10 water changes in 6 years on a planted tank?

[modealings]

I came across this interesting video on youtube recently. I searched here to see if it was posted before but couldnt find anything. Anyway if you jump to 7:00 youll see a very heavily stocked planted tank with big discus and the owner talking about doing only 10 water changes in 6 years with a refugium.

From my short few months on this site, the main take away for me has been lots of clean water for many reasons, the main being to decrease biomass. (And my fish are definitely doing better with large daily wc's.) Also if you want to do a planted tank you need adult fish with a proper bioload balance - discus'ing at the expert level. My understanding of a refugium is that it is essentially a way to decrease nitrates. But what about all the other dissolved organic solids creating a biomass? What am I missing here in this video?

Thanks a lot!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yqdrtVYBQDY

[Mattgrizzlybear]

That's interesting... Must be a heck of a filtration system!

[Second Hand Pat]

I have seen that video. My take away is no discus has been in that tank for long. He is definitely not setting up new discus keepers for success.
Pat

[colloc]

Rather interesting, I too have seen this clip and researched Miracle Mud to no outcome.
I wouldn't want to cast any dispersions but snake oil comes to mind.

[colloc]

Just to add if Miracle Mud was so good how come most people aren't using it? & why isn't there more posts promoting it?
That whole clip is just one long cleverly produced advertisement, just check out the costings for the sumps compared to others.

[modealings]

Oh yea I was skeptical. I was expecting to hear something about a drip system at least. Haha he even said he has never wiped down that tank! There has to be some catch.

[Akili]

Most likely the discus were stocked up in the tank for the video.Creative and smart advertisement.

[Markv]

Refugiums work great. But the expensive mud is not needed, and just a way to monetize something that is relatively diy.

[rickztahone]

That looks like a newly set up tank. Miracle mud has merits, but nothing to this degree. I didn't watch much of the video, but someone said that this person never wiped down the tank, that is just a complete and utter lie. Go a month without cleaning your glass, see what happens. Go a year, and now think of going 6yrs without wiping it down!

[warblad79]

I hope you don't believe that because it's total BS. The sole purpose of that video is for advertising and not for successful keeping discus. Ask the long time breeder here and they'll tell you the secret

[modealings]

Well I didn't believe it but thats why I posted it here for discussion. I think it's a good example of the trap that LFS lure us beginners in to believing. If I walked into a fish store a few months ago and saw this, for sure I would've believed it. Example of a reason I'm happy I found SD to sort things like this out!

[ynot]

I wouldn't be too quick in calling the man a liar. His father bred and raised many different kinds of fish to sell to lfs and Brian (the man in the video) has been breeding and raising fish since he has been a kid. He even states in the video it takes daily large wc's to breed and raise discus. His breeder tanks and the grow out tanks in the store are all bb and spotless. I would imagine he also has a uv in the system which also helps in keeping the water clean on that display tank. I am sure he is doing some pr work on the video but wouldn't anyone if it was your lively hood. And by the look of his stock and the cleanliness of his store it looks like he does a pretty good job for being a liar.

[Markv]

I agree with ynot. His advice seems sound for raising and breeding discus. For a planted tank with adults, there's more flexibility. He has a UV to keep bacterial issues at bay, and uses the refugium to keep water quality in check. Plants consume DOC, Nitrogenous waste, and TDS. Reverse Osmosis keeps TDS creep from evaporation replenishment.

[1Cichlid1]

Ok Let me first say I have been to this store several times, and the fish in the video for the most part have stayed the same. In fact it is a display tank and the fish in the tank are not for sell. The tank has been that clear and clean every time I have visited the store. In fact all the tanks, and the shop/store are very clean. There is a refugium on that tank and for the most part all of the tanks are on an unbelievable filtration system. While I was there the last time (about 8 months ago) he had discus spawning in the tank. With all that being said, I don't know if they are doing water changes on the tank, but while I was there I asked an employee about planted discus tanks and that I heard they take a lot of work with water changes and gravel vac. He told me he had been working there almost a year and never seen anyone do a water change or vac the gravel on that tank. So, take the video for what it is worth. I have been keeping discus for about 4 years now and have always kept and spawned them in bare bottom tanks. Last fall (first of Sept. 2015) I converted a 125 gallon tank over to a planted discus tank with 6 Stendker (3 plus inch) discus. I will tell you that I potted the plants in peat moss and eco complete substrate and hide the pots with either river gravel and or drift wood. I do a daily water change of at least 80 gallons with pre treated and heated water and at least once a week I remove all the pots with the plants and drift wood and vac the entire tank. I also over filter the tank in my opion. Well over filter for most fish. I have a UV canister filter on the tank that filters about 525 gallons an hour and also two marineland emperor 400 and also a penguin 350 on that tank. My hopes are to someday try the refugium and see if it is all that they say it is.

[Second Hand Pat]

Here's the problem with this type of video. It gives folks new to discus that they can keep discus as the video portrays and it sets them up for failure.
Pat