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Thread: Does light matter? You be the judge

  1. #1
    Registered Member rickztahone's Avatar
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    Default Does light matter? You be the judge

    Rather than go on a super winded explanation, I will explain the process on how I took these shots:

    First:
    Control shots. This is how I would normally take shots with no added light or flash

    Second set:
    Added a 48" T5HO light I had lying around

    Third set:
    Started with one flash, then moved to two

    The goal of this thread is to show you the different options for taking a wide range of shots, but additionally, what happens when you transition from one shooting style to the next. I have not adjusted ANYTHING but white balance on mostly the T5 lit ones since they were super, super yellow.

    I have titled every single shot according to their EXIF. This is how it will read, ___my title for the shot___its order_-__Shutter speed__F-stop__ISO

    I will try to give a little explanation under each to show what I was doing through every shot. I tried to consolidate as much as I could so you wouldn't be seeing the same EXIF on many. if I missed one, I apologize.

    Lets get started:

    Control 1 - 1-40 4.5 800

    This is the control shot. This is how I would normally shoot if I didn't have flash


    Control Close Up 1-40 4.5 800

    The close up shows some ok sharpness, but nothing to write home about


    New Light 1 - 1-60 2.8 400

    T5 Light added. Notice I didn't change the settings much to show how much more overexposed the shot is now that I have added a ton more light. The next few shots show the transition of settings to accommodate to the added light. This will show you in what direction you want to take your settings when you are letting in too much light in to a shot and overexposing.


    New Light 2 - 1-60 4.0 400

    Notice I closed down the aperture a little here to f/4 rather than f/2.8 and it is still very bright


    New Light 3 Close Up - 1-60 4.0 400

    Same settings as above but a close up to show the overexposure


    New Light 4 - 1-100 5.0 400

    Closed down the aperture again and also increased shutter speed. Increasing the shutter speed allows you to stop the discus motion more, and more light allows you to increase this value without sacrificing the aperture which controls the depth of field.


    New Light 5 Close Up - 1-100 5.0 400

    Close up with the settings above. Notice how much sharper it looks with shutter speed 1/100 but also the fact that we stopped down the aperture to f/5


    New Light 6 Close Up - 1-100 5.0 400

    Just another close up to show the sharper image than with the control light


    1 Flash Transition to flash

    So, now we make the transition to flash. Kept the same settings as the previous shot, but notice now how much BRIGHTER it is! Flash simply overpowers everything. Next shows me adjusting the settings to have better exposure. This is a trial and error many times, but you will see the transitioning from settings by checking out the titles. KEEP IN MIND, both the regular LED lights AND the T5 lights are STILL ON here. Notice how the flash pretty much neutralizes them.


    1 Flash 1 - 1-200 8.0 100

    Still unusable. Have to reduce further. Keep noticing in the directions that the settings are going


    1 Flash 2 - 1-60 11.0 100

    Getting better. This is still one flash only, keep in mind.


    2 Flash 1 - 1-60 11.0 100

    With 2 flashes now. This allows me to spread the light in a larger part of the tank. Notice that other areas of the tank still look dark. This is in part for the low aperture as well as ISO setting


    2 Flash 2 - 1-25 14.0 100

    Better lit. next one is a close up


    2 Flash 3 Close Up - 1-25 14.0 100

    Better right?


    2 Flash 4 - 1-40 14.0 200

    Increased ISO to 200 and it better lights the rest of the tank


    2 Flash 5 - 1-40 11.0 200

    Opened the aperture a bit for this shot because this discus is a little darker and the angle was further from the flash. Keep in mind, the flashes are in certain areas, and you want to stay in those general areas to get the best lit up shots


    2 Flash 6 - 1-40 11.0 200

    Now just showing the settings at work.




    Last one. I like the end result of flash shots because you can get the background to darken a bit which focus your attention to the discus. However, this isn't the only reason why I prefer flash over control lighting. In the next post, I will show you close up shots of both lighting set ups.
    Last edited by rickztahone; 12-17-2015 at 12:25 PM.

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  2. #2
    Registered Member rickztahone's Avatar
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    Default Re: Does light matter? You be the judge

    Keep in mind, the next 3 shots are all cropped down to the EXACT same size.

    We will start in the same order as above.

    Control

    T5

    Flash




    Control close up

    Notice the sharpness really takes a hit with these settings


    T5 lighting.

    This shot is almost acceptable as far as sharpness goes. I actually wouldn't mind using this setup in the future when I do not feel like taking the flash out. However, for some reason, taking this light out and taking it towards the discus tank completely freaks them out!


    2 flash setup

    I like this one the best, and you can see it is the most sharp.


    I hope you liked this demonstration


    Edit, as an added bonus, I hadn't realized that these were ALL the same discus. This really makes this an apples to apples comparison.

    Click here to view my 75g Acrylic Tank w/ Bean Animal Overflow with 40g Sump Thread

    Also, click here for my 25 group of discus grow out thread


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    Registered Member alcastro's Avatar
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    Default Re: Does light matter? You be the judge

    Good looking subjects.

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    Registered Member ericNH's Avatar
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    Default Re: Does light matter? You be the judge

    That tank is soooooo nice.
    .................................................. .........................

  5. #5
    Administrator brewmaster15's Avatar
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    Default Re: Does light matter? You be the judge

    Ricardo thats a great intro to lighting, flash and Fish pics. Very nicely done! Nice Fish Too!

    Thanks for the thread!
    al
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  6. #6
    Registered Member rickztahone's Avatar
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    Default Re: Does light matter? You be the judge

    Quote Originally Posted by alcastro View Post
    Good looking subjects.
    You're telling me! They came from a good source

    Quote Originally Posted by ericNH View Post
    That tank is soooooo nice.
    Thank you very much. I'm glad you like it. I believe it still looks rather plain, but plain works well for me for grow outs. Eventually I plan to add DW and a small sand layer, but that will not be for another year or so.

    Quote Originally Posted by brewmaster15 View Post
    Ricardo thats a great intro to lighting, flash and Fish pics. Very nicely done! Nice Fish Too!

    Thanks for the thread!
    al
    Thanks Al. Lighting, or rather LIGHT itself plays the biggest role of all in photography. If you (general, not you specifically Al ) can get a grasp on the way light affects a photo, you can better prepare yourself to take better shots with that understanding. Flash does change a lot of variables, but I wanted to use it here to simply show the progression of light.

    Furthermore, I'd like to point out again that NONE of these are edited in any way other than WB correction. That means, I can get these to look a lot better! I chose to show you a straight conversion for complete transparency.

    Secondly, I will point out one major flaw in my flash photos. Typically, you want to diffuse your flash somehow. I chose not to do that here, because in reality, I do not have a modifier small enough to use any more. I use to have a Gary Fong diffuser that would have worked quite well here, however, I gave it away as I never saw my self using it in my personal shooting. Now I regret it of course, because a modifier, ANY MODIFIER, helps even out the light tremendously.

    I will most likely do a follow up to this thread with the use of modifiers, and without.

    What is a modifier? It can be as simple as a piece of white paper. I have used this in the past with the exact same photography you see above. You can use wax paper, you can use styrofoam, which I believe Matt has used in the past in one of his YT tutorials. If you haven't checked that out yet, please do so. I don't have the video saved currently, but if Matt would be so kind, I'm sure he could link it here as well.

    If you have any questions, please ask them. There is no such thing as stupid questions

    Click here to view my 75g Acrylic Tank w/ Bean Animal Overflow with 40g Sump Thread

    Also, click here for my 25 group of discus grow out thread


    http://i3.cpcache.com/product/162117...ht=75&width=75
    Want to look like Al did at his ACA talk with his white Simply Polo shirt?(You can catch Al's awesome Discus talk HERE)
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    Default Re: Does light matter? You be the judge

    Mo Devlin once told me he would use several flashes on the tank he was shooting but would cover them with a milky white tupper ware container on all but the up flash or camera flash. It was so scary the detail he would get on the scales and fins not to mention the iridescence of the scales.

    by the way very nice pictures

  8. #8
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    Default Re: Does light matter? You be the judge

    duplicate sorry

  9. #9
    Registered Member Discus-n00b's Avatar
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    Default Re: Does light matter? You be the judge

    This is an excellent post! Lighting makes a huge difference!

    While we are on the subject, what do you think about using a fill from a front angle or so? I know Mo uses fill flashes quite a bit, I've never gotten the hang of using fills with fish or maybe my angles are off. Ever tried using a fill Ricardo? Thinking more to light the entire fish rather than have really nice light on the head and have it fade off through the body to the tail. Lighting the entire fish like it is in the face really is the outcome.
    -Matt


  10. #10
    Registered Member rickztahone's Avatar
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    Default Re: Does light matter? You be the judge

    Quote Originally Posted by Discus-n00b View Post
    This is an excellent post! Lighting makes a huge difference!

    While we are on the subject, what do you think about using a fill from a front angle or so? I know Mo uses fill flashes quite a bit, I've never gotten the hang of using fills with fish or maybe my angles are off. Ever tried using a fill Ricardo? Thinking more to light the entire fish rather than have really nice light on the head and have it fade off through the body to the tail. Lighting the entire fish like it is in the face really is the outcome.
    I have never actually tried this Matt. Not quite understanding the angle but I can try a few in the next couple of days to see if it makes a difference. I have 3 strobes I can use and I can try modifying. However, I can't use my studio strobes as they are just too large to make it work.

    Click here to view my 75g Acrylic Tank w/ Bean Animal Overflow with 40g Sump Thread

    Also, click here for my 25 group of discus grow out thread


    http://i3.cpcache.com/product/162117...ht=75&width=75
    Want to look like Al did at his ACA talk with his white Simply Polo shirt?(You can catch Al's awesome Discus talk HERE)
    You can get this and many more items such as T-shirts/Polos/hoodies/cups from our merchandise shop:
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  11. #11
    Registered Member rickztahone's Avatar
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    Default Re: Does light matter? You be the judge

    Quote Originally Posted by pitdogg2 View Post
    Mo Devlin once told me he would use several flashes on the tank he was shooting but would cover them with a milky white tupper ware container on all but the up flash or camera flash. It was so scary the detail he would get on the scales and fins not to mention the iridescence of the scales.

    by the way very nice pictures
    Yes, modifiers make a huge difference. I would NEVER do a photo session without some kind of modifier, even if the modifier is a ceiling. It is like night and day.

    Click here to view my 75g Acrylic Tank w/ Bean Animal Overflow with 40g Sump Thread

    Also, click here for my 25 group of discus grow out thread


    http://i3.cpcache.com/product/162117...ht=75&width=75
    Want to look like Al did at his ACA talk with his white Simply Polo shirt?(You can catch Al's awesome Discus talk HERE)
    You can get this and many more items such as T-shirts/Polos/hoodies/cups from our merchandise shop:
    Cafepress.com

  12. #12
    Registered Member Discus-n00b's Avatar
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    Default Re: Does light matter? You be the judge

    When ever I've tried filling from the front sides I always seem to get to much direct on the fish even turning that flash very low. I think I'd need to diffuse it quite a bit or bounce it somewhere as all I'd be trying to do is lighten up the tail half some more instead of having the light taper from the head. Sending you a quick PM Ricardo!
    -Matt


  13. #13
    Registered Member Woodduck's Avatar
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    Default Re: Does light matter? You be the judge

    Yes, but which looks better to your eye?
    Over 50 years in fish and it still feels brand new!! Woodduck

  14. #14
    Photo Guru SMB2's Avatar
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    Default Re: Does light matter? You be the judge

    To bad your fish make such poor subjects! Seriously, that is a beautiful tank.

    One thing I noticed about the images with flash, there seems to be much more backscatter. This is a real problem with strobes and UW photography. In that setting it can be corrected by angling the flash/strobe outward. I wonder if that would work on the tank, not shooting the flash straight down.
    Stan

    SIMPLY DISCUS IS AN OXYMORON

  15. #15
    Registered Member Discus-n00b's Avatar
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    Default Re: Does light matter? You be the judge

    Maybe the tank should be cleaner and water more polished! LOL just kidding. It's hard to avoid, I think you are going to hit it no matter what in an aquarium. I don't usually worry about it, I always take it out in post. A simple dust and scratches filter in photoshop will usually take care of it, and you can clone the larger particles and particles on the fish itself.
    -Matt


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