going straight from the tap are you putting in dechlorinator and then using cold tap water and letting the heaters bring it up or are you mixing in warm water from the home water heater?
Me and my wife both work so feeding multiple times a day can be difficult Discus Hans is selling a discus flake can i feed that to them in the morning and then his beef mix when i get home and then again before bed. aprox 7 am 5-630 pm and then 11 pm
What is the best way to determine how much to feed as from what I'm reading discus can be slow eaters. Does the whatever they can eat in 2 minutes still apply?

I'm sure some or all of this has been answered but I'm having trouble finding specifics.
Thank you for any help in advance
Dave

[pitdogg2]

Welcome to Simply Discus


one key ingredient is missing.....you're putting fish in from LFS then going to put Discus that are very pricey in later??? I think you have this backwards sport, nowhere did you mention any quarantine of any of the fish. IF you end up with a problem that 125 is going to be pricey to keep medications in when you have an outbreak of some parasite or other bacterial/fungus malady.

I'd get the discus then worry about all the other stuff AFTER you're sure you can manage taking care of the Discus. I change out 60-80% water daily I also age it first in another 55gal aquarium for at least 24hrs. to let the pH stabilize and use straight tap. You want you water to be no more than a few degrees different that the current tank conditions. Swings of 5degrees or so can stress your fish if on a constant basis(daily). enough temperature change can induce ICK

[S10blazin]

the fish from the local store will be in for 6 weeks before I add the discus. At least that is my current plan basically qt them together before adding the more expensive fish while keeping the tank cycled. If i have an issue I can move them to a empty 75 to treat. Normally I just fill very slowly via hose straight from the tap so the heaters can keep the temp I have very little ph bounce in my tap water. What led you to the 60-80% daily number is one of my questions is that just because its what is commonly done or is there something you can test for to see how much it needs?

[Filip]

Hi Dave and good luck with first time keeping Discus.
You should watch the 1:30 hour video from the founder of simply discus. Its very educational especially for begginers. You can find it in general discussions forum by the thread name how to keep discus...
Also you should read the second sticky from begginer section about bioload and biomass.
These two can give you a general idea on question that bothers any new discus keeper and that is why so many water changes.
In short terms, its not only about nitrates ,but it has a lot to do with bacteria,parasites and other nasties that live in water column and especially in the gunk of substrate and filters,and discus are more than any other fish suspectable to them.
So the rule here is ,the more you can do ,the better growout.

As for WCs,aged water is prefered ,but some use it straight tap water with dechlorinator(i use straight tap with seachem safe powder). Temp. Must remain same or 1-2 degrees max.fluctuations.
As for feeding ,i bought an automatic feeder to help me out while im at work.i still feed 3 times my self.
I turn off the filters while feeding ,wait 15 min. So discus can eat all remainings then turn the filters on .No 2 min feeding rule apply with discus.

[pitdogg2]

many fish can carry things that can and will kill others fish yet themselves never come down with said problem i.e. Carriers. Small fish like you're getting need LOTS of clean water to grow correctly and NOT be stunted in the long run. You would be better served with a discus only tank since you are so new to the fish. Other fish can and do live very well with infrequent water changes these are not them. IF you bought full sized adults then you would feed less often and maybe change water once a week at a minimum, Personally I'd still do daily poop sucking and twice a week major water change. My adults still get daily water changes and are constantly laying eggs. Many come through here and fail with Discus after keeping fish for YEARS, the same people will always wonder why their fish are always sick or just not doing well. Work on keeping the Discus first then work on a Discus community tank and it will be MUCH easier to have a bare bottom tank to keep clean.

[S10blazin]

I have already watched the video and found it very informative. While I believe I understand the BIOload/mass issue the pathogens and bacteria it refers to that feed on it traditionally go up with your nitrates that's what shows how much bacteria is breaking things down in your tank. At least as I have always understood it. Maybe I can talk the Mrs into geting fish that are further grown because a daily 60-80% water change is probably going to be to much with my schedule. The most I can probably mange is maybe 3 times a week. Either that or will have to look at keeping something else.

[S10blazin]

Thanks guys I may do that and once the dicus are grown i can qt and add community fish to the tank.

[S10blazin]

Also which automatic feeder do you use and are you feeding flake with it i could set timers on the filters so they shut off when the auto feeder triggers

[discuspaul]

Welcome to the forum, Dave.
Simply put, the key to successful discus-keeping for a novice is largely dependent on the size (and quality) of the discus acquired at the outset.

In your case Dave, if your daily schedule, lifestyle, and inclination will not allow you to do more than 1 or 2 large wcs per week, and feed your fish no more than once or twice a day, then getting discus no larger than 2.5"-3" is really out of the question for you, particularly if you must have some gravel substrate, some plants (fake or real), and some décor. Otherwise, you risk raising poorly developed, and/or badly-shaped or stunted fish.

If your wallet won't permit you to get minimum 4" sized fish right away, then delay your start with discus until that approach is affordable.

And if you want tank-mates for your discus, start with the discus first as others have said, and do a proper diligent quarantine before introducing any other strains of fish into the discus tank. We can walk you through a proper quarantine upon request.
Give yourself a chance - do things right.
Good luck to you.

[MendoMan]

Forget the other fish. If you want to drastically increase your odds of success with good quality Discus start the tank up with a fish less cycle and then stock only Discus. It would also help a great deal to go bare bottom.

[rickztahone]

I will address one recurring question you had in OP, and that is WHY we do so many water changes. The answer is easy, we feed a lot, and we feed a very messy food, Beef Heart. If beefheart is left on the tank floor for a couple of days and a discus eats it when you feed some other food, it can get sick from eating 2 day old BH and that same BH will drive your water parameters out of wack.

[Phillydubs]

I agree with the rest... Save the money you were going to spend on the other tabk mates and get large discus. I tried to grow out smaller discus on a tight schedule and it was nothing but stress disappointment and angst. I tried again with young adults and couldn't be happier. Yes they cost more money but think of the money you will spend on meds and all else also think of the time you don't have and do the math. Invest in the young adults. Especially with your size tank you could easily get a nice group of some big guys in there. These fish are an investment. Plan to have them a long time with proper care. Many of our sponsors have bigger fish for reasonable price...

[Filip]

Also which automatic feeder do you use and are you feeding flake with it i could set timers on the filters so they shut off when the auto feeder triggers

I use eheim 3815 auto feeder,its stabile and reliable and cost 30-40 bucks. You can put flakes or granulated tetra-discus food in there and adjust it to a max. Of 4 feedings a day.
I use it only to fill the gaps between meals while am at work with filter running.
I do shut off filters on 15 -20 min. only while im feeding so that fish can eat more food and easily,and to keep food from ending up all around the tank and rot there.
After 15 min . I net up all leftover food from surface and botom and start the filters again.

[Eddie]

The 2-3 minutes thing is not really applicable. This is true for display tanks where you don't want food hanging around all day.

Just a side note, I used to feed young fish a million times a day but learned that a few big feedings will have the same effect on growth. At least in my experience.

[Filip]

Just a side note, I used to feed young fish a million times a day but learned that a few big feedings will have the same effect on growth. At least in my experience.

This is usefull experience to hear .
I stuffed them 2-3 times a day for 20 min. Period ,and i was allways wondering is this ok and if this kind of feeding can lead to bloating problems.
I never experience bloat though.
It seemed to me that Dicus unlike humans now how much is enough for them when left with plenty of food.